REMINDER for those who dont FLUSH

[deathtosoapbar]

I personally always try to flush for 3 weeks even in organic grow it does make a difference to smoothness of smoke no headache etc for example ive just suddenly had to move house and had to cut a plant early and unflushed and its truly chlorophyl tasting rank...i know a cure would help but still not how it would be if hadnt had to cut early

 

[Anti]

I personally always try to flush for 3 weeks even in organic grow it does make a difference to smoothness of smoke no headache etc for example ive just suddenly had to move house and had to cut a plant early and unflushed and its truly chlorophyl tasting rank...i know a cure would help but still not how it would be if hadnt had to cut early

This is exactly what I'm talking about. ^^^^ From reading this, I assume that he is not curing his bud.

What we need is a test where:

• 4 clones of same plant (or more if space, time permitted)
• All four grown in same medium, in same cab, under same conditions, same food, everything.
• Two get flushed for the same length of time.

• Two don't get flushed.
• Dry all plants the same way.
• Cure one of the flushed and one of the non flushed.
• Leave one flushed and one non flushed un-cured.

 

[icough2getoff]

I've tried flushing and not flushing for years trying to decide for myself if flushing makes a difference in hydro. Some of my best tasting buds have come from plants that were not flushed. I will note that I feed my plants on the light end, while many growers on here are probably trying to pump as much nutes as they can into the plant. I think this may be why so many people say their un-flushed buds taste like crap. My belief is if you properly feed your plant throughout it's whole life cycle you're buds will burn smooth and taste great without a 0 ppm water flush.

My un-flushed buds ALWAYS burn into a white ash, so the theory that you can only get that from flushed buds is complete BS. I've tested this with probably more than 15 strains.

 

[deathtosoapbar]

This is exactly what I'm talking about. ^^^^ From reading this, I assume that he is not curing his bud.

What we need is a test where:

• 4 clones of same plant (or more if space, time permitted)
• All four grown in same medium, in same cab, under same conditions, same food, everything.
• Two get flushed for the same length of time.

• Two don't get flushed.
• Dry all plants the same way.
• Cure one of the flushed and one of the non flushed.
• Leave one flushed and one non flushed un-cured.

The result would be simple the flushed un cured would be better smoke than
the non flushed un cured...but optimum would obviously be flushed AND cured

 

[Anti]

The result would be simple the flushed un cured would be better smoke than
the non flushed un cured...but optimum would obviously be flushed AND cured

The results I'd be really interested in would be the cured but not flushed vs flushed but not cured. I'd also be interested in seeing if cured AND flushed was any less potent or less yielding than cured but not flushed.

Having done some reading in this thread and others, I'm going to opt not to flush my upcoming harvest, but to dry and cure it normally and see what happens.

 

[buddin_904]

"Flushing" weed is the most retarded idea ever....

I thought this was put to bed back in the OG days.... someone did like a 10 page writeup on the biochemical processes going on and the fact that your essentially STARVING your plant in its MOST PRODUCTIVE stage! [I need to read farther: it was vaaran, thats right, and its right there to observe page 2, kudos!]


.

ha, i agree with hella. you grow your plant as vigorous as possible with a shitload of nutes the whole life cycle, then during the !!!!resin production/budswelling PRIMETIME weeks, you starve it and make it use all stored nutes....which for example ive seen myself, it really stunts the plant! If you watch greenhouse vids they show their plants at the end of harvest with fully green leaves, not even yellows. i believe a shorter "flush" conducted of about 3?-4? days would be of most benefit if you wish to flush. i personally would nute all the day to those last days, then 3-4 days before cut apply strong florakleen and let it sit for the rest of the pot life. during those last days the plant actually will switch over to instant reserves, im not sure if its in the form of carbos or what not.> but the plant can better sustain itself for 4 days of un-nuted growth better than 2!!!!! weeks, not to mention the best weeks!

 

[icough2getoff]

Here's a link to that classic write up Vaaran did that Hella is talking about. I think someone else posted this earlier in this thread.

A critical look at preharvest flushing

"Summary:

Preharvest flushing puts the plant(s) under serious stress. The plant has to deal with nutrient deficiencies in a very important part of its cycle. Strong changes in the amount of dissolved substances in the root-zone stress the roots, possibly to the point of direct physical damage to them. Many immobile elements are no more available for further metabolic processes. We are loosing the fan leaves and damage will show likely on new growth as well.

The grower should react in an educated way to the plant needs. Excessive, deficient or unbalanced levels should be avoided regardless the nutrient source. Nutrient levels should be gradually adjusted to the lesser needs in later flowering. Stress factors should be limited as far as possible. If that is accomplished throughout the entire life cycle, there shouldn’t be any excessive nutrient compounds in the plants tissue. It doesn’t sound likely to the author that you can correct growing errors (significant lower mobile nutrient compound levels) with preharvest flushing.

Drying and curing (when done right) on the other hand have proved (In many studies) to have a major impact on taste and flavour, by breaking down chlorophylls and converting starches into sugars. Most attributes blamed on unflushed buds may be the result of unbalanced nutrition and/or overfert and unproper drying/curing."

 

[HellaFella420]

It dosent matter, no-one reads or uses critical thinking skills around here.....


They stick to what they "know".......



whatever

 

[bbing]

It is strain dependent to a large degree; however, most strains maturate and die after fruiting. When this happens you can get a nice color show as sugars in the leaves are converted and all the remaining resources in the plant are used up.

The true art to cannabis growing is getting everything to peak at the right time and then FINISH at the right time with the appropriate (whatever the hell that is) levels of gland development and cannabinoid development.

Some strains i have difficulty with and appear to have been fucked with genetically enough to throw the finish off ..Bullrider comes to mind (at least to what us humans consider the appropriate fininsh for our heads...hehe). Some strains work out perfect. There are many physical/environemtal/nutritional ways to fuck it up as well so you will have to sort those things out as well....

To flush or not to flush when running in non-soil mediums is a question that takes only a couple of runs to answer for yourself....I have no reason to convert any of you...

 

[Woall]

if you have buds that taste really harsh, induce violent coughing, and give you headaches, is it harmful to smoke it? Lately I have been smoking some stuff that I didn't grow myself and I am guessing it wasn't flushed and or cured properly. How harmful could this sort of harsh hitting weed be from a health standpoint?

 

[icough2getoff]

Woall, if what you're smoking is giving you a headache I wouldn't smoke it. They might have had spider mites or something and sprayed their plants with some nasty pesticides. How would you know unless you grew it? Probably not worth the risk. Nothing I've grown has ever given me a headache.

I live near lots of farmlands and wine country and I'd like someone who believes in straight water flushing to explain to me why at harvest time the leaves are always healthy and green for grapes that make world class wine, apples, oranges, avocados etc. If you don't believe me go do a google image search for farm harvests and see for yourself.

The more that I hear silence after questions like these the more I loose hope that anybody on here really knows what they're talking about (though experiences are always appreciated, but seem to vary quite a bit). Sure would be nice to have some real discussion about this though. Maybe some day...

 

[TGT]

I flush for a week and I do hydro nutes in Promix, only because I was always told too. I didn't a few times and I didn't notice any difference. Can;t say with real soil though.

TGT

 

[LJB]

to be honest i noticed more of a differance when i harvested first thing in the morning, before the plant gets light/wakes up, then when i harvested in the afternoon, or god-forbid the night time, after a full day of light.

yes.

http://www.cannabisculture.com/v2/articles/2159.html

Harvesting in the morning ensures that your plant will be at peak THC content, as cannabis has shown THC fluctuations peaking in morning and dropping during the day. Some growers leave their lights off for several days before harvest to increase potency. This seems to have some scientific validity as light has been shown to degrade THC, hence the morning peaks. As light is the degrading factor and the plant still has the ability to manufacture THC during darkness, leaving the lights off for a day or two before harvest likely utilizes the plants stored potential for THC conversion without any opportunity for it to be degraded into cannabinol (CBN) and other breakdown products.8

same writer on flushing:

Much time and thought has been put into the feeding needs of each part of marijuana's life cycle, yet for some reason the final stages of resin development always seem to be ignored. But the vegetative period of plant growth is only setting the platform for us to produce the trichomes that we are after.

Flushing in particular seems to be something that is over-emphasized by many of today's growers. Many growers "flush" their plants with straight water or clearing agents during the final weeks before harvest in an effort to improve taste and smokeability. The theory is that this forces the plant to use up stored nutrients that may affect these qualities. Although this is certainly true to some extent, what many are forgetting is that not all nutrients can be moved within the plant.

Nitrogen, which is the main factor in poor-tasting bud, can be moved within the plant. If not present in the root zone a plant will take it from the older leaves to support newer growth. Calcium, however, is a nutrient that cannot be moved within the plant, if it is not present in the root zone it is not available for growth. Little research has been done on nutritional requirements of cannabis during the final stages of flowering, but it seems likely that calcium is vital as it is crucial in cell division. A calcium deficiency at later stages could therefore adversely affect trichome production.

This is not as serious of a concern for soil-based growers, as lime or other calcium sources which are mixed into the soil likely will provide sufficient nutrition even while flushing with pure water. But hydroponic growers using very pure water sources with little naturally occurring calcium could have problems. Flushing is certainly a valid technique, but is easily overdone and is not a quick fix for overfeeding earlier in the flower stage.

Some studies have shown that high potassium levels have a negative influence on THC production,4 which would correlate to the general belief that while hemp crops uptake more potassium than phosphorous, the reverse seems to be true for drug and seed cannabis crops.2 A study on how to minimize THC levels in hemp crops showed that THC levels in newer leaf growth decreased as nitrogen levels were increased.5 As no THC measurement was taken from floral clusters we can only speculate that the same would likely hold true in buds. This would also explain the good results that most growers have flushing their plants, as nitrogen is the nutrient most easily flushed from the soil.

 

[Anti]

"You must spread some rep around before giving it to LJB again."

You are a fountain of useful information, my friend.

 

[Hydro-Soil]

Will flushing ruin the quality of my seeds by stunting them at their final stages of development?

Never fully grew for seeds before.... no idea.

Should I just skip the flush since I'm more concerned about the seeds than the bud?

I'd back off the nutes possibly, drop them down to around 0-6-12 maybe? It will reduce the taste from the nutes.


I also use GH nutes and used the 3-part for a number of years at the Lucas ratio. I followed the simple changeout method and never flushed. Yeah, it's ok unflushed at 0-8-16 strength and definitely better than anything else I've gotten but a 4-5 day flush does make a big difference.

I use the FloraNova now and love it. Definitely need at least a few days flush to get rid of the taste in my veggies and a 5 day flush makes a significant difference in the bud. I don't think I'd go a full 2 weeks though since I'm using hydroton. Unflushed it's STILL better than most of the dispensary bud I've come across.

 

[bbing]

Grow enough of these plants out and your going to have a better understanding of cannabis life cycle.

Just to re-emphasize the one critical factor that makes it impossible to declare anything other than a "generalized" result....yeah baby:

DEPENDS on STRAIN

I have gone through strains that really don't require a flush or are debilitated by density shifts in the root mediums like water..

Some, like grape ape, taste like shit or like fresh hot cotton candy depending on flush is not flushed...

Plants finishing their lifecycle are a much different process than a starved plant in fruit; however they tend to occur close to the same time for most strains.....


I still subscribe to BOG's 24hr of dark before harvest to "cloud" her up....though seldom practice this anymore

The Ca question is interesting, but in water mediums wouldn't Ca tend to buffer the water to a higher PH when not proportioned the acidic nutrient salts???Like just running Calmag?

 

[icough2getoff]

LJB, thanks for posting that. That is some of the most detailed info I've read next to Vaaran's write up.

 

[LJB]

You're welcome anti, icough.

If it's true that N is the main factor in poor taste, I'm interested in comparing three groups - (1) seven-ten day flush with only water - (2) no flush, bloom to the very end - (3) last seven-ten days continue to feed, but with no N.

 

[endlesssummer]

I think we can all agree that feeding should be stopped at least a few weeks before harvest to let the plant use what's left in the ground and in it's own stores.

I don't think flushing is necessary if you water them with straight water for the last few weeks... no stress for the plants.

 

[LJB]

I think we can all agree that feeding should be stopped at least a few weeks before harvest to let the plant use what's left in the ground and in it's own stores.

that probably works well for indoor and outdoor soil growers, but not hydro. With a hydro system one could be battling crucial deficiencies.

note the awesome writeup by varaan from the OG.COM FAQ and the article from Cannabis Culture magazine, both of which are linked to and excerpted on the previous page.