What's new

Guidelines won't help 2 charged in pot raid

B

Blue Dot

http://www3.signonsandiego.com/stor...lines-wont-help-2-charged-pot-raid/?uniontrib

"Sellers of medical marijuana targeted

By Greg Moran
Union-Tribune Staff Writer
2:00 a.m. October 26, 2009

FEDERAL COURT — When the Department of Justice announced guidelines last week for federal prosecutors pursuing medical-marijuana cases, advocates for the medicinal use of the drug widely welcomed them.
With, perhaps, two exceptions — James Stacy and Joseph Nunes.
Stacy and Nunes are former providers of medical marijuana now facing federal charges for illegally selling the drug from storefront businesses they owned in Vista and San Diego.
Stacy and Nunes are the only two of about 30 people who were arrested during a raid of medical-marijuana collectives and dispensaries across San Diego County in September who are being prosecuted in federal court.
The new guidelines discourage — but don't prohibit — federal prosecutors from pursuing cases against individuals and businesses that are in compliance with state laws. But the guidelines will not get Stacy and Nunes off the hook.
Their cases will continue moving forward, said prosecutors with the U.S. Attorney's Office in San Diego. Prosecutors believe Nunes and Stacy were not complying with California's medical-marijuana law and, therefore, fall outside the protection of the guidelines.
Federal law does not recognize medical marijuana. But 14 states, including California, do. The tension between federal and state law has played out for years. The new guidelines mark a departure from previous federal policy in that they back off from using federal power to prosecute people who otherwise are following state laws.
Stacy's attorney still questions the decision to haul her client into federal court.
Stacy, 45, owns a martial arts studio on South Santa Fe Avenue in Vista. Earlier this year he opened Movement in Action, a medical-marijuana collective, in the back of the store.
Kasha Kastillo, Stacy's federal public defender, said Stacy was “absolutely attempting to comply with state law.” Kastillo said she has not been specifically told by prosecutors why her client was indicted on charges of distributing and conspiracy to distribute marijuana and possession of a firearm in furtherance of drug trafficking.
“Based on the information in the (warrants), he was not making it a secret he was opening the collective and was trying to do so legally,” she said.
Assistant U.S. Attorney Andrew Schopler declined to comment on details of the case.
Affidavits supporting arrest and search warrants outline the case against Stacy. They were sworn out by an undercover San Diego County sheriff's detective who posed as a patient and went to the cooperative in June. The detective handed over a doctor's recommendation for the drug and after a few minutes was ushered into a room where he met Stacy.
Stacy told him he could legally sell him the drug as long as he had a valid doctor's recommendation, and he became a member of the cooperative.
The detective said in the warrant that he asked if he needed to work to help out the business. He said Stacy told him he could do odd jobs. The detective bought one-eighth of an ounce of marijuana, for $60, on that day, and the same amount on two other occasions in August, the warrant says.
The warrant says Stacy was not following state law because he did not fit the definition of a caregiver who can provide medical marijuana to patients.
The detective said a caregiver has to be an individual, and not a business, who has “consistently assumed responsibility” for taking care of another. Distributing the drug to someone only with a recommendation “on an ad hoc basis without any other relationship is not permitted,” the warrant says.
A search of the business also turned up a handgun. Under the new federal guidelines, the presence of a firearm is one element that can justify federal charges.
Nunes operated the Green Kross Collective at 3415 Mission Blvd. in San Diego. Police conducted undercover buys there, too.
Court records say Nunes has a criminal record for marijuana possession and sales, as well as theft, burglary and weapons charges. Under state law medical-marijuana collectives have to be nonprofit businesses, but investigators said they found that Nunes seemed to be profiting from the business.
There was $13,500 in cash in the store, the products of two days of sales. Nunes was living in a $4,000-per-month high-rise condominium, said Assistant U.S. Attorney Sherri Walker Hobson.
A search there uncovered $25,000 in cash, a pound of marijuana and a stash of human growth hormone. Nunes' attorney did not respond to a request for comment.
In all, 30 people were arrested in the Sept. 9 raids, and two people have been charged in state court. One, Wilber Jay Dawson, pleaded guilty Oct. 8 in San Diego Superior Court to one charge of possession of marijuana for sale. A second man, Jovan Christian Jackson, pleaded not guilty and has a court hearing set for Dec. 1. All of the other cases are under review, according to Paul Levikow, a spokesman for the District Attorney's Office."
 

coolx

Active member
Why is the detective talking about caregivers and not a coop as that is what Stacy was talking about? And someone needs to tell Stacy's PD about the recent CA citable ruling that you do not have to actively participate to be legally a member of a coop. I forget offhand which ruling this was. Anyway, this would put Stacy at least within CA law.
 
B

Blue Dot

Why is the detective talking about caregivers and not a coop as that is what Stacy was talking about? And someone needs to tell Stacy's PD about the recent CA citable ruling that you do not have to actively participate to be legally a member of a coop. I forget offhand which ruling this was. Anyway, this would put Stacy at least within CA law.

The detective said in the warrant that he asked if he needed to work to help out the business. He said Stacy told him he could do odd jobs.

Mentch and other decisions say you have to be a contributing member to the collective.

Merely purchasing is not 'contributing"
 

kmk420kali

Freedom Fighter
Veteran
Mentch and other decisions say you have to be a contributing member to the collective.

Merely purchasing is not 'contributing"

I could have sworn that one of the things listed that you can help with in a Collective...is cash--
 
B

Blue Dot

forget Stacy, what about this guy:

There was $13,500 in cash in the store, the products of two days of sales. Nunes was living in a $4,000-per-month high-rise condominium, said Assistant U.S. Attorney Sherri Walker Hobson.


Non-profit my ass.
 

bterzz

Active member
Veteran
13,500 in cash, the product of two days of sales.


Just because they're bringing in 13,500 every two days doesnt mean they didnt pay 12,000 for the medicine originally, X amount for RENT, EMPLOYEES, ELECTRICITY, SECURITY, ETC.
 
13,500 in cash, the product of two days of sales.


Just because they're bringing in 13,500 every two days doesnt mean they didnt pay 12,000 for the medicine originally, X amount for RENT, EMPLOYEES, ELECTRICITY, SECURITY, ETC.
somewhere I heard the answer to that was:

"tell it to the judge."
 
B

Blue Dot

13,500 in cash, the product of two days of sales.


Just because they're bringing in 13,500 every two days doesnt mean they didnt pay 12,000 for the medicine originally, X amount for RENT, EMPLOYEES, ELECTRICITY, SECURITY, ETC.


2 days of a couple of employees making minimum wage = not much

2 days electricity (just ambient lighting since 99% of dispensaries don't grow their own) = not much

2 days rent for a brokedown palace = not much

2 days wages for your buddy "Big Jim/John/Joe" the bouncer who would rather get paid in perks, ie pot = not much

$13,500 worth of meds bought for $12,000 = what a 5% markup, yeah right!

get real bterzz

my leg is definately wet but it ain't rainin'.
 

resinryder

Rubbing my glands together
Veteran
Blue Dot, I'm just curious and not trying to provoke an argument. Your sig line-Capitalism ruins everything, including cannabis-has left me with a question. What form of government would you support? Socialism, Communism, Fascism? You appear to have a problem with the general fundamentals of a business making a profit, ie, capitalism. After reading many of your post I just had to ask.
Seems as if a person is operating a non profit, shouldn't that person be able to draw a salary? They are putting their time and sartup money in it to begin with. They have the usual overhead. Even much larger non profit organizations pay their employees and executives well. If providing a service regardless of what the business is, the person/people running it still have a right to make a living, no? If not making a salary what would be the incentive to provide the services? No one goes into business to give everyting away, right?
 
B

Blue Dot

^After expenses, this would amount to many thousands of dollars a day for his salary.

Maybe it's just me, but No one I know makes thousands of dollars a day in salary for basically doing nothing.

Don't BS me, buying and reselling pot has GOT to be the easiest job in the world.

I worked so hard in my life I actually worked myself into injury and onto temporary disability and most people i know work damn hard and they don't make near what this guy was making.

It's too easy and if it's too easy it means theres something fishy going on, and that is that this guy is taking advantage of a law.

He's basically a pot dealer under the guise of compassion because the law is so vague because it was written by Dennis Peron who himself is a glorified dealer.

Life shouldn't be so easy as to wake up, buy some pot and resell it and make thousands a day. Just my opinion.
 

resinryder

Rubbing my glands together
Veteran
I understand your view but entertain this. I understand the selling price from the grower can range from 3200.00 to 3800.00 per lb. May not be the correct numbers as I really don't know. Now if at say 3500.00/lb to the grower, 3 lbs is 17500.00. Growers don't take checks, right?
The article you posted clearly said "There was $13,500 in cash in the store, the products of two days of sales". That is not profit it's sales. He's still got to by his product and HAS to keep cash on hand to pay suppliers, right? Which could account for the 25,000.00 and the pound found in his apartment.
Now, looking at cheaper prices, if a med patient, such as yourself who has limited fiances, not implying your finical situation is bad by the way, myself included, if the price of the meds were reduced to say 250.00 to 300.00 per oz, and not saying you or I would, there are those that would ome in, buy the meds at the lower price, then walk out and sale those cheaper meds for the 400.00 to 500.00 to friends, kids, etc.. You know there are those who would do this.
So it's a catch 22 either way you go. Sale it for more and avoid profiting by patients gaming the system, or sale it for less and let those that would make a profit.
Either way, someone is gonna profit from it.
Like I said earlier, if there were no profit potential, no one would be doing it at all.
 

soulfly22583

Trust me.. I'm A Professional..
Veteran
2 days of a couple of employees making minimum wage = not much

2 days electricity (just ambient lighting since 99% of dispensaries don't grow their own) = not much

2 days rent for a brokedown palace = not much

2 days wages for your buddy "Big Jim/John/Joe" the bouncer who would rather get paid in perks, ie pot = not much

$13,500 worth of meds bought for $12,000 = what a 5% markup, yeah right!

get real bterzz

my leg is definately wet but it ain't rainin'.

I saw your posts in the NNCC thread and now see this. I think you bring some good commentary but seriously man - if you want to add validity to your post, put up some facts or some damn good educated guesses on information, dont just say "not much".

Unless you were actually participating at the coop then you have no idea if $13,500 is a lot or nothing at all.
 
B

Blue Dot

I saw your posts in the NNCC thread and now see this. I think you bring some good commentary but seriously man - if you want to add validity to your post, put up some facts or some damn good educated guesses on information, dont just say "not much".

Unless you were actually participating at the coop then you have no idea if $13,500 is a lot or nothing at all.

I meant not much because it is true, not some guess.

For instance, 2 days x 8/hrs/day x mimimum wage for 2 employees equals = $256. Compared to $13,500 it ain't "much". I'll even give you +- hundreds just for "whatever" and it still equals "not much".

Same goes for everything else.

Tell me, what exactly, besides buying and reselling are they "doing' to earn that profit?

That's kinda the dirty little secret of the dispensary biz isn't it? That it hardly takes any work at all compared to the profits made.

Don't kid yourself, the ROI on a quasi-legal popular drug is the highest in the market and everyone knows it.
 

Danknuggler

Active member
^After expenses, this would amount to many thousands of dollars a day for his salary.

Maybe it's just me, but No one I know makes thousands of dollars a day in salary for basically doing nothing.

Don't BS me, buying and reselling pot has GOT to be the easiest job in the world.

I worked so hard in my life I actually worked myself into injury and onto temporary disability and most people i know work damn hard and they don't make near what this guy was making.

It's too easy and if it's too easy it means theres something fishy going on, and that is that this guy is taking advantage of a law.

He's basically a pot dealer under the guise of compassion because the law is so vague because it was written by Dennis Peron who himself is a glorified dealer.

Life shouldn't be so easy as to wake up, buy some pot and resell it and make thousands a day. Just my opinion.

Your opinions seem to anger me more than they probably should.I am knee deep in everything mmj all day 24/7 it is my bread and butter.I know some of these people that you just seem to name drop as if you truly really knew anything about them.You categorize and judge without really knowing shit.What exactly is your agenda?You seem to be on some sort of strange negative mission.Do you even smoke or grow cannabis?Dare I say you sound more and more like the rantings of someone in law enforcement.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

soulfly22583

Trust me.. I'm A Professional..
Veteran
dude.. your not getting it! I dont think your ass hat like everyone else seems to think but still, you dont do a damn thing to back up your comments. If thats your goal to be a prick and piss everyone off by spewing non-constructive bullshit then so be it.

I think your logic is complete and utter bullshit. I think you have no idea of what it takes to run a coop or ANY business at all. Until you can answer a question that is directly asked of you instead of playing this dance around the question vague bullshit you will get nothing from this site except the troll of the year award.

seriously man, contribute quality or just do us a favor and gtfo. I dont have all the answers nor have a lot of experience but dammit I try to back my shit up, step up or sit down and STFU
 

vta

Active member
Veteran
For instance, 2 days x 8/hrs/day x mimimum wage for 2 employees equals = $256. Compared to $13,500 it ain't "much". I'll even give you +- hundreds just for "whatever" and it still equals "not much".

I know a few peeps that work at a couple clubs. They don't make minimum wage..far from it. They also have fantastic health coverage, 401k, sick days, vacation. Sounds like a major expense to me.
 

PharmaCan

Active member
Veteran
Blue Dot, your ignorance knows no bounds! If you had a modicum of understanding of how a business works, what the monetary requirements are, you'd realize just how stupid you sound. People have tried to explain it to you, but your stupity overides the ability of information to enter your brain and be processed there.

I'm just curious why you think anyone should work for minimum wage? Minimum wage is a farcical kind of abstraction that has no meaning in current economic conditions. When I was 20 y.o., minimum wage was $2.50/hour. If you extrapolate that to today, an equivalent minimum wage would be about $20.00/hour, which is what the bottom rung of the economic ladder should be at right now, not the absurdly low $6.50 or whatever it is per hour now. It is absolutely disingenuous to suggest that anyone should take a job for shit wages, particularly when that job involves the risk of incurring enormous legal fees and possible imprisonment for long periods of time. Remember, they arrest the employees of the med stores too!

Even using the $13,500 as some kind of reference point is fallacious. It's pretty safe to assume that the store's meds cost roughly 40%-50% of what they sell for. So that $13,500 is actually closer to $7,000 in adjusted gross income. By the time you keep whittling away at that $7,000 (just for their employees, five employees x $30/hour cost of employees x 10 hours/day = $1,500/day =3,000/2 days). By the time you deduct all the other realistic expenses, the owner is probably making a good income commensurate with other self-employed business people. So what?

PC
 

soulfly22583

Trust me.. I'm A Professional..
Veteran
Did anyone else catch this?
Is this law or news reporter ignorance?
Was the handgun legal otherwise?

What about a certified private guard? What if they have a weapons permit? if so then I think the whole arms comment BD made is full of shit.
 

resinryder

Rubbing my glands together
Veteran
I meant not much because it is true, not some guess.

For instance, 2 days x 8/hrs/day x mimimum wage for 2 employees equals = $256. Compared to $13,500 it ain't "much". I'll even give you +- hundreds just for "whatever" and it still equals "not much".

Same goes for everything else.

Tell me, what exactly, besides buying and reselling are they "doing' to earn that profit?

That's kinda the dirty little secret of the dispensary biz isn't it? That it hardly takes any work at all compared to the profits made.
.


This just in-
The Obama Administration has named Blue Dot as the Marijuana Co-op Pay Czar for the State of California.
 
Last edited:

Latest posts

Latest posts

Top