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US Court of Appeals: Hemp is Dope, Justice Says NO!

hamstring

Well-known member
Veteran
I am not up on this law but from a standpoint of maintaining/policing an illegal drug, MJ wouldn’t it be much harder for law enforcement to determine what’s MJ and what’s hemp. I am in no way saying it shouldn’t be legal but you can see where as a law enforcement standpoint it would be harder to police. We are not talking sugar vs. cocaine its not just a look a like they are very similar.

Again probably wrong but in my state it’s against the law to run around pretending to sell cocaine with sugar in your pocket on a street corner. Seems strange but it just makes policing it easier. I am not making a political statement just pointing out different aspects of why.

Also I am not sure Monsanto is controlling any decision here. If hemp were legal they would simply design the best version and sell it to every hemp farmer. This is a huge organization no way a little back yard grower scares them. No matter what the crop they would simply design the best version and stomp the shit out of everyone else. No conspiracy here in my mind just good old fashion greed.
 

Owl Mirror

Active member
Veteran
Hmm?

hemp-crop-photo.jpg

Hemp-Field_combo.jpg


http://www.hempmuseum.org/
 

pipeline

Cannabotanist
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Are you kidding, they can't let us grow hemp! We might get curious and find out the truth...
 

j6p

Member
US federal courts' hands are tied until Cannabis is removed from Schedule I. But right at the end of the article is a possible workaround for the time being ...
Indeed, the U.S. is the only industrialized nation without an established hemp crop. That means, in part, that although the U.S. market for hemp products continues to grow by double digits each year, the hemp that it takes to feed that market must be imported, often from as far away as China or from as close to home as Canada – indeed, there are farmers there cultivating the crop less than 30 miles from Monson's family farm. "I guess the next step is we'll have to take it to Congress," Hauge told the Grand Forks Herald. But, of course, the "fastest and easiest way to handle this would be for the president to order the Dept. of Justice to stand down on all actions against industrial hemp."
State level pressure to allow production of this extremely beneficial crop should continue to grow, IMHVO. And once a single license to grow 0.3% industrial hemp slips under the cracks, farmers all over the US will be howling for it :D

Uses

Hemp is used for a wide variety of purposes, including the manufacture of cordage of varying tensile strength, clothing, and nutritional products. The bast fibers can be used in 100% hemp products, but are commonly blended with other organic fibers such as flax, cotton or silk, for apparel and furnishings, most commonly at a 55%/45% hemp/cotton blend. The inner two fibers of hemp are more woody, and are more often used in non-woven items and other industrial applications, such as mulch, animal bedding and litter. The oil from the fruits ("seeds") oxidizes (commonly, though inaccurately, called "drying") to become solid on exposure to air (similar to linseed oil) and is sometimes used in the manufacture of oil-based paints, in creams as a moisturizing agent, for cooking, and in plastics. Hemp seeds have been used in bird seed mix.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-13">[14]</sup> Hempseed is also widely used as a fishing bait.

Food


Shelled hemp seeds

Hemp seeds contain all the essential amino acids and essential fatty acids necessary to maintain healthy human life.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-14">[15]</sup> The seeds can be eaten raw, ground into a meal, sprouted, made into hemp milk (akin to soy milk), prepared as tea, and used in baking. The fresh leaves can also be eaten in salads. Products range from cereals to frozen waffles, hemp tofu to nut butters. A few companies produce value added hemp seed items that include the seed oils, whole hemp grain (which is sterilized by law), hulled hemp seed (the whole seed without the mineral rich outer shell), hemp flour, hemp cake (a by-product of pressing the seed for oil) and hemp protein powder. Hemp is also used in some organic cereals, for non-dairy milk<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-15">[16]</sup> somewhat similar to soy and nut milks, and for non-dairy hemp "ice cream."<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-16">[17]</sup>
Note: Essential Fatty Acids are overlooked by many folks, but EFA's are essential for healthy skin, eyes, nerves, overall cellular integrity, and more. Hemp oil, at 3:1 omega-6:eek:mega-3 compounds, is a very good source. I take a couple tablespoons hemp oil, plus some salmon oil (omega-3), each day.

Uses Continued

Nutrition

<table style="width: 400px; text-align: center; font-size: 90%;" class="wikitable collapsible collapsed" id="collapsibleTable0"> <tbody><tr> <th colspan="2">Typical nutritional analysis of hemp nut (hulled hemp seeds)<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-18">[19]</sup></th> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Calories/100 g</th> <td>567</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Protein</th> <td>30.6</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Carbohydrate</th> <td>10.9</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Dietary fiber</th> <td>6</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Fat</th> <td>47.2</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Saturated fat</th> <td>5.2</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Palmitic 16:0</th> <td>3.4</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Stearic 18:0</th> <td>1.5</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Monounsaturated fat</th> <td>5.8</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Oleic 18:1 (Omega-9)</th> <td>5.8</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Polyunsaturated fat</th> <td>36.2</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Linoleic 18:2 (Omega-6)</th> <td>27.6</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Linolenic 18:3 (Omega-3)</th> <td>8.7</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Linolenic 18:3 (Omega-6)</th> <td>0.8</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Cholesterol</th> <td>0 mg</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Moisture</th> <td>5</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Ash</th> <td>6.6</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Vitamin A (B-Carotene)</th> <td>4 IU</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Thiamine (Vit B1)</th> <td>1 mg</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Riboflavin (Vit B2)</th> <td>1 mg</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Vitamin B6</th> <td>0 mg</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Niacin (Vit B3)</th> <td>0 mg</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Vitamin C</th> <td>1.0 mg</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Vitamin D</th> <td>0 IU</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Vitamin E</th> <td>9 IU</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Sodium</th> <td>9 mg</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Calcium</th> <td>74 mg</td> </tr> <tr style="display: none;"> <th>Iron</th> <td>4.7 mg</td> </tr> </tbody></table>​
About 30–35% of the weight of hempseed is hempseed oil or hemp oil, an edible oil that contains about 80% essential fatty acids (EFAs); i.e., linoleic acid, omega-6 (LA, 55%), alpha-linolenic acid, omega-3 (ALA, 22%), in addition to gamma-linolenic acid, omega-6 (GLA, 1–4%) and stearidonic acid, omega-3 (SDA, 0–2%). Hempseed also contains about 20% of a highly-digestible protein, where 1/3 is edestin and 2/3 are albumins. Its amino acid profile is close to "complete" when compared to more common sources of proteins such as meat, milk, eggs and soy.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-19">[20]</sup> The proportions of linoleic acid and alpha-linolenic acid in one tablespoon (15 ml) per day of hemp oil easily provides human daily requirements for EFAs. Unlike flaxseed oil, hemp oil can be used continuously without developing a deficiency or other imbalance of EFAs.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-Schwab_U_2006_20-0">[21]</sup> This has been demonstrated in a clinical study, where the daily ingestion of flaxseed oil decreased the endogenous production of GLA.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-Schwab_U_2006_20-1">[21]</sup>
Hempseed is an adequate source of calcium and iron. Whole hempseeds are also a good source of phosphorus, magnesium, zinc, copper and manganese.
Hempseed contains no gluten and therefore would not trigger symptoms of celiac disease.


Dietary supplement

Hemp oil has been shown to relieve the symptoms of eczema (atopic dermatitis).<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-21">[22]</sup>
Hemp Seed contains a large dietary supplement of omega-3, higher even than walnuts which contain 6.3% of n-3. These oils are known to improve memory and strengthen brain cells.

Medicine

Main article: Medicinal cannabis
Hemp oil has anti-inflammatory properties.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-ani-inflamatory_22-0">[23]</sup>

Fiber



Hemp stem showing fibers.

The fiber is one of the most valuable parts of the hemp plant. It is commonly called bast, which refers to the fibers that grow on the outside of the woody interior of the plant's stalk, and under the outer most part (the bark). Bast fibers give the plants strength. Hemp fibers can be between approximately 0.91 m (3 ft) and 4.6 m (15 ft) long, running the length of the plant. Depending on the processing used to remove the fiber from the stem, the hemp may naturally be creamy white, brown, gray, black or green.<sup style="white-space: nowrap;" title="This claim needs references to reliable sources from October 2008" class="noprint Template-Fact">[citation needed]</sup>
The use of hemp for fiber production has declined sharply over the last two centuries, but before the industrial revolution, hemp was a popular fiber because it is strong and grows quickly; it produces 250% more fiber than cotton and 600% more fiber than flax when grown on the same land.<sup style="white-space: nowrap;" title="This claim needs references to reliable sources from September 2007" class="noprint Template-Fact">[citation needed]</sup> Hemp has been used to make paper. It was used to make canvas, and the word canvas derives from cannabis.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-23">[24]</sup><sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-24">[25]</sup> Abaca or Manila replaced its use for rope. Burlap, made from jute, took over the sacking market. The paper industry began using wood pulp. The carpet industry switched over to wool, sisal, and jute, then nylon. Netting and webbing applications were taken over by cotton and synthetics.

Building material



Concrete block made with hemp in France

In Europe and China, hemp fibers have been used in prototype quantities to strengthen concrete, and in other composite materials for many construction and manufacturing applications.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-25">[26]</sup> See Hempcrete.

Composite materials


A mixture of fiberglass, hemp fiber, kenaf, and flax has been used since 2002 to make composite panels for automobiles.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-CNBC_Special_Report_3-1">[4]</sup><sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-26">[27]</sup> The choice of which bast fiber to use is primarily based on cost and availability.

Paper


There is a niche market for hemp paper. World hemp paper pulp production was believed to be around 120,000 tons per year in 1991 which was about 0.05% of the world's annual pulp production volume.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-Gertjan_1-1">[2]</sup> The cost of hemp pulp is approximately six times that of wood pulp,<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-Gertjan_1-2">[2]</sup> mostly due to the small size and outdated equipment of the few hemp processing plants in the Western world and hemp is harvested once a year (during August) and needs to be stored to feed the mill the whole year through. This storage requires a lot of (mostly manual) handling of the bulky stalk bundles, which accounts for a high raw material cost. Hemp pulp is bleached with hydrogen peroxide, which can also be used for wood pulp.
In 1916, US Department of Agriculture chief scientists Lyster H. Dewe, and Jason L. Merrill created paper made from hemp pulp, which they concluded was "favorable in comparison with those used with pulp wood."<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-27">[28]</sup> <sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-28">[29]</sup>
The decision of the United States Congress to pass the 1937 Marihuana Tax Act was based in part on testimony derived from articles in newspapers owned by William Randolph Hearst, who, some authors stress, had significant financial interests in the forest industry, which manufactured his newsprint.

From 1880 to 1933 the hemp grown in the United States had declined from 15,000 to 1,200 acres (4.9 km<sup>2</sup>), and that the price of line hemp had dropped from $12.50 per pound in 1914 to $9.00 per pound in 1933.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-29">[30]</sup><sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-News_30-0">[31]</sup> In 1935, however, hemp would make a significant rebound.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-News_30-1">[31]</sup> Hearst began a campaign against hemp, and published stories in his newspapers associating hemp with marijuana<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-31">[32]</sup> and attacking marijuana usage.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-32">[33]</sup>

Fabric



A sack made from hemp fiber


A modest hemp fabric industry exists. Recent developments in processing have made it possible to soften coarse fibers to a wearable level. Characteristics of hemp fiber are its superior strength and durability, resistance to ultraviolet light and mold, comfort and good absorbency (8%).<sup style="white-space: nowrap;" title="This claim needs references to reliable sources from June 2007" class="noprint Template-Fact">[citation needed]</sup>
Animal bedding

Hemp shives are the core of the stem. In EU, they are used for bedding (horse bedding for instance), or for horticultural mulch.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-34">[35]</sup> Industrial hemp is much more profitable if both fibers and shives (or even seeds) can be used.

Water and soil purification


Hemp can be used as a "mop crop" to clear impurities out of wastewater, such as sewage effluent, excessive phosphorus from chicken litter, or other unwanted substances or chemicals. Eco-technologist Dr. Keith Bolton from Southern Cross University in Lismore, New South Wales, Australia, is a leading researcher in this area. Hemp is being used to clean contaminants at Chernobyl nuclear disaster site.<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-35">[36]</sup>

Weed control


Main article: Weed_control#Organic_methods

Biodiesel sample

Hemp, because of its height, dense foliage and its high planting density as a crop, is a very effective and long used method of killing tough weeds in farming (by minimizing the pool of weed seeds of the soil).<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-36">[37]</sup> Using hemp this way can help farmers avoid the use of herbicides, to help gain organic certification and to gain the benefits of crop rotation per se.

Fuel


Biofuels such as biodiesel and alcohol fuel can be made from the oils in hemp seeds and stalks, and the fermentation of the plant as a whole, respectively. Biodiesel produced from hemp is sometimes known as hempoline<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-37">[38]</sup>.
Henry Ford grew industrial hemp on his estate after 1937,<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-seeker_38-0">[39]</sup> possibly to prove the cheapness of methanol production at Iron Mountain. He made plastic cars (the so-called Hemp Car) with wheat straw, hemp and sisal. (Popular Mechanics, Dec. 1941, "Pinch Hitters for Defense.") Filtered hemp oil can be used directly to power diesels. In 1892, Rudolph Diesel invented the diesel engine, which he intended to fuel "by a variety of fuels, especially vegetable and seed oils."<sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-39">[40]</sup><sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-40">[41]</sup><sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-41">[42]</sup><sup class="reference" id="cite_ref-42">[43]</sup>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemp#Uses
 

zenoonez

Active member
Veteran
survival of the fittest (richest). This has nothing to do with making the world a better place for the common man. All men are created equally is a farce. Even the happy hippie has been conned into a movement that furthers our enslavement (the green movement) Proof, carbon credit trading. Karma, One Love

All men were created equal, in they eyes of the government. You want to influence Washington? Go to Washington and talk to the representatives. That is what lobbyists do.
 

RockyMountainHi

I'd rather laugh with the sinners than cry with th
Veteran
What about bird seed?

There was an exemption written into the 1927 law for bird seed. Usually that means hemp seed, but my bird can tell hemp seed from some hermi bastards I had a while back; and he LOVES the ones from the garden.

- so maybe I breed seed for my cockatiel
 

Owl Mirror

Active member
Veteran
What about bird seed?

There was an exemption written into the 1927 law for bird seed. Usually that means hemp seed, but my bird can tell hemp seed from some hermi bastards I had a while back; and he LOVES the ones from the garden.

- so maybe I breed seed for my cockatiel

What about Biodegradable Plastic ?
Imagine how much oil we could not import if Hemp were the ingredient to make all our plastic needs ?

The Future of Plastics is Here! @ http://www.hempplastic.com

Why Hemp?

If today is a typical day on planet Earth, we will lose 116 square miles of rainforest, or about an acre a second. We will lose another 72 square miles to encroaching deserts, as a result of human mismanagement and overpopulation. We will lose 40 to 100 species, and no one knows whether the number is 40 or 100. Today the human population will increase by 250,000. And today we will add 2,700 tons of chlorofluorocarbons to the atmosphere and 15 million tons of carbon. Tonight the Earth will be a little hotter, it's waters more acidic, and the fabric of life more threadbare.*

NEW! Commercial production for 100% Biodegradable 'plastic' from hemp and other plant fibres.

www.zelfoaustralia.com

The future is here.
 
E

elmanito

Also I am not sure Monsanto is controlling any decision here.

Think about their Bt-cotton.They have spend a lot of money in the development of their GMO cotton.It would be odd to think that they haven't any influence on the prohibition of hemp, which the modern varieties have a THC-content less than 0.3%.

Multinationals like Monsanto have more influence on your government than you think.

Namaste :smoweed: :canabis:

 

DSM

Member
I realized far to young that most humans make better sheep than people. We have difficulty accepting the fact that we MAY have been lied to our whole lives. Perhaps the people that lie about the dangers of hemp, marijuana (etc) believe the lie themselves (as they may have been mis-informed). I know many adults are so stuck in their ways and refuse to even consider so many things may not be true. Things they base their sense or morality and justice on. I see just as many that claim to be open to listen to, and consider "radical" thoughts / ideas / REAL truths, but I can see in their eyes they are not willing to believe that life long teachings of truths could POSSIBLY be fabricated.

Kola Radical - I feel ya. The way things are being run a revolution is overdue.

How about PRIVATELY OWNED PRISONS?!? Such a concept is an absolute and unbelievable abomination.

Owl mirror - How does having 1 ruling government make that any different? 50 slightly "Less" United States could possibly do a better job at protecting their land and state. A greater variety of specialization, troops actually having ADEQUATE Armor!!! OH NOT STARTING WARS OVER OIL?!?

The General - I am unsure of the context of your wishing of good luck (as it would surely be helpful to have). I find many people simply think many things are too big, or impossible. Or that 1 person cannot make a difference. If we believe these things, then yes, they are sadly true.

One of the truest things I have come to realize is that if you do ANYTHING with enough authority you will get away with it. Please - Ponder this, I find few people who disagree after they think about it, or are given a few examples that greatly vary.
 

DSM

Member
I am not familiar with American law as I am Canadian, but for us one of the primary jobs of a Supreme Court is interpretation of law, and to strike down unjust laws (or laws that are not enforcible, have too many loop holes/flaws).

LETS START WITH SOME F*CKING QUESTIONS!!! ON WHAT BASIS ARE DRUGS ILLEGAL? Lets go to the beginning of that tap root. If there is an argument for harm, ITS YOUR OWN BODY! Has anyone watched the movie JAckass? CKY2K? I think they did more harm to their bodies than the avg drug user will. What did they get for harming themselves? Fame and fortune (thanks to an enjoyable product). How can a government tell me what I can or cannot do with MY BODY?!?!

Seriously, this is the first I have thought about WHY are drugs illegal? What is the basis? The punishments are the real damage done, and the TRUE crime. Does it protect society against addicts who look to feed their habit by any means nescicary? DOES ANYONE HERE KNOW HOW MUCH Cocaine you can buy in South American Countries for $20? Drugs are not exspensive. Just the illegal ones.

If no one has a VALID REASON as to why drugs should be illegal this should be sufficient reason to abolish anti-drug laws. NAY THIS IS REASON ENOUGH!!!
 

DSM

Member
How many people think pot users should be put in jail? Sadly most politicians see the main part of their job as getting re-elected. When a government does not listen to its people, it is the job of the people to make the gov listen. If politicians see that they will loose massive votes and loose power, they listen usually listen very carefully.

The Canadian law making system is designed to speed the process of passing and amending of federal laws.

I do know one thing bout American federal law. The system is designed to slow the creation / amendment of law.
 

j6p

Member
^^The US is a plutocracy, run by money. Interest groups with the most money are responded to first by politicians, as a rule. One big exception to the money rule can occur when politicians fear they will not be reelected, due to pressure from their constituents.
 

RockyMountainHi

I'd rather laugh with the sinners than cry with th
Veteran
Seriously, this is the first I have thought about WHY are drugs illegal? What is the basis? The punishments are the real damage done,



Welcome to the party - about 70 years late...

Wake up- smell the coffee.


Let me introduce you to a fellow Canook - his name is Marc Emory. A Canadian who is fighting the US war on drugs every day - still. respect to you Marc.



no SERIOUSLY,,,, I guess late is better than never.

I do know one thing bout American federal law. The system is designed to slow the creation / amendment of law.

Dude - you don't really know squat huh? What was slow about this GD health bill the american people just got force fed? And again - It isn't for the people, it is more crap from the politiacians stuffed with pork. (unrelated goodies to advance the politicians fincial/political interests)

^^One big exception to the money rule can occur when politicians fear they will not be reelected, due to pressure from their constituents.

Again I reference the new health bill - Never have I seen so many people say - "It's a crappy bill, but it's GOVERNMENT"

I contacted my senators and threatened them with a recall election as did several of my local citizens - My signature for the ballot will be on the first page.
 
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Jellyfish

Invertebrata Inebriata
Veteran
The Emperor Wears No Clothes
http://www.jackherer.com/chapters.html

This is the book that started the hemp revolution. More than 600,000 copies have been sold to date. The print version of The Emperor Wears No Clothes is available in Jack's Hemporium. Jack wants this information to be available to everyone, so he has published the text of the book here on the internet for free. This is only half of what is actually in the book. If you want all the source material and graphics, please buy a copy of the book.

By selling his books, tapes, c.d.s, and movies, Jack has been able to help support the hemp movement for the last 20 years.
 

mpd

Lammen Gorthaur
Veteran
"...It appears there is still a long way to go in educating our government and politicians about hemp, as well as the general public."

Something on which we can agree.

I believe this is a self-inflicted wound. Almost everything I see on the television relative to pot is negative coverage; there is never a story about the positive aspects of our community. It would seem there are too few positive outcomes that make it to the news because the community presents no positive outcomes.

It only takes one bad incident to erase every tiny gain we have ever had. I think our community's new year's resolution should be to promote the responsible, practical and humane benefits of marijuana and marijuana cultivation and commerce. Once people start seeing us as pragmatic and responsible people promoting a pragmatic and responsible agenda then the tables will start to turn. We need a new agenda as the old one hasn't delivered the end of prohibition and there is no end in sight; ergo, if we want an end to this paradigm it is we who will have to change the paradigm and not the rest of the country.
 
So, I think legalization is just around the corner. This thread should put a stop to those silly posts for a few months, I hope, the people in charge think hemp is a drug. Kinda like o'dooles will get you drunk. Its fucking hopeless with the level of retardation in our country.

You all know that the companies that paid to have MJ deemed illegal, haven't gone out of business and have actually become the darlings of our society. Anyone here with a 401K that has an oil company in the holdings has prospered. As a nation we have prospered because we make everything out of oil, the only reason your money has any value left is from oil. The countries that produce oil buy our debt with those profits. I say you need to vote with your money and dissolve any holdings you have in any company that has profited from MJ/Hemp being illegal (i did it). The majority of people would still want Hemp illegal if they knew they would lose money in the savings account, we have become a country that loves the thought of safety, the value of your 401k represents safety. Anything to be safe, the world is full of bad people.

All I can say is: WALMART, save money, live better, Let your new live begin, call 1-800- get-slim. I bought Snuggies for everyone this year because a regular blanket doen't have arms and I never knew how fucking annoying a real blanket was, Thank you Snuggie. (Idiocracy is upon us boys, way she goes)

Guys, I haven't been able to smoke for over a month for my annual drug test and I am close to snapping so sorry for the rant but FUCK I hate dumb people, and we elect these fucks (so we think).
 

DSM

Member
RockyMountainHI ~ Do you know how many checks and balances are in place in American Law making? With that health bill it seems there are SOME ways to cut through. The fact that I have heard nothing about it (other than 1 mention via word of mouth) is of concern for me, and makes me wonder - What's wrong with it??? Something is likely very wrong and or lacking since it has not made much of a splash North of the Boarder.

I am curious about it. Can anyone give a quick summary / opinion?

I'm glad to hear your ready to sign.

MPD ~ You've given some food for thought.

Richard Gozinya ~ IT's understandable man. Thankfully you KNOW when your test is comming! I was getting PRetty passionate when I was writing in this threat late last night / early this morning.

I do not have anything against Barrak Obamma. Having said that does anyone else here think that PART of reason Obamma was elected was the fact that he was in right place at the right time? He didn't exactly have the toughest opponent (Especially since they followed GWB). With regards to the Presidential Vote.
 

DSM

Member
One more thing. In Recent years Polliticians have tried to show they are just like us. They are someone you could enjoy having a beer with. I don't want to ever vote for an average guy (no offense avg guys) I want my politicians to be very intelligent.

Did Obamma ever show his birth certificate? IF not maybe one day I can become president...
 

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