Chronic777
Member
Why isit better to build a rootball in a small pot then transplant to a bigger pot, instead of straight away planting your seed/seedling into a big pot?
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Rootball/Transplanting?
- Thread starter Chronic777
- Start date
One reason is that the wet/dry cycle seems to aid in plant health and this is a lot harder to accomplish in a bigger pot with a tiny plant.
Another is space. 10 plants in 3" pots take up much less space than 10 plants in 10" pots. If you have a seperate veg & bloom area, the space savings can be substantial.
Yet another is feeding & nute changes. Because you'll water less frequently with a bigger pot, it's harder to use feedings to correct nutrient & pH imbalances without water logging the plant.
However, none of these reasons are deal breakers. I have started plants in the pots & planters I would finish them in and they did just fine. If it's the way you want to go and you have zero problems going that direction I say go for it.
Another is space. 10 plants in 3" pots take up much less space than 10 plants in 10" pots. If you have a seperate veg & bloom area, the space savings can be substantial.
Yet another is feeding & nute changes. Because you'll water less frequently with a bigger pot, it's harder to use feedings to correct nutrient & pH imbalances without water logging the plant.
However, none of these reasons are deal breakers. I have started plants in the pots & planters I would finish them in and they did just fine. If it's the way you want to go and you have zero problems going that direction I say go for it.
Another reason is that you better utilize your soil. Roots grow in a stait line until they reach the side an botom of your container. Then they follow the side and botomm searching for more soil so that most of the roots end up on the side of your pots. the soil in between transplants is mostly void of roots and the soil is basically waisted.
Matanuskan Flo
Member
huh?? could you explain this more clearly please. are you saying that when using a small pot there is voided soil or when starting a seed in a bigger pot, there is void soil?? you start off by saying another reason, it would be nice to know what another reason is for. you may know what you are thinking, but some of us would like to know also
Chronic777
Member
My first grow i planted the riotroot cube straight into the big pot after the seedling sprouted, but as you pointed out, it means much less watering, harder to read when to water etc... plus i like getting run off, its reassuring, so this time im gonna go for the small pots first, having to do the transplant adds a bit of adventure about it aswell 
Was just wondering if there was any reasons like accelerated root growth or something
Was just wondering if there was any reasons like accelerated root growth or something
Sometimes I do both. I gave away some of my gallon containers. I'm lite.
I would like to know if people break up the root ball a bit when transplanting. I know I do this in the yard with plants from the nursery, but I am concerned that it could stress my pot plant mang.
What about poking holes in the root ball to give the roots more oxygen?
I would like to know if people break up the root ball a bit when transplanting. I know I do this in the yard with plants from the nursery, but I am concerned that it could stress my pot plant mang.
What about poking holes in the root ball to give the roots more oxygen?
Tube dude says it right. The roots grow sideways first, then hit the side and turn down. A small plant in a big pot will send roots down to the bottom first without 'exploring' any of the soilmix above. Those few roots at the bottom are now prone to waterlogging and lack of oxygen. I would estimate that about 50% of the problems I see people having with soilmix/container culture originate with a mismatched pot to plant ratio and the watering problems that result. Repotting plants makes them grow faster, and faster, and faster. A small plant in a big pot won't grow as fast as a plant repotted many times. Of course, that assumes your technique is good enough that there is no shock and you can put the plants directly back under the light with no delay. If you're able to get the rootball out in one piece (no holes or ripping the ball) the plant will grow as if nothing happened.
Chronic777
Member
Sounds good to me
My newly sprouted seedling cubes are gonna go into their baby pots tonight & get put under the big light when i get home from work, i love it
Then one last transplant in a couple weeks into the big pots....
Matanuskan Flo
Member
eh-hem, im sorry, but, YOU said it right. small plant in big pot sending roots to bottom is the clarification i needed.
so, Mr. Greengenes, - how do you feel about placing a seed into a small diameter container that is very tall, or say 3x as tall as the container is wide?? will the roots still just grow str8 down before veining outward?? i do not notice any roots below at all until around week 3-4 of veg. perhaps, this is still too early though.
i bet clones would be more ideal than seed for the containers i speak of. thanks again for clarifying things for me above.
They use those tall thin containers around here (SoCal) to sell citrus trees, right about this time of year. They're about 4"X4"X24"tall. In my experience, citrus in these tall thin containers root into their holes much faster than ones in larger 3g containers. Not sure what you could conclude from that MF, just thought I'd mention it in case you can use it. Also, I'm quite certain that most of the time, roots grow sideways first, then go down after they hit the walls, not the reverse. That said, there are exceptions. Some plants have the genes for a strong taproot at germination which does in fact grow straight down first, but I'm not even sure that trait carries over to clones (of those seedlings) or not.
its all about space. outdoors plants dont repot themselves. you can fit more smaller containers indoors. then repot the best.
B
bcell
I believe growing in smaller pots slows growth - all else begin equal. Bonzai growing demands small pots and root pruning.
I always germinate in a jiffy 7 peat pellet, but have observed big differences transplanting to 1 gallon pots vs 3 gallon pots in soil early in veg. Plant height and growth rate during veg is greater with the 3 gallons. A lot of experience growers recommend smaller pots to control growth rate of sativas. Makes a lot of sense in my opinion.
I always plant to 5 gallons after showing sex when majority of stretch has occurred. I have not observed a major difference - differences are negligible going from 1 to 5 or 3 to 5 after sexing in my setup.
I always germinate in a jiffy 7 peat pellet, but have observed big differences transplanting to 1 gallon pots vs 3 gallon pots in soil early in veg. Plant height and growth rate during veg is greater with the 3 gallons. A lot of experience growers recommend smaller pots to control growth rate of sativas. Makes a lot of sense in my opinion.
I always plant to 5 gallons after showing sex when majority of stretch has occurred. I have not observed a major difference - differences are negligible going from 1 to 5 or 3 to 5 after sexing in my setup.
Try spin-out bcell and I'll bet you'll be very surprised.
B
bcell
spin-out? Do not follow.
spin out i believe was a copper coating applied to pots. it was a waste of my time for short growing crops. it worked great for plants that were going to be in their pot a while. uncle ben was how i found about it . back in the cw days or maybe og not sure
It's a big thing (or was) with rose growers, really dropped transplant stress & pretty much eliminated root bound plants. Copper hydroxide in a paint suspension I think? Always came in a spray can. There were at few kinds of plastic pots that it wouldn't play well with.
When the root tips hit the side of the container the copper would cause the root tips to die, causing the root to branch heavily behind. You would get zero roots "wrapping" around themselves, instead a very fine branching network would develop throughout the pot as tip after tip hit the sides and then branched off further back.
As long as you were regular with watering you could get away with really ridiculously sized pots with no symptoms (that I observed personally at least) of a root bound plant. Just lining large planters with thin beaten copper sheet works fairly well too. Copper buried at garden beds edges can keep aggressive roots & suckers from spreading in most species as well.
When the root tips hit the side of the container the copper would cause the root tips to die, causing the root to branch heavily behind. You would get zero roots "wrapping" around themselves, instead a very fine branching network would develop throughout the pot as tip after tip hit the sides and then branched off further back.
As long as you were regular with watering you could get away with really ridiculously sized pots with no symptoms (that I observed personally at least) of a root bound plant. Just lining large planters with thin beaten copper sheet works fairly well too. Copper buried at garden beds edges can keep aggressive roots & suckers from spreading in most species as well.
UnkBen turned out to be the manufacturer of Spinout! He used to argue with me about incremental 'upcanning' all the time. Big pot small plant mismatches seem much less common than back in the day. More people are learning to control the feeding and watering more accurately through the rootball. Like Supermanlives says, products like Spinout are designed for nursury trees that will spend months or a year in one pot.
Cannabis likes unrestricted roots during veg. But, it also likes lots of oxygen at the roots and a smaller pot allows more roots to grow to the edge of the container sooner. If the next repot is performed just as the roots begin to form across the bottom of the ball the plant will grow as if there was no repot and gain momentum swiftly. You'll need a machete and GPS to navigate your growroom each day.
A restricted rootball during flowering allows you to control the watering and feeding more precisely. It is my personal belief that a more high quality bud can be grown this way in a similar way to champagne grapes grown on poor soils. I think it reduces the water weight and excess vegetative quality in buds and gives a product with greater concentration of flavors and carbs/sugars.
Cannabis likes unrestricted roots during veg. But, it also likes lots of oxygen at the roots and a smaller pot allows more roots to grow to the edge of the container sooner. If the next repot is performed just as the roots begin to form across the bottom of the ball the plant will grow as if there was no repot and gain momentum swiftly. You'll need a machete and GPS to navigate your growroom each day.
A restricted rootball during flowering allows you to control the watering and feeding more precisely. It is my personal belief that a more high quality bud can be grown this way in a similar way to champagne grapes grown on poor soils. I think it reduces the water weight and excess vegetative quality in buds and gives a product with greater concentration of flavors and carbs/sugars.
While we are on the subject, I'd be interested in hearing more about the difference kinds of root development you guys have seen. Do some plants devote more energy to root development than others? What signs could one look for in a soil grow to identify such plants?
Funny you should mention that gingerale. We've been talking about exactly that around here lately. We have a Godbud clone that has very 'shy' roots. It's strange because the top is quite leafy and the leaves are thick and leathery, which I often equate with ability to store nutrients, but the unaggressive root system makes this cut quite sensitive to both overwatering and overfeeding. We have another cut that is a select F2 from a cross of JackHerer and my 'White Wizard' strain called Chill Jill. CJ also has a dense canopy of thick leathery leaves, but has a much more aggressive root system than the Godbud cut. The actual bud size of the Godbud is probably larger than the CJ, but ability of the CJ to outveg the godbud probably gives it a bigger overall yield. It's a complicated issue, and we've nowhere near talked it down yet. I'm curious about other peoples experiences with root aggressiveness/growth habits, vegging speed and final yield.
Checking roots in a container is easy if you have repotting skills and can get the ball out in one piece.
Checking roots in a container is easy if you have repotting skills and can get the ball out in one piece.
The reason I got to wondering about this is, in my grow I do 12/12 from seed and use 18 oz cups to germinate and sex. After they sex I transplant. The very last plant to show its sex took forever to do so and growth had stalled out completely. When I transplanted I noted that it was rootbound as hell. After the transplant, which went very cleanly, the plant did not blast away with new growth as I expected, even though it was a very healthy and well established looking plant. Instead it seemed to lie dormant for a week, growing slowly, and only now is it picking up and really starting to branch out and flower at full speed. The plant is short and squat, compact, tightest node spacing I've ever seen. It looks like what I would imagine an Afghani hash plant to look like. (The strain is bagseed and a grab-bag mixture of genes, definitely an Indica dominant hybrid.) I just get the feeling that even though this plant was the slowest to grow, it's starting to look like the hardiest and strongest, definitely one of the top plants in the group. My guess is this plant is one that likes to grow a large root system before turning to upper plant development. I don't want to pull the plant out of its pot in the middle of flowering to look at its roots, but I'm going to re-veg it after harvest and make it a mom, then I can study its clones vs other phenos and see how the roots compare.
