Dropping the Nitrogen in Flower

[CranAppleGemz]

Ive seen a lot of people using floranova bloom and other 1 part nutrients. ease of use seems to be the biggest reason.

My quesrtions are: how would u go about dropping nitrogen with a 1-part?

also, Considering u can drop the nitrogen...what exactly are the negative effects of not dropping nitrogen during the flowering stage??

 

[supermanlives]

fine tuning your nutes. thats why i switched to ej.0-3-1 bloom and meta k 0-0-10. other ferts all you can do is change the amount not the ratios. i only use nitrogen for first 2 weeks of flower. lower amounts of nitrogen for me has reduced stretch. made more dense buds. with less leaves and possibly decreased my flower times. good luck its all about learning what your strain wants.

 

[Guywithoutajeep]

Yeah I work in the opposite way. I like longer flower times and a full nutrient regimen. Since I'm limited to 3 flowering plants at a time I prefer larger plants (mine are at 4 ft and I'm on day 21) and typically require a decent amount of everything. My nutrient feeding schedule steadily increases until week 8. That's when I'm cutting my base (base= H&G Coco A+B NPK=10-8-10) in half and using a finishing product called Shooting Powder in my application. Its just some simple P and K powder.

Different strokes...

 

[Talonted]

I use Bio grow in my flower feed, week 1 i'll put say 4ml's in and only then 2mls up untill week 4-5. You dont wat to cut something its been getting, right off when its trying to switch over to flower as its the most stressfull time. once you kick in the bulkening formulas like KoolBloom, quit the grow food.]

Flower schedual
grow-bloom-grozyme-carbo load- big bud-kool bloom-
week 1 8ml 8ml 8ml 4ml 2g
week 2 4ml 12m 8ml 4ml 2g
week 3 3ml 14ml 8ml 4ml 2g
week 4 3ml 16m 8ml 4ml 2g
week 5 2ml 16ml 8ml 4ml 1.0g
week 6 18ml 8ml 4ml 1.5g
week 7 20ml 8ml 4ml 1.5g
week 8 rinse with fresh water for entire 8th week

 

[Talonted]

Sorry the wk 6 and wk 7 18ml and 20 ml measurments are for the Bloom, not the grow, it wont let me space em out right.

 

[Guywithoutajeep]

I use Bio grow in my flower feed, week 1 i'll put say 4ml's in and only then 2mls up untill week 4-5. You dont wat to cut something its been getting, right off when its trying to switch over to flower as its the most stressfull time. once you kick in the bulkening formulas like KoolBloom, quit the grow food.]

Flower schedual
grow-bloom-grozyme-carbo load- big bud-kool bloom-
week 1 8ml 8ml 8ml 4ml 2g
week 2 4ml 12m 8ml 4ml 2g
week 3 3ml 14ml 8ml 4ml 2g
week 4 3ml 16m 8ml 4ml 2g
week 5 2ml 16ml 8ml 4ml 1.0g
week 6 18ml 8ml 4ml 1.5g
week 7 20ml 8ml 4ml 1.5g
week 8 rinse with fresh water for entire 8th week

Nice work man. I like what your doing here. Do you have any pics of your final product?

 

[Guest 18340]

Ive seen a lot of people using floranova bloom and other 1 part nutrients. ease of use seems to be the biggest reason.

My quesrtions are: how would u go about dropping nitrogen with a 1-part?

also, Considering u can drop the nitrogen...what exactly are the negative effects of not dropping nitrogen during the flowering stage??

I use Maxibloom, a 1 part, and it use full strength (1 tsp/gal) from day 1 of flower untill I see full on cloudy trich's. Then I cut off nutes all together and give plain tap for until the leaves yellow up and the trichs are now 50/50 cloudy/amber. Which usually takes 10-14 days.
Imo, stretch is more strain dependent than anything else. For example, my current 3x6 table has 9 C99 on one aside and 9 Shits (Mr.Nice) on the other. Both flowered at the same height, bith fed the same Maxibloom mix at the same time from the same rez. The Cindy is 3x taller than the Shits.
Mind you, thats just my opinion from my observation of what happens in my growroom. Your results may vary
*EDIT*
I also use Maxibloom for veg, 3/4 tsp/gal. So I simply up the dosage to a full tsp/gal come day one of 12/12.

 

[B. Friendly]

I am on the fence. I used GH's FloraMicro&Bloom with no Grow this time. I am thinkin that you need some FloraGrow because it kinda messed with my nutrients this round, had more deficiencies and ugly leaves.
Did this on 2 dif rooms and had similare results in each.
Think I am use GH's website recommendations.

 

[CranAppleGemz]

thanx for the answers everyone...i really appreciate it

 

[rmccinc719]

i use gh flora series with some additives. and run grow for the first 2 weeks of flower and then cut it out. the micro has enough nitrogen in it to get most strains threw flower but iv'e found a few strains need another week or so of grow.this is were i think it's more important to find what your ladies like to feed on and adjust to what they like.

 

[RugerBaby]

I use Maxibloom, a 1 part, and it use full strength (1 tsp/gal) from day 1 of flower untill I see full on cloudy trich's. Then I cut off nutes all together and give plain tap for until the leaves yellow up and the trichs are now 50/50 cloudy/amber. Which usually takes 10-14 days.
Imo, stretch is more strain dependent than anything else. For example, my current 3x6 table has 9 C99 on one aside and 9 Shits (Mr.Nice) on the other. Both flowered at the same height, bith fed the same Maxibloom mix at the same time from the same rez. The Cindy is 3x taller than the Shits.
Mind you, thats just my opinion from my observation of what happens in my growroom. Your results may vary
*EDIT*
I also use Maxibloom for veg, 3/4 tsp/gal. So I simply up the dosage to a full tsp/gal come day one of 12/12.

Im running Floranova Bloom with coco and plan on flushing just like you stated above. Any pics of the final product Evlme?

 

[ambertrich]

I went with the CNS-17 Coco line this time, Grow, Bloom and Ripe.

And as a couple of others have said, I like to run the Grow formula for 10-14 days at the beginning of 12/12. Then use Bloom till I want to cut the nitrogen back and go to the Ripe.

Not sure how about the Ripe yet, because using the Grow for the first couple weeks of 12/12 works for most strains I think the Ripe is not necessary for these. But I can see the benefit for those strains that tend to get a little N def late in flower.

Just about to cut this round in a few days and will be able to tell a bit better how much if any the help the Ripe was.

I do like the simplicity of the CNS line. I have a bit of this and a bit of that still hanging around so I need to use the FloraNova I have before it gets old, and still have plenty of the good old Flora series - using the Lucas ratio.

 

[Guest 18340]

Im running Floranova Bloom with coco and plan on flushing just like you stated above. Any pics of the final product Evlme?

Final product from my last harvest is all gone. But if you look here http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=151012 you can see the progress of my last grow from beginning to end. I updated with pics everyday.

 

[RugerBaby]

Final product from my last harvest is all gone. But if you look here http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=151012 you can see the progress of my last grow from beginning to end. I updated with pics everyday.

awesome, thanks!!

 

[one Q]

Lucas FloraM&B

still dialing it in but Micro goes from 8 to 6 the next res maintenance after stretch has stopped. Then from 6 to 4 when I notice "accelerated flowering" The whole time keeping the Bloom @ 16, and maybe adding 5-7ml of KB.

This is not WEEK dependent, but PLANT dependent. Then a pretty standard flush.

If anyone has advice for me, Im open. Sometimes I wonder if too little N will effect yeild, but they never yellow with this.

 

[PetFlora]

From what I 've learned, you need more N than you think, and a lot less P

 

[candypurp]

One Part fertilizers and lowered nitrogen in flowering

One Part fertilizers and lowered nitrogen in flowering

Careful with one parts. I decided to switch from a three part last year and I did a shitload of research. Called all the companies and talked to reps and this is what I came up with. Most of them don't have all of the essential nutrients. Botanicare makes cns17 which claims to have them all but they won't release the concentrations of most of the nutrients which is bullshit IMO. And they add iodine to their formula......... It has been shown that iodine can be absorbed passively when it is present in the soil but there is very little evidence if any that it is beneficial. It is very hard to get all of the essentials into one formula because they interact with eachother and the shit becomes unusable. Flora Nova only has 12 of the 16 essential nutrients. Oneness from Humboldt nutes has only 10 of the 16. flairform has 10 or 11. Dyna gro has the only one parts that I am aware of that have all 16 and actually show it right on the bottle. I figure it would be beneficial for CNS17 to show that on the bottle and the fact that they don't makes me concerned that they might have something to hide. You also gotta look at how concentrated the formulas are because you don't want to be paying for water. FloraNova is concentrated, Dyna Gro is concentrated, Oneness is pretty concentrated, but again, Dyna is the only one of the three that is both concentrated and complete. cns17 is half the concentration, and ONE from dutch masters is an absolute joke. I think the N-P-K is like 2 - 0.2 - 1.5. Assuming there is another 1 percent or so of micro nutes, we're talking 95% water. Flairform makes green dream and not only is it weakly concentrated, it is incomplete and it is a mineral suspension, not a mineral solution. Solution means the solids are dissolved, suspension means they are..... suspended, in the solution, in an undissolved form. If you look at flair form it seperates in the bottle. You have liquid on top and solids on the bottom. Pretty shitty in my opinion. Just undissolved minerals in some water shipped over here from australia. Then weve got pure blend pro from botanicare. It has either 10 or 12 of the 16 essentials and it is also weakly concentrated. IMO dyna gro is the best buy because its cheap, complete, and definitely the most concentrated and I have been doing extremely well with it. Better than I did with 2 or 3 parts even.


I know your original question was about dropping nitrogen in flower. Dyna Gro's bloom formula is 3-12-6 so it is quite low in nitrogen. And its low in ammoniacal nitrogen which prevents stretching. You can also use it as a 2 part if you really want to mess with the ratios for some reason but I don't find that to be necessary.My girls are looking awesome without any adjustments, just Grow for Veg and Bloom for Flowering.

As far as why it is bad to leave the N levels high, it comes down to a couple things. Firstly, it is thought that dropping N and increasing P will help the plant switch from veg to flower growth. It is also thought that this drop will increase the number of flower sites and decrease flowering time. In addition, it is believed that having higher levels of N during flowering can promote excess foliage production resulting in leafy buds. I strongly believe that this particular claim has validity to it. I have found in my own grows that high levels of N during flowering have resulted in leafier buds. Nitrogen is also very key in stem growth so high N levels can lead to stretching.

I often hear people say "well in nature, the soil doesn't change when the plant starts flowering."

You are basically correct but the most important factors are time, and the sun. Current indoor grow light technology, while it can produce very impressive cannabis, simply cant compare with the intensity of the sun, and, most importantly, the spectrum of the sun. In nature, the plants follow a natural progression from veg to bloom, (again, in nature meaning cannabis growing in the wild), and the only time frame they are on is the natural grow season which they have evolved into. So, they really don't need a big push to switch to flowering. Their light source is WAY more intense and they have evolved to grow at a certain pace to match their environment, not to maximize yield of sensimilla bud. They flower in order to reproduce and make seeds for gods sake. We are manipulating them in oder to create seed free bud.



growers who give plants high P fertilizer when growing outdoors in the sun are also countering the effects of the N in the soil by almost tricking the plant into ignoring the N because there is so much P.

Growing indoors, we are taking plants that has evolved to grow in a specific environment with intense sunlight and forcing them to live in poorly recreated environments with inferior lighting and we are demanding that they grow quickly and produce copious amounts of resinous buds in the shortest time possible.

Therefore, we drop the N and raise the P in an attempt to help the plants accomplish this.

 

[obey]

Careful with one parts. I decided to switch from a three part last year and I did a shitload of research. Called all the companies and talked to reps and this is what I came up with. Most of them don't have all of the essential nutrients. Botanicare makes cns17 which claims to have them all but they won't release the concentrations of most of the nutrients which is bullshit IMO. And they add iodine to their formula......... It has been shown that iodine can be absorbed passively when it is present in the soil but there is very little evidence if any that it is beneficial. It is very hard to get all of the essentials into one formula because they interact with eachother and the shit becomes unusable. Flora Nova only has 12 of the 16 essential nutrients. Oneness from Humboldt nutes has only 10 of the 16. flairform has 10 or 11. Dyna gro has the only one parts that I am aware of that have all 16 and actually show it right on the bottle. I figure it would be beneficial for CNS17 to show that on the bottle and the fact that they don't makes me concerned that they might have something to hide. You also gotta look at how concentrated the formulas are because you don't want to be paying for water. FloraNova is concentrated, Dyna Gro is concentrated, Oneness is pretty concentrated, but again, Dyna is the only one of the three that is both concentrated and complete. cns17 is half the concentration, and ONE from dutch masters is an absolute joke. I think the N-P-K is like 2 - 0.2 - 1.5. Assuming there is another 1 percent or so of micro nutes, we're talking 95% water. Flairform makes green dream and not only is it weakly concentrated, it is incomplete and it is a mineral suspension, not a mineral solution. Solution means the solids are dissolved, suspension means they are..... suspended, in the solution, in an undissolved form. If you look at flair form it seperates in the bottle. You have liquid on top and solids on the bottom. Pretty shitty in my opinion. Just undissolved minerals in some water shipped over here from australia. Then weve got pure blend pro from botanicare. It has either 10 or 12 of the 16 essentials and it is also weakly concentrated. IMO dyna gro is the best buy because its cheap, complete, and definitely the most concentrated and I have been doing extremely well with it. Better than I did with 2 or 3 parts even.


I know your original question was about dropping nitrogen in flower. Dyna Gro's bloom formula is 3-12-6 so it is quite low in nitrogen. And its low in ammoniacal nitrogen which prevents stretching. You can also use it as a 2 part if you really want to mess with the ratios for some reason but I don't find that to be necessary.My girls are looking awesome without any adjustments, just Grow for Veg and Bloom for Flowering.

As far as why it is bad to leave the N levels high, it comes down to a couple things. Firstly, it is thought that dropping N and increasing P will help the plant switch from veg to flower growth. It is also thought that this drop will increase the number of flower sites and decrease flowering time. In addition, it is believed that having higher levels of N during flowering can promote excess foliage production resulting in leafy buds. I strongly believe that this particular claim has validity to it. I have found in my own grows that high levels of N during flowering have resulted in leafier buds. Nitrogen is also very key in stem growth so high N levels can lead to stretching.

I often hear people say "well in nature, the soil doesn't change when the plant starts flowering."

You are basically correct but the most important factors are time, and the sun. Current indoor grow light technology, while it can produce very impressive cannabis, simply cant compare with the intensity of the sun, and, most importantly, the spectrum of the sun. In nature, the plants follow a natural progression from veg to bloom, (again, in nature meaning cannabis growing in the wild), and the only time frame they are on is the natural grow season which they have evolved into. So, they really don't need a big push to switch to flowering. Their light source is WAY more intense and they have evolved to grow at a certain pace to match their environment, not to maximize yield of sensimilla bud. They flower in order to reproduce and make seeds for gods sake. We are manipulating them in oder to create seed free bud.



growers who give plants high P fertilizer when growing outdoors in the sun are also countering the effects of the N in the soil by almost tricking the plant into ignoring the N because there is so much P.

Growing indoors, we are taking plants that has evolved to grow in a specific environment with intense sunlight and forcing them to live in poorly recreated environments with inferior lighting and we are demanding that they grow quickly and produce copious amounts of resinous buds in the shortest time possible.

Therefore, we drop the N and raise the P in an attempt to help the plants accomplish this.

Wow thatsa lotta info..

 

[one Q]

candypurp... that was awesome