Quick ? about soil and pot sizes

[whadeezlrg]

going to buy some dirt today, im going to be filling up 5- 3 or 4 gallon pots (with any luck i'd rather have the 4gal), going with ocean forest and im just wondering if someone could tell me how much soil I will need. 20gal of soil total and I plan on adding extra perlite. basically just trying to find out what the cu. ft. of a gallon of soil is so I know how much to buy. quick reply's greatly appreciated

 

[sns_stealth]

youll be ok with the 20 gal with enough perilite to make the ratio about 70/30 soil/perilte.

VERY IMPORTANT ?..... are you transplanting or starting? if trans. than you just wont need as much, however if your starting new FFOF has to much nutes in for seedlings.

12 min quick enough....lol

 

[whadeezlrg]

yeah i need 20 gallons just wondering how gallons translate into cubic feet or bags of soil (each bag is 1.5cubic feet) I.E. i will need x number of bags for 20 gal. of soil. hopefully that makes sense i used to know the formula to find out the volume of a cylinder but have since forgot something like dia x height x Pi or something who knows?



Edit:"The formula I use is a little different than Al's. It is also less precise, but should get you close.
The primary difference is this formula doesn't take the smallest and largest radius, it uses the average radius.
The formula is R^2 * Pi * H / 1728 = Volume (cu ft)."

guess i was pretty close

 

[whadeezlrg]

yup thanks for the quick reply seedlings at just about 4 weeks from sprouting all of them are in 1 gallon pots and need to be transplanted today they have been showing signs of being rootbound for the last 4-5 days theyre all approx 6-8 tall on their 7-8 set of real leaves with some leaves as big as my hand already 3 AfPak bagseeds and 2 DP fem'd skunk#1, I really dont think that burning will be an issue with these ladys the afpaks are probably the best seed plants ive ever run as of right now, also I plan on making this my final transplant and i don't plant on making the switch until the beg. of July so is 4gal good enough for the long haul or sould I go with something bigger?

 

[sns_stealth]

also I plan on making this my final transplant and i don't plant on making the switch until the beg. of July so is 4gal good enough for the long haul or sould I go with something bigger?

yeah, no problem with burning at that age just watch how much nutes you add too it. if your rootbound now @ 1gal, a month of veg will certainly fill up a 4 gal. if you insist on only one more transfer than is say 5 gal would be better. for example, we go from a 1gal to a 3gal within a week of switch and can still get some rootbound. its just that that extra month of veg will be adding just as much below the surface as above.

IDK any of the volume calcs but you should be able to get off google. thats how I do most of my conversion...lol

 

[luvgrowin]

I doubt your plants are rootbound at only 4 weeks old in i gallon of soil. I now have my plants in just over 1 gallon pots and they are 2 weeks from harvest, I vegged them for 3 weeks and to this day I dont think that mine are rootbound. I am expecting 2 oz's per plant. With your ammount of veg time, I think it would be safe to say 4 gallons of soil will be perfect, you could even go with 3 gallons but if you have the space to use 4 gallons then go for it. As for the ffof soil, you will be fine. I used ocean forest to sprout seeds with no ill effect.
Happy Growing!!!!

 

[whadeezlrg]

thanks for the replies gonna have do do the google calculator i guess, i just pulled one of them out of the pot and its crazy rootbound, and its covered in bennies. I started my seeds in an 8oz cup, transplanted as soon as i saw roots coming out of the holes in the bottom of the cups into the 1 gallons aprox. 3weeks ago, I put a pinch of tarantula and a pinch of pihrana in each pot and they love it. growth in the 1 gal was super vigoros until about 4 days ago now they are showing definite signs of rootbound (slower growth, just dont have the raised up leaves, you know a happy looking plant) any one think i will have problems veg'n under a 400watt hps for the remainder of june? I didnt design my veg box for containers that large and im thinking of just hanging the light over the extra bathtub for the next few weeks until i make the switch, i want some big bitches

 

[whadeezlrg]

5 gal(US liquid) = 0.668 cubic feet (or 2 / 3rds of one)
1 dry gallon = 0.155 of a cu ft or roughly 10- 1gal pots out of each bag of soil

Got'em so im guessing 2 bags of ffof and 1 bag of perlite oughta do it

Also came across this little read might be worth checking out to anyone who's trying to figure out exactly what they will need


"
For 40 years I've grown most of my vegetables in pots of all shapes and sizes aquired second hand from a landscaper friend.
First I learned to NEVER trust what the pot says on the pot label, or on the pot itself or even from the manufacturer of that pot (I've looked them up on the web to try and determine the real volume sizes).
What they call a 5 gallon for example could be endless different sizes, bigger on top, smaller on bottom, 'squat' pots, tall pots and the like... no standard that I can see.
The pots I've bought at the big box stores and wallyworld have labels on them that are obviously totally wrong as to volume size (usually marked in qts).
The largest part of the problem seems to be that the volume measurements are figured in liquid gallons, which is fine if you are wondering how many gallons of water your pot would hold. But you need to know how many DRY gallons of soil/mix it holds.
To give you an example- the ubiquitous and popular 5 gallon bucket ( I love em... grow my smaller cukes, peas, small tomatoes, chinese cabbage etc in them)- when you calculate for DRY volume is really only 4.29 gallons. That would be filled to the brim with soil, so it's actually a little less since the soil line is always a few inches down, probably closer to 4.25 gallons.
A 5 gallon bucket filled with 4.25 DRY gallons is also about... 1,142 cubic inches or 0.66 cubic ft or 0.024 cubic yards or 17.16 DRY quarts or about 79 cups. It is also almost 1/2 of a bushel- (handy to know when using the bucket for mixing soil mix/fertilizer etc in bulk).
I've listed below all the conversions I have in my garden notebooks, that I hope might help.
1 dry gallon = 4 dry quarts
1 dry gallon = 4.65 liquid quarts or 1.163 liquid gallons
1 dry gallon = 268.8 cu inches
1 dry gallon = 0.155 of a cu ft
1 dry gallon = 0.125 of a bushel, (1 bushel= 8.25 dry gal)
1 dry gallon = 18.61 cups (1 liquid gal= 16 cups)
Cubic measurements take all three dimensions into consideration - width, length and height. Let's say you have a garden bed you want to buy or mix soil for. The bed is to be 2 foot deep, 16 feet long and 4 feet wide. That's 2 x 16, x 4 = 128 cubic feet.
There are 27 cubic feet in a cubic yard. Just divide the number of cubic feet (128 in the example of the above bed) by 27 to arrive at the number of cubic yards of material you need to fill the bed- in this case about 4 and 3/4 yards.
Filling a pot is the same process, just smaller amounts of material and different equations. For a square or rectangular pot find the cubic inches by multiplying the length by the width by the depth of the pot. That will equal the cubic inches in the pot.
Let's say the pot is 14 inches long by 9 inches wide by 8 inches deep. 14x9x8= 1,008 cu in. Divide that 1,108 cubic inches by 268.8 (the number of cubic inches in a dry gallon) and it will equal about a 3 and 3/4 DRY gallon capacity for that pot.
1 cubic foot = 6.42 dry gallons, (7.48 liquid gallons), or 25.71 dry quarts or 119.68 cups
1 cubic foot = 1,728 cubic inches (To convert cubic feet into cubic inches, you would multiply by 1,728.)
(Multiply cubic inches by 0.0005787 to get cubic feet.)
(Multiply cubic feet by 1.2 to get bushels.)
(Multiply bushels by 0.8 to get cubic feet.)
1 cubic yard = 27 cubic feet or 46,656 cubic inches. (Multiply cubic inches by 0.00002143 to get cubic yards.)
(Multiply bushels by 0.04545 to get cubic yards.)
I saw the following short question/answer a while ago-it shows just one reason to figure in DRY gallons when calculating for the garden-
"I went out to the farmers Co Op the other day and bought a 32 gallon garbage can of rabbit manure. They charged me $2.00 stating that the 32 gallons was 1/4 of a cubic yard which sells for $8.00 per yard, thus the $2.00. I was wondering about the math. How many gallons are in a cubic yard? Answer= 27(cubic feet in 1 cubic yard) times 1,728 (cubic inches in 1 cubic foot) tells us that there are 46,656 cubic inches in one cubic yard. Using DRY measure and dividing 46,656 cubic inches in a cubic yard by 268.8 cubic inches in a dry gallon, we get 173.57 dry U.S. gallons in a cubic yard. Divide that by four, and you get 43.39 gallons in 1/4 cubic yard. Looks to me like you were shorted 11.39 gallons."
Mike34- figuring out the volume of round pots is different than the equation above for a square or rectangular one. Both the formulas that Tapla & Justaguy gave you to figure out your volume based on your pot dimensions of 14" diameter at the base, 19" diameter at the top, and 17" height, will work fine, but I figure only up to the point that each used liquid measurements in the calculations.
for justaguy's- he said....
"The formula I use is a little different than Al's. It is also less precise, but should get you close.
The primary difference is this formula doesn't take the smallest and largest radius, it uses the average radius.
The formula is R^2 * Pi * H / 1728 = Volume (cu ft).
So 14 at the bottom and 19 at the top D (diameter)=(14+19)/2 or 16.5. R then is 8.25.
R^2(68.0625) *Pi (3.14) *H (17) /1728= 2.1 cu ft.
There are 7.5 gallons in a cubic foot so 2.1 * 7.5= 15.75 gallons."
So, Justaguy used the 7.5 LIQUID gallons in a cubic foot, multiplied by the 2.1 cubic feet from the above equation, to calculate that your pot would be a 15.75 gallon pot.
But if you multiply that same 2.1 cubic feet by the 6.428 DRY gallons in a cubic foot, the pot would hold only 13.49 (let's say 13 and 1/2) gallons of dry soil/ mix/ fertilizer etc..
Tapla figured it in a different way.. coming up with 3,663.84 cubic inches of volume based on a different (and more accurate but tougher) equation. He divided those 3,663.84 cubic inches by the 231 cubic inches in a LIQUID gallon and calculated your pot to be a 15.86 gallon pot.
But again, if you divide those 3,662.84 cubic inches by the 268.8 cubic inches in one DRY gallon, the pot would hold 13.62 gallons of dry soil mix. (Again let's just call it 13 and one-half gallons.)
When all is said and done, is your 13 and one-half gallon pot big enough for your large tomato? Many posts here say no and many say yes. It all depends on your conditions, fertilizing, water, stress (the tomato's stress, not yours) the variety of tomato etc.
It's hard to judge by someone else's success or failure based on pot size. And, whenever I read in a book or see on a college or state extension service site that a plant needs a certain minimum gallon size to grow well, are THEY talking of a wet or dry gallon pot?
I currently have baby cucumbers on 4 foot vines, tendrils wrapped through the window screens as they climb all over my screened porch, and they are still in their original tiny 6 packs.
You get the picture. Forgive me if I've made a late night error in transcribing these figures.
I sure hope this helps."

http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/contain/msg0703302922644.html - the source of the article

 

[pinecone]

1.5 cubic feed is about 10-gallons so you need about 2-bags.

youll be ok with the 20 gal with enough perilite to make the ratio about 70/30 soil/perilte.

If you mix in 30 percent perlite into FFOF you will have a mixture that is more perlite than soil. FFOF already has a ton of perlite in it (guessing 25-30% by volume). It works very good without added perlite.

VERY IMPORTANT ?..... are you transplanting or starting? if trans. than you just wont need as much, however if your starting new FFOF has to much nutes in for seedlings.

I've started over 100 cannabis seeds in str8 OF without difficulty. I've also started a lot of pepper, tomato, and herb seeds in it. It works just fine.

Pine

 

[luvgrowin]

Wow, Your roots must be growing like crazy!! Have you considered transplanting them into a 2 or 3 gallon container for the remainding veg period ? ,,Will your veg box fit those sizes. If so Thats what I would do. Them when its time to switch to 12/12 then transplant into the 4-5 gallon pots. I heard that its better to tramsplant in steps because the roots will fill more into the soil instead of growing straight down then all around the sides leaving the center consisting of mainly wasted soil.
I like to use 1 gallon pots then when I start flowering I cut the bottoms out and doulble pot em. I only veg for a short time so There for I can get away with that.
Anyways, I hope I may of helped out a little!!!

 

[sns_stealth]

1.5 cubic feed is about 10-gallons.

If you mix in 30 percent perlite into FFOF you will have a mixture that is more perlite than soil. FFOF already has a ton of perlite in it. I use OF without adding any perlite to it.

I've started over 100 cannabis seeds in str8 OF without difficulty. I've also started a lot of pepper, tomato, and herb seeds in it. It works just fine.

Pine

with enough perilite to make the ratio about 70/30 soil/perilte
I didnt say to add 30%, I said to add enough to make it that ratio.


I also started many seeds with OF, then i ran in to some strains that got burnt immediately and through research found others having the same problem. is it probable no, is it possible yes. if you like spending that much on soil more power to ya. MG organic W/ FF nutes is cheaper and way more controlable anyhow.

gl whad sorry for the jack

 

[pinecone]

Wow, Your roots must be growing like crazy!!

Seriously! My definition of root bound in soil is when you have to thoroughly water (by submersion) daily and it still isn't enough to prevent drooping.

I have some SSH plants that are 9-weeks old, in 4" pots (I'm guessing about 0.5 gallon), that are just starting to get root bound by the above definition. They are still growing though. If they hadn't been bent over they would be 2' tall.

Picture- there is some yellowing that would be alleviated by a transplant - but overall still very healthy.

Have you considered transplanting them into a 2 or 3 gallon container for the remainding veg period ? ,,Will your veg box fit those sizes. If so Thats what I would do. Them when its time to switch to 12/12 then transplant into the 4-5 gallon pots. I heard that its better to tramsplant in steps because the roots will fill more into the soil instead of growing straight down then all around the sides leaving the center consisting of mainly wasted soil.
I like to use 1 gallon pots then when I start flowering I cut the bottoms out and doulble pot em. I only veg for a short time so There for I can get away with that.

I second this.

I didnt say to add 30%, I said to add enough to make it that ratio.

My bad.

Pine

 

[whadeezlrg]

no worries man my last run was a mix of MG organic the brown bag stuff (which came with a free lifetime supply of fungus gnats) , some used coco and a little other random soil perlite mix i had made for outdoor last year it worked really well just thought i'd try the fox farms mainly because i dont want to mess around with bugs at all im almost thinking that MG comes with some spider mites also but hard to say as my clone source has a bad infestation that he apparently thinks he doesn't have although it's possibly the worst case of those bastards ive ever seen hence the seed run. enough rambling. if i am unable to get a decent price on the ffof then MG here i come again and at last a couple shots of the last run 1st pic OG 2nd Green Crack

 

[whadeezlrg]

yeah ive got some 2.5 gal pots layin around but ive always found it to be a PITA to transplant out of anything bigger than a 1 gal but possibly something to consider. and sadly they wont fit it my veg box 24"w x 14"d x 20"h pix to come in a few.

 

[luvgrowin]

Wow! That Green Crack plant looks nice!! Was it tasty or what!! I have some Blue Cheese going now (43 days flowering) and my mouth waters everytime I look at them. Thats how that green crack plant looks, something you just cant wait to smoke!!!

 

[whadeezlrg]

pine- nice ive been reading up on the stacking method but am nervous to cut off all the roots
LG- yup that GC was real nice had the sweetest taste but it smelled like some old urine my girl was always able to "name that weed" as soon as the jar opened up sadly ....all GONE

and the moment we've all been waiting for... drum roll please




from left to right : an afpak sitting in the veg box to give you an idea of the lighting i got goin on, Group shot afpak in the back and Dutch passion Skunk # 1 in the front, Afpak leaf ( I can palm a basketball), the 3 afpaks lookin kinda sad as of the last few days, The Skunks, and a whole group shot in the box (clones are adjusting to the light for the next couple days)

 

[luvgrowin]

When I cut the bottoms off my pots I was just real careful and took my time, It was quite easy and my plants never showed any signs of stress, They actually started growing better. Besides I've read where people trim there roots on bonsi plants and mother plants. The only issue I see with the stacking method is that it may be a little a tough to transplant out later when you go into the 4-5gallon pots.
Your plants look good, they just look a little wilted but it soulds like they need more soil for there roots.
btw Thanks for replying to my thread!!

 

[whadeezlrg]

no doubt LG i just went and picked up 1 bag of MG Org. green, 1 bag MG Org. Brown, 3 bags perlite, mixed it all up in the bathtub (f**kin apartments) and picked up some 3 gal. bags from the hydro shop getting ready to handle up the transplant, I will take some pics of the roots also. peace

 

[luvgrowin]

Thats right!
I have to mix my soil,transplant ect..In the bathtub as well. My girl has a fit when she sees her bathroom full of dirt and supplys. I have a yard but my neighbors are like 10' away and I dont want to be put on the spot by them asking me what I'm doing.
Another question? Do you harvest when the trichs are 50/50 cloudy/amber? and I guess its all up to the trichs not the what the breeder says. Quite some time ago I harvested some outdoor to early and at the time I thought it was good but now I know it actually sucked. Talk to you later,..Peace out!

 

[sns_stealth]

lol...yeah i bet she does get upset....I use a storage container, you can get em any size. my 18"x36"x24"(thereabouts)will hold 1 large bag of soil and the perilite w/ enough room to mix. easy to move/put away and cheap. fyi

goodvibes