vitamins and bacteria

[grandmasgreenma]

i have recently started a small sciece experiment with products from health food store,just regular vitamins but what was really interesting was tha lacto bacilli,and enzymes,it seems the same things that makes humans work might also work on plant life.just started this and was wandering if anyone else has tried it.

 

[Protocol11]

Well, plants respond well to vitamin C, so testing in this field could yeild some very good results, or moderately fuck your shit up.

I'ld get the liquid pills in the gelatin capsules, empty them into a tea, drench the soil. With a different tea, go very lightly on the vits, and foliar feed with other organic nutes.

 

[Clackamas Coot]

Kelp meal and seaweed extracts have the correct levels of Vitamin C for plants.

CC

 

[mad librettist]

MJ reacts well in the short term to lactobacilli.

However I feel it is better to use them when soil is "resting", and use compost tea or slurry when growing.

No real data to back that up, but it's a common practice I don't mind passing on.

Plants don't eat vitamins.

 

[aussiesmoke420]

I'm using SuperThrive to add vitamins and hormones to my soil, I think its just B1 though.

There are definitely benefits to having microorganisms in the soil, but I wouldn't think the bacteria that have co-evolved to live in our stomach, would be as useful as the bacteria that co-evolved with plants in soil. Any worm tea, or mycorrhizae batch will give you those beneficials.

As to enzymes they keep on doing their job until they break down in a week or so. but that is only helpful if the same chemical reactions are taking place. Each enzyme has a specific chemical reaction it helps complete. For Example: Lactase is an enzyme that breaks down Lactose into its smaller components Glucose and Galactose. It will happily do that in your soil, if it is the right temp. (Ideal temp in animals and humans is probabaly 96-99 deg F)

I guess my point is some of the enzymes might end up being relevant, but I'd trust the organic gardening products to provide enzymes, and beneficial microbes that are specifically designed to help out with root development, growth, and nutrient uptake.

 

[mad librettist]

FYI, Superthrive is most definitely not an organic product.

It's a nasty synthetic hormone. Nothing natural about it.

 

[Protocol11]

MJ reacts well in the short term to lactobacilli.

And what's that?

 

[mad librettist]

And what's that?

oh, if you have lactobacillus serum or effective microbes, and you dilute it 1:1000 in water, it seems to perk up all kinds of plants real fast.

I don't know why, and I don't know if it's actually a good technique.

 

[aussiesmoke420]

I purchased some "Great White" a few days back and am starting a new crop of garden veggies that'll be planted outside in a few weeks.

My head shop guy swears by it and claims it is the best DRY microbenificial additive. It has 11 bacteria, none of which are lactobacilli, which I would still argue is an animal stomach bacteria. It has various endo and ecto mycorrhiza, and two trichoderma species are thrown in their is well.

Some info from Wikipedia

" Food production
Some Lactobacillus species are used industrially for the production of yogurt, cheese, sauerkraut, pickles, beer, wine, cider, kimchi, chocolate, and other fermented foods, as well as animal feeds, such as silage. Sourdough bread is made using a "starter culture," which is a symbiotic culture of yeast and lactic acid bacteria growing in a water and flour medium. Lactobacilli, especially L. casei and L. brevis, are some of the most common beer spoilage organisms. The species operate by lowering the pH of the fermenting substance by creating the lactic acid, neutralising it to the desired extent."

If the plants have a good use for the lactic acid produced by the bacteria this could explain the perking up when they're added, but that is just a guess.

 

[aussiesmoke420]

FYI, Superthrive is most definitely not an organic product.

It's a nasty synthetic hormone. Nothing natural about it.

Good to know. So "nasty" and synthetic... Anymore info than that?

I think I'm still going to use it. Some of my local organic growing buddies still use it. They said they've tried the alternatives and don't get the SuperThrive results. I'm open to changing my mind but unless I think the superthrive is dangerous I'll stick with it.

 

[Clackamas Coot]

The entire EM-1 industry around the world (literally) is all about applying specific lactobacillus strains to soils, as a foliar application, et al.

CC

 

[mad librettist]

Superthrive - just look on wiki. Remember agent orange from vietnam? same mode of action, same class of drug (synthetic auxin). Banned in some US states.

It has 11 bacteria, none of which are lactobacilli, which I would still argue is an animal stomach bacteria.

It's on your hands, in your gut, on every leaf, in every teaspoon of soil, in your salami, in your kimchee, in your sauerkraut, in silage, in cheese, yogurt, sourdough bread, and a million other things.

It's everywhere. It digests things. Not sure how it relates to aerobic soil organisms, but I suspect it feeds them. A bit of bokashi in a cloth bag mixed with bran and half done compost took me well over 140F.

Your head shop is ripping you off. That is their business model. All the bacteria/protozoa you need can be found in well made compost.

Ditto on what clack said, and I will add that EM consists of yeast, lactobacillus, and purple nonsulfur bacteria, plus whatever else your local variation has.

 

[aussiesmoke420]

Looked up that EM stuff and I see what you're saying now. The lactobaccilli help facilitate the healthy ecosystem that allows the other beneficials to do their jobs, is what I got from the pages I read.

As to my Hydro shop they've been really helpful and I don't have a compost pile and I just started a worm bin and I wanted some beneficials today not this fall. Also my wife might have to take over a month of this grow and I wasn't going to ask her to brew up EWC teas and what not. I'd rather ask her to add two scoops of this 10 mls of that and water it in. I'm using Roots Organics, BG, Trinity, and Extreme Serene, in FFOF, with the Great White. It was a little expensive, but will last me long enough to get a nice compost going at my Dad's farm in the Valley. We're also planning on using the extra worms our bins produce to start a larger scale vermicompost to make some primo EWC. but that's for the future.

 

[mad librettist]

sounds reasonable enough.

fyi, worms and bokashi go well together.