Can too much molasses cause mag deficiency?

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

Hey I have recently ran into a problem on some of my strains that I have never seen before.

The only thing thats has changed is i switched from humboldt nutrients prozyme to Hygrozyme. I really don't think that's the problem.

I've also started using Humboldt Honey. Sometimes I eyeball it and have been giving it at least 5ml per gallon with every feed.

My plants start showing this in the first few weeks of flowering...

I will post pics and the full list soon.

THANK YOU I appreciate it

 

[HeadyPete]

Too much of anything can lock out something else, but 5ml/gal is a reasonable dose, equal to a cal mag type product, which molasses is a direct organic replacement for.

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

I've also read that too much molasses can cause a calcium lockout??

I really need to figure this out it is spreading through my room

 

[Citizen024]

It is that really that calcium loaded? I read the label, and I know its in there, but theres that much huh. It can truly replace Cal Mag? How long will it sit in a res for before it needs to be changed? And its as available as Cal Mag? Really?

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

I have always had excellent results and the only thing I have changed is from Humboldt nutrients prozyme to Hygrozyme (same dose) and started using the liquid budswell. What is causing this!! it seems like magnesium deficiency but I feel like it also might be nitrogen deficiency because it's starting on all of the bottom leaves.

Please help me I can't figure this out!!!



How long has this problem been going on? Last month or so (usually starts around week 3 of flower)
What STRAIN are you growing? Banana, Sadhu, Cannalope Haze
What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?) clone
What is the age of your plants? (3 weeks or so into flower)
How long have they been in the soil mixture they are in now? (Since clone, I have always used this soil np)
How Tall are the plants? 2.5-3.5 ft
What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? Flower
What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc) Bush
What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot) 3 gallon smartpots
What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you using? (percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?) Roots Organic Soil
What Nutrient's are you using? Biobizz: grow, fish, bloom, algamic, topmaxx, hygrozyme, Budswell (liquid), humboldt honey), and a one off feeding of epsom salts
How much of each nutrient are you using with how much water? *Knowing the brand is very helpful* At four weeks I'm at: grow:6ml/g, fish:6ml/g, Alg:11ml/g, Bloom:11ml/g, Topmaxx: 2ml/g, Hygro:5ml/g Honey:5ml/g budswell:10ml/g, and the one off epsom was a tablespoon per 2.5 gallons at week three
How often are you feeding? Every 3-4 days throw in a straight water occasionally
If flowering, when did you switch over to using Bloom nutrients? Week one but did not slow down on veg nutes
What order are you mixing your nutrients? (example: veg nutes 1st, bloom 2nd ect) G,F,A,B,T,H,Budswell,honey
What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used? (I've read that ec is pointless with biobizz and a bluelab meter???
What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"? 6.5 in 6.4 out
What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen? Bluelab combo meter
How often are you watering? Every 3-4 days
When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding? Two days ago and almost every time I water
What size bulb are you using? 1000w Hortilux super hps
What is the distance to the canopy? 20in
What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity) 40-55%
What is the canopy temperature? 72-78f
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range) 72-78 day, 63-68 night
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.) 4in 180cfm intake, 6in 460cfm exhaust and 8in 750cfm cooling 2 1k lights in 4x8 darkroom
Tell us about your ventilation, intake exhaust and when its running and not running ? Always running
Is the fan blowing directly at plants? no
Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist? no
Is your water HARD or SOFT? Tap water filtered through smallboy
What water are you using? Reverse Osmosis (RO)? Tap? Bottled? Well water? Distilled? Mineral Water? filtered (smallboy)
Are you using water from a water softener? no
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched? yes in last two weeks
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when? Pure spray green 1/40 ratio twice at beginning of flower and a few times during veg
Are plant's infected with pest's? Few fungus gnats

https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=7921&pictureid=139904

https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=7921&pictureid=139903

https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=7921&pictureid=139902

 

[KnuckleHedd]

I use 5ml a gallon, too. That 15ml that so many people swear by just seems like way too much imho. I don;t believe there's enough Ca in there to cause a lock out, especially at 5 ml per gallon. My water has far more Ca than mollasses does. I've been using Hygrozyme for several years myself. You say you're 2 weeks into 12/12? If you switch from veg nutes to entirely bloom nutes at day 1 of 12/12 they can deplete the N in a hurry. I had that problem years ago. They're still using a lot of N the first 3 weeks or so. I continue with a little veg nutes untl around the end of stretch. The yellowing leaves at the bottom of the plant....if they're yellowing uniformly it's probably N def. If they're yellowing but the veins are remaining green (forming green chevrons or sargents stripes) it's probably Mg. High temps could be a factor, too.Hope this helps

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

hmm. Temps have been fine nothing over 80, and with biobizz you feed veg and bloom all the way through, between the fish mix and biogrow I'm probably giving more veg than bloom for the first couple weeks anyways. I think your right I think it is a little bit of both mag and nitrogen but I'm not sure this is really weird and I've never had this problem before.

ANYONE??? PLEASE??

 

[Lazyman]

Fungus gnats, add mosquito dunks from hardware store to res, if persistent diluted rubbing alcohol as a soil drench works very well, repeat 3-4 days later to kill off any new eggs and break lifecycle.

 

[VirginHarvester]

It is that really that calcium loaded? I read the label, and I know its in there, but theres that much huh. It can truly replace Cal Mag?

Blackstrap Molasses seems to have quite a bit in it. How much is bioavailable, I do not know. But I would think half way through flower many strains would only need a phosphorus source and molasses if using quality soil. If I remember correctly it also has nitrogen.

As to how molasses acts in a hydro environment I have absolutely no idea.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=118

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

I think i have gone over the 5ml mark a few times and eyeballed it because I thought the honey really couldn't do that much damage. DOES ANYONE THINK IT IS A CALCIUM LOCKOUT?

 

[EvilTwin]

Self,
Shot in the dark...but I've never had calcium problems unless my ph was way out of wack. Usually meaning too high.
ET

 

[asomugha]

You use topmax too? cos there's molasses in there also.
I don't think your problem is this, though.

A gram per liter of 'regular' molasses (one I got from a bio-shop) brings an extra 20-35ppm of K, 4-10 ppm Ca, 1-2ppm Mg, a little Fe and P.

Given manufacturers sell -expensive- bottles that have mostly water in 'em, if you do plan on using molasses (I do, they're great) go the "food" way (it can be used for baking cakes) instead of the nutes' way , it'll be way cheaper + you'll know how much you put...

 

[Blue Dot]

Blackstrap molasses doesn't have nearly the amount of Ca as it does potassium.

K will cause a cation antagonism towards Ca and vice versa.

Molasses also has a ton of Fe and Fe will lockout Mn and Zn.

Molasses is not a direct replacement for CalMag. Actually you should use CalMag with molasses to prevent the K/Ca imbalance.

 

[fyahfohigha]

check the ratios. humbolt nutes put out a lot of changing info recently, because they didn't give ratios for generic use. They had a lot of CO2 going, the climate up north, and high feed plants. Causing lock out for some one using the opposite. Straight french fried plants, and it shows up in like week 3/4 induced, all of the sudden, like a bat out of hell. and it doesn't stop. Not saying this is the case, but just double check it.

 

[lordbudly]

fungus gnats eat your roots or atleast the feeder hairs i believe, any nutrient problem i would attribute to them destroying the necessary part of the root to absorb the nute, just like root rot causes all kinds of "deficiencies"

 

[Citizen024]

Want to save big $ on zymes? Go get the bacterial pond cleaner stuff and read up on barley malt extracts. $20 for a lb or so. And get this: 3 tbs for 100 gallons. Yeah. And it works incredibly well, it will shock on massive overdose, but no burn potential even then. Side by side tests to canna and hygro showed it to superior.

Matter at hand- shit you got me. You seem solid as can be. Yes mag, but no real reason why.

I personally have no interest in Bio-Bizz. Bio Heaven= $250 a gallon. The fuck? And its got most the mircos and ca in it if I remember correctly. I notice your not using it. If I remember correctly it has some of the key elements in it. You do have all kinds of everything else though.

Perhaps something conditional is effecting them. Drying soil due to breeze, uneven watering. . I don't something innocent but a change since you last run. Your environment does sound pretty cherry. A couple fungus gnats aint causing that.

 

[bongoie]

Just recently i have tried blackstrap molasses
Chuckling at the comment that there's molasses in topmax as i have tasted it and it dose'nt taste like molasses
Thanks for all the input folks

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

I wonder if you are on to something with the soil drying out, I have 2 1ks in a 4x8 tent and was having a hard time keeping temps down awhile ago so i bought and oscillating fan and it blows pretty hard on the plants 24x7. Can uneven watering and the soil drying out cause these types of issues??

Now my plants are showing nitrogen deficiency hard core and I am getting little rust spots all over the tops of my leaves. wtf I've never ever had these problems before. Some plants show one symptom some plants show both.

Thank you all for the replies!!

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

I have switched from 5 gallon smart pots to 3 gallon smart pots and am still trying to get used to the new watering schedule and have more than once opened the tent to see all the leaves drooping.

Also I have used sticky traps and beneficial nematodes to battle the fungus gnats and have never seen any larva when repotting. I would just be sick if all this was the fungus gnats fault They will all f-ing die if this is the case

 

[fyahfohigha]

maybe it is the same problem I had. Like they said, it doesn't sound like a couple fungus gnats. I thought I was having bad N-P-K problems for a while, but there was no way, since I was on a mild organic store bough VermiT brand tea with RO, roots organic soil, and a simple enzyme tea here and there. after cutting down to water for two weeks the real bitch showed her face. Blight, caused by fungus infection and disease, light Powder Mildew. Probably from the great quality cuts I got (should have started from seed). Funny how patients will fuck other patients for a couple bucks by spreading plant VD's via clones by ditching sick cuts to their local clubs.