Cannabis Oil from Stems

[Gray Wolf]

Cannabis Oil from Stems

I just performed an extraction that flies in the face of current accepted wisdom and which I would like to share.

What would you guess you get if you grind up a bunch of stems to fine granules in a coffee grinder and then extract the resins and oils using hexane?

Current wisdom says almost nothing, because the cannabinoids are in the trichomes on the surface of the plant.

In actuality I got 3.6 grams of honey oil out of 47.7 grams of material, or 7 ½% by weight.

Titration and testing showed it to be highly potent as a pain reliever both orally and topically, though it produces more of a stupor than a high at OD.

After grinding, a great deal of long fibers were produced, which didn’t chop up, and which we sifted out. I also did an extraction of that material and found while there were trace amounts, it was not worth extraction efforts and costs.

See attached photos of the two extractions after flash off:

GW

 

[etinarcadiaego]

I can't see the images?

I'm not familiar with the hexane extraction, but I've done a few BHO runs before. Is it possible that you're extracting (and feeling the effects of) some cannabinoid not present in the trichome, or perhaps just some other aspect of the plant?

I only ask because I just read this about 2 hours ago, which seems to state that cannabinoids are actually created and secreted on site @ the trichomes . . .

 

[Gray Wolf]

I can't see the images?

I'm not familiar with the hexane extraction, but I've done a few BHO runs before. Is it possible that you're extracting (and feeling the effects of) some cannabinoid not present in the trichome, or perhaps just some other aspect of the plant?

I only ask because I just read this about 2 hours ago, which seems to state that cannabinoids are actually created and secreted on site @ the trichomes . . .

Yeah I forgot to put it on and then wasn't as smart as the editing system.

GW

 

[Ms_Weekend]

where do you get hexane from?

 

[Gray Wolf]

I can't see the images?

I'm not familiar with the hexane extraction, but I've done a few BHO runs before. Is it possible that you're extracting (and feeling the effects of) some cannabinoid not present in the trichome, or perhaps just some other aspect of the plant?

I only ask because I just read this about 2 hours ago, which seems to state that cannabinoids are actually created and secreted on site @ the trichomes . . .

I read the same thing a number of different places, which is why this is a mind bender.

It may well be something other than cannabinoids, but it sure mimics their apearance and effect. It does have a different flavor however, without the peppery taste of high THC.

I can promise you that we are going to find out more because it is great stuff from a pain relief standpoint.

GW

 

[oldschoolfarmer]

Gray Wolf - first off, thank you for sharing this information. Mind if I ask a couple of questions?

-Were all of the stems from female plants? In your opinion, would Males have anything worth extracting?
-Can you explain how you use it for topical relief? (Meaning do you just apply it straight? or do you mix it with some other medium?) I've never quite figured out how to get topical relief from THC, but it'd sure be nice!

Thanks

 

[Gray Wolf]

where do you get hexane from?

A chemical supply house. It is available in a reagent grade or an industrial grade, which is used in electronics as a zero residue degreaser, sometimes also containing 1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane.

You can do the same thing with butane, it was just handier to run the small sample in hexane.

GW

 

[Gray Wolf]

Gray Wolf - first off, thank you for sharing this information. Mind if I ask a couple of questions?

-Were all of the stems from female plants? In your opinion, would Males have anything worth extracting?
-Can you explain how you use it for topical relief? (Meaning do you just apply it straight? or do you mix it with some other medium?) I've never quite figured out how to get topical relief from THC, but it'd sure be nice!

Thanks

All females in bloom. Males have cannabinoids too, just not as many, so I'm guessing yes.

I usually mix the cannabinoid oil with a menstruum like coconut oil for topical use, though I also use alcohol tinctures. If you use an alcohol tincture it will leave a stick residue.

Cannabinoids are transdermal, and when applied to the skin, will effectively relieve some types of pain within moments. It doesn't numb them, they just stop hurting.

GW

 

[Gray Wolf]

One more clarrirfication note, and that is that the pain relief probably isn't from the THC, but one of the other cannabinoids, with CBDs being the most likely culprit.

I haven't kept track, but the last time I looked, there were about 28 identified cannabinoids and the list was growing. Our beloved Mary Jane really is a serious medicinal plant and was for recorded history, until laws were passed saying that it had no medicinal value.

THC is the only one identified with any significant pschoactive properties, but the rest demonstrate properties from modulating the effect of the THC, to things like anti-bacterial and anti fungus properties.

THC has of course been demonstrated to cause some tumor cells to commit suicide and antibiotic resistant flesh eating bacteria are not resistant to the anti-bacterial cannabinoids.

Who knows where this will end up once we cut to the chase on cannabis medical research and stop playing this cat and mouse game about its medical value.

GW

 

[Papulz]

i too keep my stems and eventually run them for an ethanol quick wash.

 

[Gray Wolf]

i too keep my stems and eventually run them for an ethanol quick wash.

Good! May I ask how you prepare your stems for quick wash and what your product ends up being?

GW

 

[GanjaGage]

recently i did a QWISO run on a pretty large amount of stems, gave it 2 30sec washes and separated the products. After the second run, you could tell the stems were stripped of nearly all resin and were useless after.

The iso before evaporating was a bright green, but when evaporated ended up being dark black shatter.

i ended up mixing a little kief into the product to give it a better texture. the final product was great for what was used.

 

[Gray Wolf]

recently i did a QWISO run on a pretty large amount of stems, gave it 2 30sec washes and separated the products. After the second run, you could tell the stems were stripped of nearly all resin and were useless after.

The iso before evaporating was a bright green, but when evaporated ended up being dark black shatter.

i ended up mixing a little kief into the product to give it a better texture. the final product was great for what was used.

Good info! Thanks!

May I ask how much body effect you felt vis a vis head effect and what the head effect felt like compared to QWISO from prime leaf?

GW

 

[GanjaGage]

Good info! Thanks!

May I ask how much body effect you felt vis a vis head effect and what the head effect felt like compared to QWISO from prime leaf?

GW

Of course GW, since the stems were from numerous different strains, i couldn't tell you the specifics about what was used, but i only used stems containing visible trichs, and not much stalk from the plant at all.

The effects of my specific product was a hybrid feeling, both with a mind and body high. After mixing in some kief, you could tell the product was enhanced as well.

Overall a great use for a large amount of stems, I would prefer the QWISO vs. a BHO extraction on stems, since my past experiences with BHO + Stems have yielded a green colored oil in the end, I preferred the look of the QWISO.

 

[Papulz]

my oil generally comes out in a chewy caramel like consistency, although lately batches have been snapping when worked with. Generally a dark amber in color, and honestly stem oil has been some of the finest hash oil I've ever experienced. Perhaps due to being a mix of a multitude of strains.

I do not render my stems at all, rather I simply accumulate all the little stems taken out of grinders and larger bud stems and save them until 20 or so grams of them have piled up.

I usually shoot for a total exposure time of under 30 seconds.

P.S. I've kept an eye on you as well, and am delighted to see you bringing extractions to new levels. I see you making great strides in our community, strides that I can only hope to make one day as well.

 

[Gray Wolf]

Thank both of you for the good thoughts and sharing your experiences!

I will follow your suggestions and do an alcohol extraction as well, including a QWISO.

GW

 

[Ipsissimus]

I have founds stems to have more cannabinoids than leaves on immature females. Males are worth extracting if you have a large amount of material, but you might want to wash an iso extraction w/ your non polar solvent. I find hot iso has amazing penetration.

 

[cashmunny]

A chemical supply house. It is available in a reagent grade or an industrial grade, which is used in electronics as a zero residue degreaser also known as 1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane.

You can do the same thing with butane, it was just handier to run the small sample in hexane.

GW

That doesn't sound right. Ethane is a 2 carbon chain and hexane is 6 carbon, two different animals. Also I'm not sure how safe it would be to use a halogenated hydrocarbon like tetrafluoroethane. But I guess if they let you spray it all over circuit boards and inhale the fumes it can't be that bad.

 

[Gray Wolf]

That doesn't sound right. Ethane is a 2 carbon chain and hexane is 6 carbon, two different animals. Also I'm not sure how safe it would be to use a halogenated hydrocarbon like tetrafluoroethane. But I guess if they let you spray it all over circuit boards and inhale the fumes it can't be that bad.

Hexane and butane both work on cannabinoids, though not exactly the same ones. Hexane and butane currently extract different resins and oils from leaf material, so I'm predicting that won't change just because it is stem.

Please read my statement as stating that I believe either extraction process will work.

I can positively tell you that hexane does and I am in the process of pulverizing a column load for a butane run, so I will report back.

As for the 1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane, like everything else, the poison is in the dosage.

Acute oral toxicity (LD50): 25000 mg/kg [Rat]. The MSDS also has the following to say:

Special Remarks on other Toxic Effects on Humans:​

Acute Potential Health Effects:
Skin: May cause mild skin irritation. It can be absorbed through the skin in harmful amounts.
Eyes: May cause mild eye irritation.
Inhalation: May be harmful if inhaled. Inhalation of vapors may cause respiratory tract irritation. Overexposure
may affect, brain, spinal cord, behavior/central and peripheral nervous systems (lightheadness, dizziness,
hallucinations, paralysis, blurred vision, memory loss, headache, euphoria, general anesthetic, muscle weakness,
numbness of the extremeties, asphyxia, unconciousness and possible death), metabolism, respiration, blood,
cardiovascular system, gastrointestinal system (nausea)
Ingestion: May be harmful if swallowed. May cause gastrointestinal tract irritation with abdominal pain and
nausea. May also affect the liver, blood, brain, peripheral and central nervous systems. Symptoms of over
exposure by ingestion are similar to that of overexposure by inhalation.​

Section 12:

The question of course is not if you can eat the stuff, but if there is anywhere near 25,000 miligrams per kilogram of hexane left after it is evaporated off and then cooked in alcohol at 173F and water at 212F, with a boiling poing of 154.4F.

The answer is no, if that is your question.

GW

 

[Stond_Face]

Hey GW,

Any news on the butane run??

Cheers,
S_F