Finishing up. Need some advice

[The End Is Near]

As the title says, I'm finishing up but am worried about the future smoothness of my smoke because I took some test nugs from the less prime regions of the plant at day 40(haven't mastered pruning yet) and they were harsh on my throat. Though I know they were uncured, unflushed, still green, not completely dry, etc, I wasn't expecting as much harshness as I got.

I stopped nutes completely at day 35, and I'm on day 46 now with C99 and Sadhu, and the plants aren't yellowing at all yet(Sadhus are pale, but that's it), and still have more green than I'd like to see at this stage. I'm particularly worried about a much too big tub of fresh soil that I transplanted 60% of my crop into at around day 15-20 of flower. I don't think the nutrients will deplete all the way and am debating whether to uproot them in the final stages of flower to properly starve them. My mix is:

5 parts peat
2 parts perlite
2 parts mushroom compost

amended with:
(per gallon)
2 tbs dolomite lime
2 tbsp bone meal (blood meal ommitted out of fear of burning/harshness; my bone meal was rated 6-15-0)
1 tbsp kelp meal

fed compost teas consisting of varying amounts of mushroom compost, blackstrap molasses, kelp meal, alfalfa feed pellets, budswel guano(0-8-0), and a bit of homemade earthworm castings.

My nitpickings with this run's mix and feedings:
-Not enough perlite
-Would have liked to have used EWC instead of mushroom compost
-2 feedings with PBP bloom soil @ 1tbs/gal not completely organic
-Alfalfa pellets were feed, may have had minute amounts of salt. Tasted it, couldn't detect any, and the feed shop guy said there was no salt. Also, known to burn if used unproperly. I used a small handful per 5 gallon bucket about 3-4 times
-Bat guano, known to be strong, was used with roughly the same frequency as alfalfa @ 1 tbs/gal, except for last feed which was 1/3 cup in a 5 gallons of water.
-a plant sitting on top of the big tub gave one of the tub plants some runoff that burned it and turned it a dark green.

I plan to water until runoff, since the burned plant show there's something to be washed out, despite what some gurus here say about organics. Still debating about uprooting the tub plants. Maybe I'll even take off the burnt, dark green leaves so the plant has less nutes to get rid of. Any further advice is appreciated. Pics will be up when lights come on.

 

[BurnOne]

You're smoking a green plant and complaining about harshness??? Come on!!!

 

[The End Is Near]

^^Yeah, I know. My main concern is getting them to starve in these last 2 weeks after these harsh test buds. I plan to harvest at day 60-65, cutting the Sadhus early when the C99s finish because I need the closet to dry. My ideas to get them to stave are:

-Flush to a lot of runoff(definitely doing this)
-Cut off leaves since they store N
-Dig up the plants from their late transplant, hoping the shock isn't too much
-"girdling" the mainstem, zamalito's technique. Basically removing a small piece of the main stem
http://icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=1067408&postcount=3
-similar to girdling, hitting a nail through the mainstem

 

[maryjohn]

I have been "flushing" since I put my seeds in. My plants thrive because organic soil can't be flushed. If I sample fresh buds, they will be harsh regardless of methods. Fresh plant material does not burn smooth.

So in all likelihood the only problem you have is unrealistic expectations.

 

[The End Is Near]

I know they'd be harsh not fully dry, but they weren't "wet". I have a decent amount of it, so I'll know if the harshness was from not being dry enough or too much N/whatever. And like I said before, runoff from a potted plant on top of a bin of soil caused the plant directly under it to show burnt, too dark green leaves. That shows there's something to be flushed out.

I'm more concerned with what everone thinks of girdling, the nail technique, and me uprooting plants 46 days into flower.

 

[Stoned Crow]

I just let my plants grow, then cut them when they are ready to harvest. Sometimes I top or LST during veg. A proper dry and cure does wonders for taste.

 

[BurnOne]

First of all, you need to cure your buds. Do a search on how to do that.
Second, the good thing about organic growing is there is nothing in the plant that needs to be "flushed" by drenching the soil.
Third, bone can't be flushed out anyway.
Next time, why not try LC's Mix and Recipe #1 from the Beginners sticky. Just use plain water all the way to harvest. Your buds put on the most weight the last two weeks of flowering and need plenty of food to fatten up.
All buds will be harsh without a good long cure.
Burn1

 

[maryjohn]

And if you want to sample fresh buds, get a vaporizer.

Your buds are not harsh because they are not dry enough. They are harsh because they dried too fast. So listen to burn.

 

[The End Is Near]

Proper curing isn't what I'm concerned with, I already know about that. It's getting excess nutrients out of my plants by whatever means necessary.

I'm even thinking about experimenting with cutting off small individual branches and putten them in plain water like a flower bouquet, hoping they yellow or use up stored nutes. Hey, it works on clones taken from a flowering plant.

 

[jaykush]

if your going to sample something at least dry it out first.

why do you want to get nutrients out of your plants at the most critical time for bud production?

 

[The End Is Near]

if your going to sample something at least dry it out first.

why do you want to get nutrients out of your plants at the most critical time for bud production?

Because smoothness is more important to me than a few grams. I feel thay've finished bulking up and are only ripening their existing mass. All plants have been the same size for well over a week. I'm no expert, but I'm guessing seeing the amount of green I'm seeing at day 46 is a sign of too much N. I wanted to get those warm autumn colors indicative of a hungry plant, but that doesn't seem likely. Also, there may be too much P as well due to the guano and 6-15-0 bonemeal. Only K source was kelp meal.

 

[BurnOne]

Why are you trying to starve the plant when what it is trying to do is get fat???
Your method is all wrong and you're not listening to good advise.
Burn1

 

[maryjohn]

Man if you already know what you want to do, why ask a bunch of guys with way more experience what to do? We've been over this a million times, and many of us don't flush and have no issues with harshness after drying and curing properly.

I have never had buds within one month of harvest that were not harsh. If your shit is not even dried yet, it should be terrible.

 

[OPT]

If you feel you overfed them with Nitrogen, the only way for them to use up the excess is time. Maybe just keep using straight water for the next few weeks. Next time why not add blood meal to your mix, and forget the pure blend?

There's a reason why people grow organically. Not only do we use mother nature's best ingredients, organic bud is known to be smoother then chemical grown pot in general. That might not be the case 100 percent of the time, but it's a good guideline. People flush plants to get rid of the excess salts from the chemicals they use for plant nutrition, flushing isn't going to do anything for you. Next time, as bad as you want a taste test, hold back!!!

Also, you didn't state HOW you dried this test bud. If you used a microwave or oven, that is exactly your problem.

Patience is a virtue!

OPT

 

[The End Is Near]

So I should just leave them as is, and ignore the dark green leaves, and not worry about overferting due to guano and alfalfa in teas and fresh soil 15-20 days into flower? No comments on the experimental methods of harvesting that some people swear by?

I want to take advice from those more experienced, as I am still a relative newb, but no one has addressed my concerns about the dark green leaves, lack of yellowing/fall colors, unwanted residual nutrients in my plants, and the fact that, like my last run, the buds stopped growing around the time I am at now. I talked about organic runoff burning a plant, but all I get is "nothing can be flushed from organics," when this clearly shows there's more than just water coming out the other end.

No offense, but this sounds too much like the unsolicited "advice" I got when talking about the crop I ruined with AN bud blood that made them burn sparky. He suggested a proper dry and cure, which I already did, but no amount of perfect drying or curing could extract the residual ferts still in the bud that made my harvest sparky.

And no one even considered that organics and flushing is well debated with both sides experienced. I though people were more open minded around here.

 

[Stoned Crow]

We are open minded around here, it just seems you're trying to latch on to gimmicks, when it looks like you have no reason to do so.

If your last crop burned sparky, then I would reconsider what and how I'm applying my nutes.

I'm not saying some of those experimental methods of harvest don't work, but IMHO they are unnecessary.

Most of the plants I harvest have a good green color at the time of harvest, and in my experience doesn't effect the smoothness of the smoke.

The best advice I can give you is ride it out without doing anything rash, just let them grow and see how it ends up.

 

[OPT]

If you use LC's mix like Burn1 stated, you will never burn your plants, plain and simple. As far as the dark green leaves go, are you sure it's from the run off you talk about, and not the ferts you mixed into the soil? It takes the microorganisms so long to break organic nutrients down and available to the plants, you maybe just had too much in there, coupled with the pure blend, then ya, you could have give it a nitrogen overdose.

I just don't understand the "Starving" part. Why would you wanna starve your plants in the time they need nutrients most. The time they pack on there weight and start to swell?

Yes, in a lot of cases you will see fan leaves start to pale and turn yellowish towards the end because the plant is using up the remaining Nitrogen it has. That doesn't mean that if they don't yellow, your gonna have super harsh bad tasting smoke!

Chloraphil (spell check) is a reason why pot is harsh. But, If you take the time to properly dry and cure your stash, harshness will be as low as it could get.

I'm not trying to say I know everything, but I do have several grows under my belt now, and the problems you say you are having, has never happened to me. But from the years of reading these forums , myself, as well as hundreds of other people have learned and understood a great deal of things that has to do with growing MJ. I don't think anyone is trying to be the "high horse" and the MJ god himself at trying to give you there perspective on your questions. There's varying opinions in all areas of life, pick and choose which you want to believe or not.

OPT

 

[maryjohn]

This "residual ferts" business is an idee fixe for you man.

The best thing you can do is just follow the directions for lc mix with dry amendments, which works for almost every plant, grower, and locale. Growing some fat tasty buds with nothing but water will change your perspective.

Now, when you claim your runoff burns other plants, which species are we talking about? MJ is a very easy plant, so if you are overdoing liquid fertilizer, it may not kill your mj, while burning a different plant.

Remember, when we say your runoff should be clean, we assume the soil is well managed, which I fear is not so in your case.

Lots to address here, which explains why no one gets to it all at once.

 

[The End Is Near]

^^ with the runoff, I think the most harmful things were the guano and alfalfa, which are known to be a bit hot/strong, and the not entirely organic PBP. However, I've never seen a plant get burned by PBP, much less from 2 feedings.

Stoned Crow, thanks for the info on the green plants. Makes me feel better about my non yellow plants, but I still want to experiment with the methods I talked about to try and leach out nitrogen.

 

[maryjohn]

End, I forgot to mention - learn how nitrogen moves around. When your fan leaves yellow, it moves into the buds. That's why buds are green when they finish. Your use of the word "autumnal" indicates you have the wrong idea about the biological functions in play.