AB 390 fails

[Mr Celsius]

Well I'm happy, most of you aren't. I don't agree with the reasons for it failing in this article, but I've expressed why in other posts.

Sorry guys, maybe if they structure it better in the future, it'll happen.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/bill-to-legalize-marijuana-is-up-in-smoke-81751932.html

 

[Muleskinner]

why couldn't they just make a tax of 5% or something? $50 per ounce is ridiculous.

once real legalization happens and cannabis takes its place in California's Central Valley with the other vegetables, you have to think the price of outdoor will drop to $25 per ounce or less. $50 per ounce is enough tax to maintain a black market.

 

[humble1]

and people think that the initiatives will pass. hah!
the will of the people is not there yet.

 

[Hash Zeppelin]

^ it wont drop that low because you can produce high quality weed fro that cheap. maybe out door shwag will stay that price, but good organic cali out door will still go for at least 250 a zone.

It's ok there is a vote coming up in november. just leave it to the people.

plus you can grow as much as you want in cali now if you have a med card. It has been ruled in multiple high courts that the plant limit was not constitutional.

 

[Mr Celsius]

plus you can grow as much as you want in cali now if you have a med card. It has been ruled in multiple high courts that the plant limit was not constitutional.

Please cite precedence.

I'm very interested.

 

[theJointedOne]

Well its back to the medical and sacramental use. Which is what I would have always done but not everybody fits in that shoe.

Also agree with poster above in that the will of the people os NOT there.

 

[Pythagllio]

So Mr. Celsius, how does it feel to be in bed with religios zealots, law enforcement, and other various nutcakes? Deny it all you like, those are your allies and friends.

 

[Mr Celsius]

So Mr. Celsius, how does it feel to be in bed with religios zealots, law enforcement, and other various nutcakes? Deny it all you like, those are your allies and friends.

LOL, nice try at attempting to make me look bad. I don't really care what a scrub like you thinks of me.

I'm perfectly fine with my MMJ so I don't think I'm "in bed" with religious zealots, law enforcement and various other nutcakes, as you would put it.

Do they want a very particular thing to fail, just like me? Yes, are they my allies or friends? No. I think you will find that there are a large number of growers/smokers who are anti these bills, so I guess they are in the same boat as me. I guess I'll smoke one with them... you're not invited.

 

[karmical]

Well I'm happy, most of you aren't. I don't agree with the reasons for it failing in this article, but I've expressed why in other posts.

yours is the first opposed view that actually makes any amount of sense actually.

 

[rasputin]

That's an unnecessary and harsh stretch, Pythagllio.

I fail to see the logic, especially in light of reading the bill to see for myself its relative merits & flaws. Would you care to explain?

$50/oz tax is terrible as well as the 25 sq ft limit for personal use. with initiatives & discussions of legalization becoming more common it seems many hurdles will crop up in regards to establishing definitive guidelines for both commercial & personal use.

one of my chief concerns, whether right or wrong remains to be seen, is that given the vast amount of potential revenue at stake if big business can manage, as they often do, to grab a foothold in the potential industry legalization would bring into the "real" economy then what is to stop them from using hijacked politicians to tilt the policies & laws into their favor as they so often have done?

just to bring it out into discussion, a guy i know recently tried telling me and a few friends as we were debating the merits of legalization that it would be akin to tobacco & alcohol, a big variety conveniently available and at relatively cheap prices.

my counter to that was twofold; first, tobacco products are infamously full of a bunch of shit you dont want to be smoking so I already would question quality, as far as cheap prices maybe so but is it hard to imagine what the line-up of available bud would look like? what is the Pabst Blue Ribbon and what is the Johnny Walker red label and how are prices established for them respectively? Methinks as silly as black market prices are nowadays they'll get worse and what is now typical/average quality will likely suffer IMHO.

Either way, I certainly wish there is some remedy on the horizon that will allow us all to grow this beautiful plant in peace.

 

[Mr Celsius]

That's an unnecessary and harsh stretch, Pythagllio.

I fail to see the logic, especially in light of reading the bill to see for myself its relative merits & flaws. Would you care to explain?

$50/oz tax is terrible as well as the 25 sq ft limit for personal use. with initiatives & discussions of legalization becoming more common it seems many hurdles will crop up in regards to establishing definitive guidelines for both commercial & personal use.

one of my chief concerns, whether right or wrong remains to be seen, is that given the vast amount of potential revenue at stake if big business can manage, as they often do, to grab a foothold in the potential industry legalization would bring into the "real" economy then what is to stop them from using hijacked politicians to tilt the policies & laws into their favor as they so often have done?

just to bring it out into discussion, a guy i know recently tried telling me and a few friends as we were debating the merits of legalization that it would be akin to tobacco & alcohol, a big variety conveniently available and at relatively cheap prices.

my counter to that was twofold; first, tobacco products are infamously full of a bunch of shit you dont want to be smoking so I already would question quality, as far as cheap prices maybe so but is it hard to imagine what the line-up of available bud would look like? what is the Pabst Blue Ribbon and what is the Johnny Walker red label and how are prices established for them respectively? Methinks as silly as black market prices are nowadays they'll get worse and what is now typical/average quality will likely suffer IMHO.

I think all of thesee subjects are a concern of ours. As I see it now, I'm opposed to legalization in the form they say. All I see is Big business and government profiting, while smalltime to self-providing growers suffering. I see no advantages for the common man to having these bills pass.

Please list some if any of you know.

Either way, I certainly wish there is some remedy on the horizon that will allow us all to grow this beautiful plant in peace.

My friend, $100 a year for a medical license is all you need. This _state_ legalization isn't going to protect you from the Federal government so the same legal risks apply to both current MMJ and the proposed legalization.

If every person who wanted to smoke/grow weed in California had a medical card, nobody would ever have any need to push things any further, while allowing small-time growers and local small business owners to be able to provide for there friends, families and themselves while not compromising the quality of Mj.

 

[karmical]

I think all of thesee subjects are a concern of ours. As I see it now, I'm opposed to legalization in the form they say. All I see is Big business and government profiting, while smalltime to self-providing growers suffering. I see no advantages for the common man to having these bills pass.

Please list some if any of you know.



My friend, $100 a year for a medical license is all you need. This _state_ legalization isn't going to protect you from the Federal government so the same legal risks apply to both current MMJ and the proposed legalization.

If every person who wanted to smoke/grow weed in California had a medical card, nobody would ever have any need to push things any further, while allowing small-time growers and local small business owners to be able to provide for there friends, families and themselves while not compromising the quality of Mj.

what if you're not sick and do not want to abuse the mmj system, as there are healthy people believe it or not, just because many feel no issue in crossing the t's and dotting the i's just to get a card, would like a way to puff for whatever the reason.

I mean I get the whole we'll lose $$ if it get legal thing, but how is the government or big business going to come up over a state issue. I mean really big businesses get federal big business breaks that I do not think they will be so quick in giving up on a state platform.

nor is that common person who just wants to puff going to stop using their normal channels, as they are not going to be walking into Costco anytime soon and picking up mj by the pound vs their usual 1/8th.

 

[Pythagllio]

That's an unnecessary and harsh stretch, Pythagllio.

I disagree.

I fail to see the logic, especially in light of reading the bill to see for myself its relative merits & flaws. Would you care to explain?

$50/oz tax is terrible as well as the 25 sq ft limit for personal use. with initiatives & discussions of legalization becoming more common it seems many hurdles will crop up in regards to establishing definitive guidelines for both commercial & personal use.

So what's your proposed tax and space limits? I agree 25 sq ft is 'too small', but it isn't going to be carved in stone. The major advantage to growers is that no longer will probable cause be available for search warrants due to 'the smell of growing merryjewanna', or the presence of growing paraphernalia, etc. Sure, I'd have chosen 32 or 64 sq feet but be real. 25 sq ft works. To me you guys just sound like whiny babies that want what you want, and if you can't have it you want nothing. Well, that's what you get if you demand everything, now, without compromise.

one of my chief concerns, whether right or wrong remains to be seen, is that given the vast amount of potential revenue at stake if big business can manage, as they often do, to grab a foothold in the potential industry legalization would bring into the "real" economy then what is to stop them from using hijacked politicians to tilt the policies & laws into their favor as they so often have done?

just to bring it out into discussion, a guy i know recently tried telling me and a few friends as we were debating the merits of legalization that it would be akin to tobacco & alcohol, a big variety conveniently available and at relatively cheap prices.

my counter to that was twofold; first, tobacco products are infamously full of a bunch of shit you dont want to be smoking so I already would question quality, as far as cheap prices maybe so but is it hard to imagine what the line-up of available bud would look like? what is the Pabst Blue Ribbon and what is the Johnny Walker red label and how are prices established for them respectively? Methinks as silly as black market prices are nowadays they'll get worse and what is now typical/average quality will likely suffer IMHO.

Well you're going to be disappointed, assuming you're silly point of view doesn't sabotage our efforts to win our freedom. 'Big biz' is going to be involved, and frankly, there's no particular reason to fear it. THe only way that the price is going to come down is allowing access to economies of scale, precisely the thing which you somehow think is somehow undesirable. You act as if crap commercial with all manner of unknown contaminants isn't available today. No one is forced to buy tobacco with additives, there are options available. You act as if marlboros are the only tobacco, not even close to the truth.

Either way, I certainly wish there is some remedy on the horizon that will allow us all to grow this beautiful plant in peace.

There is. It's called TC2010, and will appear on the CA ballot in November. It isn't everything we want, but the compromises made are necessary to get things started, and when I was in 3rd grade, the teacher told me that 25 > 0. You do understand that with 25 sq ft being legal there's going to be no probable cause to search your home if the cop comes to your door and 'smells the odor of growing merryjewanna", right? We have to get our foot in the door, or we're going to remain out in the cold. We're not going to get our foot in the door without compromising, because we simply do not have the numbers needed to write our own ticket. There's 70 years of ingrained propaganda to overcome.

You and Mr. C. can deny it all you want. You're in bed with the prohibitionists, and they're making you their bitches.

Ballot measure is way to properly police pot
by James P. Gray
Special to The Bee
Published: Sunday, Jan. 10, 2010 - 12:00 am

<snip>As a retired Orange County judge, I've been on the front lines of the drug war for three decades, and I know from experience that the current approach is simply not working. Our marijuana policy must change in order to achieve the following goals:

• Reduce marijuana consumption by children.

• Stop or reduce the violence that accompanies the growing and distribution of marijuana.

• Stop or reduce the corruption that accompanies the growing and distribution of marijuana.

• Stop or reduce crime both by people trying to get money to purchase marijuana and by those under its influence.

• Reduce the harm to people who consume marijuana.

• Reduce the number of people we must put into our jails and prisons.

California's Initiative to Tax, Control and Regulate Cannabis – which will appear on the November ballot – will accomplish each of those goals.<snip>

http://www.sacbee.com/740/story/2449109.html

 

[Koroz]

except TC2010 won't stop the illegal growing problems we have now because of how they allow local governments to decide if they want to sell and tax it, or make it illegal to do so.

Why? Because there is ALWAYS going to be a situation where people can't grow, and since places like Ive listed 10000000x times in California (the majority of California outside of Oakland and Humbolt) won't allow sales or taxation that will still drive the economy in two places.

A) either to one of those few places that does allow sales.

or

B) underground illegal sales like we have now.

Which ever is cheaper for the user.

So I hate to say it but TC2010 isn't going to fix anything. It is still going to put people in jail, it is still going to make it a risk to a lot of Californian's who can't just go down the street to buy it and it isn't going to stop the flow of drugs from Mexico, no matter how you try and spin it with your insults and shit slinging Pyth "something" isn't always better then "nothing".

Bills are a lot harder to change once they are a law then when they aren't. Ever wonder why they sneak shit into bills they know won't pass from a vote? Think about it for more then 10 minutes with an open mind. If it was so easy to change laws we wouldn't have shit like the "rave laws" on the books now. Move to a place like NY where they had the Rockefeller laws and tell me how "Easy" it was for them to change that. It took them 36 YEARS to change that law.

 

[theJointedOne]

Rastafari grow whereever whenever ya know?

If any of you use cannabis as a sacrament for any spiritual/religious use you are fine. Grow as much as you need and smoke as much as you feel necessary.

my 2 cents

 

[entropical]

whiny babies... compromise... compromises... compromising..

You and Mr. C. can deny it all you want. You're in bed with the prohibitionists, and they're making you their bitches.

Well, its plainly observable that the only one talking about compromising with prohibitionists here is you. Quack quack..

 

[guest5703]

"I nearly lost everything - my home, my family and my reputation - as a result of taking that first puff of pot, and I have lived to regret it every day," said Allen, who resides in drug-infested Oak Park, Sacramento. "We've made it our mission to stamp out this destructive drug once and for all, and we will not relent until our work is finished."

What kind of pot was that?!?!? What a jackass!

 

[quest]

Maybe if he had kept smoking the weed and put down the crack pipe he would still have his house, family and whatever "reputation" he had to begin with.

 

[krunchbubble]

Well I'm happy, most of you aren't. I don't agree with the reasons for it failing in this article, but I've expressed why in other posts.

Sorry guys, maybe if they structure it better in the future, it'll happen.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/bill-to-legalize-marijuana-is-up-in-smoke-81751932.html

nice! a few more to go..........

 

[richyrich]

except TC2010 won't stop the illegal growing problems we have now because of how they allow local governments to decide if they want to sell and tax it, or make it illegal to do so.

That is the one point that several of us have brought up since the beginning of discussing TC2010. So, let Dick Lee have his power grab in Oakland, whatever, but ^^^ fucks it up for everyone else. Dick Lee did not need to include that in the initiative, but we know it is self-serving to him. So, the initiative sucks balls and I sure as hell do not support it. Let the local governments decide, ya right!!!!!! They will shit all over it and not let it happen for political posturing bullshit. There, I have said it again!

Ohh, how this is always conveniently left out by certain persons...