How bad are my genes? Are my expectations too high?

[KlagDragon]

So I'm just wrapping up my 4th bagseed grow and am still somewhat disappointed in the results. Maybe I'm expecting too much but it seems like I have a really hard time getting the plants dialed in. I get lots of problems with brown spots on leaves, fan leaves dying off, etc. Overall the plants are ok, but it makes me wonder if I'm doing something wrong, or the genetics just suck, or this is just how it is. Many of the pics I see on here are of perfect looking plants that are just the right color of green and no spots or dying/dead leaves. My plants sometimes (often) show the brown spots below in the pictures. These progress and eventually the fan leaf dies and falls off. It seems to happen only to the bigger fan leaves. The smaller ones seem to do ok. I pick up, or pick off probably 4 or 5 leaves a day from each plant that are dead.

[I'm growing in FFOF/pearlite mix using FF nutes as per the schedule on their website.]

These pictures show some of what I'm talking about.

http://www.icmag.com/ic/album.php?albumid=3870&pictureid=372535

http://www.icmag.com/ic/album.php?albumid=3870&pictureid=372533

http://www.icmag.com/ic/album.php?albumid=3870&pictureid=372534

So what do you think? Am I expecting too much? Will I still have the same problems after I buy some good genetics? Does it even matter?

And, as an aside, WTF am I doing wrong posting pics. I used the tag and it just showed broken links. When I drag the pics from my album like it says to, it just pastes the url which then gets interpreted as a link, as above.

Thanks for your replies!

 

[2Lazy]

I'll go out on a limb and try to help you out. After using Fox Farms soil and nutrients myself I can assure you that the flowering recommendations are too high. Your plants look sick to me due to a phosphorus and nitrogen lockup as a result of manganese and perhaps copper toxicity in the soil.

Take a look at manganese issues online, they seem to fit very well with the pictures you show. Generally, when you have one problem you're going to have another problem. Barring the obvious things like pH imbalance and poor quality tap water the real issue here is the Fox Farms system as recommended.

Tiger Bloom contains a large number of micro-nutrients which I'm going to guess is the real problem. Cutting way back on the Tiger Bloom after week 3 of flowering would probably have a positive effect. Another option for you, if you're burned out on soil, is to try coco. I did and I'm not looking back.

Also, new genetics never hurt... There are many online options, get yourself a visa gift card and have them shipped

 

[lost in a sea]

may just be they need feeding more,,, but buying genetics is very advisable..

i suggest aventure mix by spice of life,, $50,, a selection of some of the most potent lines around,,,

 

[messn'n'gommin']

I just click on the the pic in my albums and wherever the cursor is, a thumbnail of the pic appears in the post window.

 

[Ras Mason]

Yep, get some fresh genes, it s the workhorse of all your endeavours.
peace

 

[Vegan]

looks like ya bit of lockout on those ,,idk..sure ya can buy some genetics and when ya get that grow dialed in youll be smokin,,
but dont expect spensive seeds to grow themselves,,

 

[vin marioni]

Yep, get some fresh genes, it s the workhorse of all your endeavours.
peace

very well put. did u also happen to add lime to ffof, as ive read on the threads results are much better when u do verses just rely on the oyster shells or whatever else theve done to their soil. also organics nutes like ffof(big bloom,tiger bloom) can have a low ph at time, that might be something to check. but id suggest finding out your ph n gettin new seeds, bagseed isnt worth more then one grow in ones life.

 

[dtfsux]

I wouldn't spend money on new genetics until I got those issues worked out. There is an excellent guide in the sick plant forum from Stitch, it should be stickied. It shows pictures, then tells you whats wrong.

IMO bag seeds should grow just as healthy as seeds you buy.

 

[KlagDragon]

Thanks guys/gals

Thanks guys/gals

I wouldn't spend money on new genetics until I got those issues worked out. There is an excellent guide in the sick plant forum from Stitch, it should be stickied. It shows pictures, then tells you whats wrong.

IMO bag seeds should grow just as healthy as seeds you buy.

Yeah, this was my thought as well. I've looked through Stitch's guide numerous times and can't seem to come to a conclusion. As soon as I think I know what it is, it does something different, looks sick in a different way.

I keep a pretty close handle on my ph. I water/feed with about 5.8-6.0pH filtered city water with chlorine conditioner (for fish). Out of the tap the water is about 8pH and slightly to moderately hard (no TDS meter). Even after adding nutes, the pH is still too high. I use pH down to get it where I need it. My runoff is very consistently 7.0pH. I don't know how to check the pH of the soil other than that.

I'll look into adding the lime. I still don't really understand how you can know the pH of the soil itself. Reading in the organic forum got my head spinning. Too many choices and too many different opinions.

I was wondering about underfeeding. I went too far on my last grow and pretty much fried everything from over feeding, so I've been more careful this time and followed the schedule as closely as possible, but was a little late in starting to feed (gun shy about over feeding).

I'm a little intimidated to spend money on seeds I could potentially fuck up, but I'm getting useable stuff now with what I'm doing now, it's just not perfect. I can clone now, and have a separate chamber for vegging, so I think I'm pretty much set to get this going and keep it going.

 

[2Lazy]

I'll go out on a limb and try to help you out. After
Take a look at manganese issues online, they seem to fit very well with the pictures you show.

Tiger Bloom contains a large number of micro-nutrients which I'm going to guess is the real problem. Cutting way back on the Tiger Bloom after week 3 of flowering would probably have a positive effect. Another option for you, if you're burned out on soil, is to try coco. I did and I'm not looking back.

I'm starting to wonder if I even exist...

 

[dtfsux]

wish I could help with the issue. I was never really good at ID'ing deficiencies. In hydro I just had a set formula that worked, and If I had any issues, I could easily adjust. In soil, changes take longer to take affect and I have never grown in soil

As long as you aren't killing the plants, you wont be wasting money on the good seeds. I just dont think it will help.

Post this issue in the sick plant forum

 

[johnipedestran]

if I could offer one suggestion

try a run where you ditch the Oceans Forest Soil. just use an un-adulterated medium like Pro-mix. continue to use your Fox Farm nutes. I would wager you will have better results.

i have grown using many different methods. I have only used Oceans Forest soil once.....never again

good luck and good growings

peace
jip

 

[cyber echo]

Looks like you have a nute lockout problem...

If you do not want to worry too much about pH I would go with nutes that have chelates in them.
BioCanna Vega/Flores are like that, they have a wider pH absorption spectrum.
Still if your pH is way off, you will still suffer problems.

Also, I suggest you get a root tonic like rhizotonic or superthrive to help your plant's roots out of the shock...

Genetics has nothing with what is happening to your plants mate.
Goodluck


ps: Judge genes after you smoke a well grown, well flushed, well cured bud

 

[KlagDragon]

All great ideas. Thanks guys.

 

[Aksala]

I used to have the same problem from some cheap seeds I bought online...turned out to be a major calcium def and had to really watch the ph and use like 3 times the recommended dosage of cal/mag. Still didn't completely fix it but it was alot better.

Now I make sure to mix some pullverized lime into my soil a few weeks before I transplant my clones and it makes keeping the PH up around 6.5 alot easier. Fox Farm nutes are notorious for making your ph drop really low.

Always have some PH up or PH down handy just in case but if you use the pullverized lime it doesn't take a lot of work to keep your PH at a good level.

 

[cravin morehead]

I water/feed with about 5.8-6.0pH filtered city water with chlorine conditioner (for fish).

those chlorine conditioners are made up of 'salts'. i could see how the excess salts from the conditioners could be messing with your medium and nute uptake...

just my thoughts, maybe 24 hrs of letting your tap sit out to evaporate the chlorine would be better. plus its free, just plan ahead a little...

hope that helps, good luck

cm