Leaf Diagnosis Please have a look

[hydr1]

HPS lighting
Sunshine #4 medium (peat based, dol lime, gypsum, perlite, wetting agent)
CNS17 grow & bloom
Guardian My
Florolicious plus/liquid karma
Liquid Light/ Penetrator
3 gal container

I have 15 plants...2 diff strains (vortex, MK Ultra)

They are growing great but recently started showing a blotchy lighter green towards the tips and in the leaf margins. Also some slight downward curl on the very tips of the leaves.

The Mk Ultra is showing the problems more.

I have been feeding very lightly. When I feed they seem to twist and claw a little bit...Then when I water with plain r/o water they seem to flatten out.

The yellowing is my concern...its a blotchy uneven pale green color over most of the leaves.

18 hours light (vegging)

Temps: 83 day...60 night (exhaust runs during 6 hr dark cycle)
Hum: 60 day ...50 night
Res PPM: 60
Res PH: 7.0

Co2 PPM: 1200

Feeding at 800 PPM 6.0 - 6.2 twice a week
Foliar liquid light 2 times a week

 

[Snype]

Your not supplying enough information but from what you supplied here's what I can see. I don't know if you're growing from seed or clone but you have to dial in each plant individually if they are from seed or clones from different moms. You said you feed twice a week at 800 PPM but I don't believe that you are giving plain water for 2 times after you feed before you feed again. I don't understand what your resivoir is for but whatever it is it doesn't make sense to me because you said your rez is 60 PPM at 7.0 PH. 7.0 is pretty high. Also you should try to get your night temps up to at least 65 if you can. Start by flushing now for at least a good week with pH'd water then you have to figure out how much nutes all your plants want.

 

[Snype]

Also I'm not familiar with your medium at all. Is it soil based? If it's not soil you should lower your pH to 5.5. Also if your plants are in Veg, you don't need all that CO2.

 

[hydr1]

thanks snype.


The res is just my fresh water supply...an r/o filter...to a res with a float valve, airstones ect.

The r/o water comes out at 6.9-7.0 PH

The plants are clones from healthy moms.

I have only fed them three times and I have HAD to give them plain water after each feed because they seem to not be handling the nutes well.

I have lowered the Co2 PPM to 900...its a closed environment..execpt at night.

Im in a peat based soiless medium and the grower that turned me onto it (my guru) suggests lowering the PH to 5.6 and see where that takes me.

Im just worried about the blotchy light green patches on all the plants. Im getting a slight clawing downwards on the tips, and on the first two in the pic blotchy yellowing on the tips.

Ill fill outt the whole diagnosis chart right now for more info.

 

[Mr. Greengenes]

Sounds like too high concentration of nutes. Those plants aren't growing very fast, so they certainly can't use much food. Foliar feeding is probably just adding insult to injury. CO2 is probably adding another on top of that. I'd suggest getting back to basics and concentrating on good watering. I can tell you need more attention there because you don't mention it at all.

 

[hydr1]

Soiless/

How long has this problem been going on? a couple weeks. been fighting it...when i feed they show very mild clawing and blotchy light green dark green patches.
Are you growing in a PVC grow tent? (example: Hydrohut or any other non brand tents) Full room
What system are you running? (DWC? Ebb flow? Aero? Water Farm? Flood Tables? and so on...) Grow bags and soiless medium, drain to waste
What STRAIN are you growing? Vortex and Mk Ultra
What was the establishing technique? (Were the seed or clone?) Clones from healthy moms
What is the age of your plants? 1 month from roots
How long have they been in there mixture they are in now?(coco,soiless etc..) 2 weeks
How tall are the plants? 12-14 inches
What PHASE are the plants in? (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? Veg 18 hours
What Technique are you using? grow bags hand watering
What substrate/medium are you using?(Hydroton, RockWool etc.) Sunshine mix #4 (soiless: peat moss, gypsum, dol lime, perlite, wetting agent)
What is the Water temperature? 75-78
What color are your roots? White? Brown? Are your roots slimy? buried
What Nutrient's are you using?(If growing soiless) CNS17 grow
How much of each nutrient are you using with how much water? *Knowing the brand is very helpful* half dose
How often are you feeding? (If using soiless) twice a week
How often are you giving nutrients? (If using soiless)
If flowering, when did you switch over to using Bloom nutrients?
What order are you mixing your nutrients? (example: veg nutes 1st, bloom 2nd ect) water...veg nutes...water... PH
What is the TDS/EC/PPM you are using? 700 PPM
What is the pH of the "Tank"? feed at 6.0-6.2
Are you sure your calibration is correct on your equiptment? yes calibrated and check ..stored in solution ect.
When was your last watering? Last night 400ML plain R/o at 6.0 PH
What is your water temps? 75-78 F
When was your last feeding change? (ie. grow-bloom-micro-additional) 2 weeks ago
How often do you clean your system: example: Flush out water replace with clean water and nutrients? I have done a mild flush once...and they liked it
What size bulb are you using? dual 600s
What is the distance to the canopy? 3 ft atm
What is your RH Factor(Relative Humidity)? 60 day-50 night
What is the canopy temperature? 84 day - 60-65 night
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include flucutaion range) 20 degree fluctuation
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.) sealed room with co2...at night I run 6" exhaust fan for two hours on one hour off two hours on
Tell us about your ventilation, intake exhaust and when its running and not running ? ^
Is the fan blowing directly at plants? light occilating fans..gently ruffling leaves once in a while...not too much
Is your water HARD or SOFT? hard
What water are you using? Reverse Osmosis (RO)? Tap? Stealth 100 R/o system
Are you using water from a water softener? no
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned off of or pinched
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so, What and When?
Are plant's infected with pest's Sprayed once with spinosad for thripes...not a big problem, just maintenence...I shut off the lights when I sprayed.

 

[hydr1]

Sounds like too high concentration of nutes. Those plants aren't growing very fast, so they certainly can't use much food. Foliar feeding is probably just adding insult to injury. CO2 is probably adding another on top of that. I'd suggest getting back to basics and concentrating on good watering. I can tell you need more attention there because you don't mention it at all.

They are growing very well actually. Ill post a before and after pic right after this. I agree maybee too much nutes..though I have been feeding them 10-15 ml per gallon and thats half suggested amounts...I also topped them with a cup of EWC and there are mild nutes in the sunshine mix. I def notcie that they like it when I water plain water and I have been doing that...almost a mild flush after everytime i feed because they react so harshly to the feed.

I was recomended to use the liquid light because it will help with exchange and photosynthisis...its not a nutrient foliar. just enzymes.

I have cut out the foliar as I have had similar advice...raised the lights, lowered the co2 to 900...Ill drop it down to 500 when I get home.

Im a organic soil grower...this is my second round of soiless...Im afraid they wont get enough nutes so I been feeding...but I know in the back of my mind that they want plain water and grow best with that everytime I water.

Should I be adding calmag to my plain r/o water when I water them? should I ph the water also?

 

[hydr1]

This is one week of growth

 

[Snype]

I have my plants pH'd to 5.2. Go to 5.5. I have still have no idea why your rez is at 7.0 when you were feeding at 6.2. Also feed at a quarter strength after a good week of flushing. You're feeding 800 PPM's at a week old? My plants are almost 8 weeks old and I'm only feeding 500 PPM at 5.5pH.

 

[hydr1]

Jan 31st

• Transplanted rooted/vegged clones into Sunshine mix--3 gal grow bags--
• Starting water in res: 7.0 PH 50 PPM 75 F
• 1ml per gal CNS17 grow, 1ml per gal Cal Mag, 1ml per gal Liquid Karma,1ml per gal Vitabim B-1
• Feed/water------6.0 PH , 600 PPM 900ml soak per plant
• Enviro-------------50% Hum, 1000 PPM Co2, 75 F
• 18 hour lighting

Feb 1

The girls are looking green and happy. Last night I topped each bag with one cup of fresh pure earth worm castings. Enoculated them with Guardian MY 10ml /40 ml r/o per plant.

• Starting water in res: 7.0 PH- 50 PPM- 80 F
• enoculant at 6.0 ...no PH adjustment- 78 F
• Enviro-------------50% Hum, 1000 PPM Co2, 75 F
• 18 hour lighting

Feb 5
Temps: 83 day...60 night
Hum: 60 day ...50 night
Res PPM: 60
Res PH: 7.0

Co2 PPM: 1200

Well I thought my girls were hungrey but I think the light green was just from the switch in lights, transplant and one night of cold.

Anyways...I fed them again and the tips started to claw a bit (too much N)

So I came with a soak of plain water 6.2 Ph,1000 ML per plant. They look really good though. I also raised the humidity up ten percent during the light c ycle and it helped alot opening up the stomata and getting some transpiration...so Im running the humidifier and the dehumid is set to kick on if it climbs to 70 % --50% in the dark.


Feb 9 ----One week 2 days veg

Temps: 84 day...65 night
Hum: 70 day ...50 night
Res PPM: 60
Res PH: 7.0

Co2 PPM: 1200

Went out of town for three days. Came back to very happy plants. It feels good knowing they do better when I let them be.

The higher Humidity during lights on seems to be helping ALOT! I fed them all at 15ml per gallon CNS17 grow. It came out at 6.0 exactly so I didnt adjust it.
Also gave them another blast of liquid light and penetrator.

The Vortex

MK Ultra

Nitrogen, a 6 hrs dark cycle and HPS lights usually show me this new green ...

Platinum Bubba

Og ( recovering from the issue in mom...growing and wanting food)

Seeds (church ,delerium, chocalope, white berry)

Clones in sunshine (La Con, Og, Vortex, Mk Ultra)

__________________

 

[hydr1]

I have my plants pH'd to 5.2. Go to 5.5. I have still have no idea why your rez is at 7.0 when you were feeding at 6.2. Also feed at a quarter strength after a good week of flushing. You're feeding 800 PPM's at a week old? My plants are almost 8 weeks old and I'm only feeding 500 PPM at 5.5pH.

the water comes out of the r/o filter at 7.0

is this normal?

with nothing added to it...its 6.9-7.0 PH
I then pour that water into a 5 gallon bucket and mix my nutes....I will have the res filled with nutes and running through the driplines(see pics) when they are going to start flowering

Sorry I have never looked at PPM in my life! Im an organics bat shit brewer hahah...Im a total bottle nute newb. Thanks for the help....Ill water with plain water for a week straight.

Should I add cal mag to the water? should I PH the plain water?

 

[Snype]

You're asking questions that should be common sense to you. Don't make it so complicated. Just plain ph'd 5.5 water. When you give the nutes give it at a quarter strength. Your plants are tiny. I think you're over thinking it in your head. I do that sometimes. My pH/TDS monitor just broke and I only had it a month. Back to the store now again to blow another $200. Take your water from what ever source you have it from (tap, RO, etc.) and add pH down. All plants are different and want different amount of nutes. They will tell you. Listen to them.

 

[hydr1]

You're asking questions that should be common sense to you. Don't make it so complicated. Just plain ph'd 5.5 water. When you give the nutes give it at a quarter strength. Your plants are tiny. I think you're over thinking it in your head. I do that sometimes. My pH/TDS monitor just broke and I only had it a month. Back to the store now again to blow another $200. Take your water from what ever source you have it from (tap, RO, etc.) and add pH down.

I appreciate your help alot.....the reason Im overthinking is.

I have had some very tough times this last month with my plants....a room of 60 plants that were in soil...so i gave them 6.5 bottled nutes.

well after the FFOF ran out of acidic food...the plants got lockout from the PH being too high and I fried a huge crop 30 purple kush, 5 green crack, a couple vortex, couple mk ultra, 10 diesel.

...if you blew that kind of grow (4 foot plants) you would be a bit sketch I assume.

I know they want diff diets...the Mk Ultra is showing this the most...it wants cal real bad. and doesnt like the nutes as much.



So now I want to play it safe. I have never had problems and had to flush...or ran soiless...so I dont know somethings. I really appreciate your help. seriously.


so just plain 5.5 water..gotcha...Ill PM you in a week. If you have any other thoughts Im open to any and all. Thanks again!

 

[Snype]

All good I know how it is. The plant in the back left corner I give 800 PPM, all the others i'm giving 500 PPM and that plant is huge.

 

[hydr1]

cool...can you offer some PPM ranges. I have no idea what Im doing here...all i know is above 1300 is too high lol

rooted clones

first 2 weeks of veg

next 2 weeks of veg

first 2 weeks of flower

next 6 weeks of flower

 

[Snype]

cool...can you offer some PPM ranges. I have no idea what Im doing here...all i know is above 1300 is too high lol

rooted clones

first 2 weeks of veg

next 2 weeks of veg

first 2 weeks of flower

next 6 weeks of flower

No one can really tell you what PPM to use because it depends on your plants and enviroment. This is what I can tell you though. Grow strains that you're planning to stick with for a long while and you will learn what they like. From the point that your plants are at now, start at around 500 PPMs after your flush. Then give it 100-175 PPMs more every 7-10 days and when you see a slight burn on the leaf tips then you know to keep it under that. Also some plants are more sensitive to nutes and pH swings than others. Most of my plants in hydro like it at 5.5-5.6 but some of them need it to be lower.

 

[hydr1]

Thanks alot snype...Ill water plain water for 5 days at 5.5 and Ill get back to ya.

 

[CovertCrops]

What is the temp of your root zone? I noticed that your plants sit directly on a concrete floor, cold roots cannot absorb nutrients properly. This can result in deficency symptoms similar to yours. Your root zone temp should be 65-70f. Try lifting them up a few inches off the floor.

 

[hydr1]

What is the temp of your root zone? I noticed that your plants sit directly on a concrete floor, cold roots cannot absorb nutrients properly. This can result in deficency symptoms similar to yours. Your root zone temp should be 65-70f. Try lifting them up a few inches off the floor.

I have thought about that...I havent checked them though. I dont know how I would. I suppose I should just lift them either way to avoid trouble.

Ill lay down a piece of plywood untill I can get trays for all of them. Thank you