10X10 Square Ft. Room

[Zoolander]

LED can't compete with HPS for flower . I run UFO's in veg and they are great for mothers and clones but stick to HPS for flower .

 

[SpasticGramps]

HPS FTW. LED has a ways to go before it will be useful for flowering.

 

[sparkjumper]

Mover schmoover I have 3 1K verts in an 8 by 8 room, 4 1K verts would be perfect for you.I would consider co2 enrichment in a setup like that.I'd probably go with 2 MH and two HPS just because I love my sun systems 600/400 combo fixture for vegEDIT On second thought you would need to use conversion lamps which are shit especially in high wattage like that.4 1K HPS vertizontals is what I'd go with

 

[*mistress*]

On second thought you would need to use conversion lamps which are shit especially in high wattage like that

what issues have you had w/ conversion bulbs?
which brand & wattage?

enjoy your garden!

 

[MarquisBlack]

Conversion bulbs are hella expensive for one.

 

[Lazyman]

Ok, ignoring PAR watts for brevity, we'll use the easily-found lumens ratings for the comparisons.

Conversion bulbs have dramatically reduced lumens compared to their "standard" counterparts, the Sunmaster 600w MH conversion bulb only spits out 50K lumens (a standard HPS is between 80-90K dep on manufacturer.) That is 83.33 lumens per watt.

IMHO Conversion bulbs are pretty inappropriate for a flowering bulb, as they are less efficient than a regular 400w, which is are a waste of power for a veg bulb (a Solarmax 7200K 400W MH puts out 36K lumens, or 90 lumens per watt.) Sad if a 400w mh is more efficient, but even a good fluorescent is more efficient than a 600w conversion bulb!

An 8-bulb T-5 takes 432w, but puts out 40K lumens, or 92.59 lumens per watt. Newer LED panels (like the 318w Penetrator LED panel) makes "nearly" 12000 lumens, which is 37.7 lumens per watt, in case you're curious.

Should I start a lighting thread or do you guys know all this shit already?

 

[*mistress*]

Conversion bulbs are hella expensive for one.

hortilux eye ulta ace
940 hps operates on mh ballast
can be found for 120 coins.
normally 200.

can also find the eye sunlux ultra ace (used to retrofit street lights/same mfg, dif brand) in 220, 360 & 940...

Ok, ignoring PAR watts for brevity, we'll use the easily-found lumens ratings for the comparisons.

Conversion bulbs have dramatically reduced lumens compared to their "standard" counterparts, the Sunmaster 600w MH conversion bulb only spits out 50K lumens (a standard HPS is between 80-90K dep on manufacturer.) That is 83.33 lumens per watt.

IMHO Conversion bulbs are pretty inappropriate for a flowering bulb, as they are less efficient than a regular 400w, which is are a waste of power for a veg bulb (a Solarmax 7200K 400W MH puts out 36K lumens, or 90 lumens per watt.) Sad if a 400w mh is more efficient, but even a good fluorescent is more efficient than a 600w conversion bulb!

An 8-bulb T-5 takes 432w, but puts out 40K lumens, or 92.59 lumens per watt. Newer LED panels (like the 318w Penetrator LED panel) makes "nearly" 12000 lumens, which is 37.7 lumens per watt, in case you're curious.

Should I start a lighting thread or do you guys know all this shit already?

you obviously havnt used a 940 eye conversion bulb (2k)... they are very effective...

940w, hortilux ultra ace
130k initial lumens. 117k mean lumens. 25 cri. 2100 kelvin temp
4.1 operating amps

1000w hortilux eye, super hps, 1k
145 initial lumens. 127 mean lumens. 26 cri. 2100 kelvin temp
4.7 operating amps

nearly identical spectral distribution charts...

eye also makes sunlux 940's w/ same specs. >coins, harder to find. used for warehouses, street lights, etc. 'hortilux' brand, same bulb <coins...

they are a well-kept tool & "shhh" for the happy lady gardener. they initially were exposed to the c*nn*bis boards by krusty (kbs/freedom bucket tree grows) & his crews... they always used the 940's & a couple mh's... when asked why over & over they always responded that the final flowers were 'just better'...

run these & sunmaster warm (3k), & cool (5-6.5k) & neutral deluxes (4k). can easily observe the growth differences between the types. also run cheapo 4k ge & sylvania 30-70 coins mh 1k's...

it is not about the lumens. lumens are meaningless. the sun is 450 par watts. leaves get saturated @ 300 par watts. 20 photons are required to make & store 1 molecule of sugar...

w/ mixing spectrums, can get close to the saturation point if keep 1k's ~1 foot from the plant. this is their most powerful distance w/out parching plants... here, in imagination, w/ excellent air flow, ,multiple 1k's are kept 2-6" away from plants - bare bulb... this wiull get close to 250 par watts...

even though sunmaster warem deluxes claims 385 par watts, very skeptical... the only meaningful way to measure light actually consumed by plants are found here:

lighting conversion data in part:

the best unit for expressing the energy requirement of a specific plant species is the irradiance expressed in milliwatts per sqaure meter or milliwatts per square foot(mw/m2,mw/ft2). it is the measure of the quantity of energy in wavelength band 400-700 nanometers(nm) received by the plants.

conversion bulbs are overlooked, but that is ok... those that have used them for many 360's know what they will do for final fruit... which is all that matters. they technically could replace mh's in the garden, except for the greater uv & violet light that mh's put out...

have had best results rotating all differnt kelvin temps during season...

mh lights seem inefficient, etc for flowering - & maybe conversion bulbs seem that way too... have ran thru many, many config growing trees & found that mixing the 2 is best... efficiency is good, but final fruit density, aromas & flavors have been far better using both.

940 conversion bulbs are same as 1k hps', just run less watts... the tree growers (some) found this out last decade...

please do start lighting thread Lazyman... will be interesting...
*edit*
fwiw, this is why 4k mh's are mixed in....

sunmaster neutrals are good, but cheapo generic venture, sylvania, phillips, etc all are mostly 4k & balance well w/ the conversion. the cools & warms get mixed in too, depending on stage of growth... & are only 45-70 coins per... lots of uv for early veg & lots of uv for late flower... this usually = lots of reproductive glands on a shorter plant w/ less elongation than hps alone... no need for expensive uvb tubes (used to run those too...). will see the gland density & taste the flavors from using mh+hps...

or not... not trying to prove or convince, just sharing. if consider it all inapplicable - just ignore & keep using standard bulbs @ their standard times...

only ran thru various bulbs & configs several, several occasions...

enjoy your garden!

 

[Lazyman]

Good info mistress! I want to do some research before I start a new thread on lighting, I'd like to make it sticky-worthy if I can. I'm looking forward to charting bulb efficiencies as well as PAR watts, but there's lots of data chasing to do!

 

[sparkjumper]

I cant add much except to say using conversion lamps for high wattage flowering will give you visual results that you will not like.I would flower/veg with any wattage MH/HPS rather than use those expensive pieces of crap.

 

[*mistress*]

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