hermi seeds gold or garbage???

[new-n-scured]

ok ok i had a crop i had 1 plant hermi a lil bud right on the bottom and IMPREGNATED ALL OTHER 8 PLANTS. including itself i was told that the self pregnated seeds are no good but the seed from the other plants are pre femenized is this true?? i have a whoooooole buuuuuunch of seed im holding on to should throw em out or save em? any help guys thnx!

 

[LolaGal]

Hermie seeds = fem seeds......Dat's how dey makes em!

Hermie seeds won't hemie due to genetics till you cross em back on each other 4 generations.

 

[RustyShackelfor]

whats the strain on that whooollee buuunch of seeds many i ask?

 

[medmaker420]

If it was a light issue or other stress induced I think they will just be fems BUT prone to hermi if you duplicate whatever caused the hermi in the first place.

If it is in the genes then I would toss them IF they are to be used for breeding but if it is just to grow out and smoke, grow em or gift em to someone else who might not have any seeds or is just getting started.

what strain?

 

[new-n-scured]

the father"mother" was bubblegum other plants where also bubble gum and 1 white widow prolly guesing 100+ bubblegum seeds and prolly 30 white widow AND i got 2 more plants still finishing!this is good news and also i use blaze one ups dirt mix light on temps are72-75degrees light off temps are 55-60 degrees no light leeks ( i crawled in the box n checked) im sayin i dont think its genetics soo... KOOL!! it wasint a tottal loss preging my entire crop heh thnx guys

 

[Space Ghost]

Hermie seeds = fem seeds......Dat's how dey makes em!

Hermie seeds won't hemie due to genetics till you cross em back on each other 4 generations.

this is just plain wrong... any seed potentially carries a hermaphroditic trait, it's just up to the genetic coin toss and environmental influences. Hermies breed hermies... although the seeds produced are not worthless by any means, you're just going to have to watch for that trait popping up.

"Hermie seeds won't hemie due to genetics till you cross em back on each other 4 generations"

There is sooo much wrong about that sentence, please don't spread misinformation.

 

[Haps]

Folks let us not talk of hermi's if you have not worked with them, fems and hermi's are not the same at all. The seeds you have are fine if you wish to breed a hermi crop, like one that will sustain itself year after year in the wild like hemp does. They are OK for you to grow if you love the weed. Otherwise they are undesirable seeds, that will have a high rate of herms. Bird food.
H

 

[LolaGal]

Ed Rosenthal MJ Grower's Handbook, page 181

....induce male flowers on female plants. Then the characteristics of both parents are known and all the resulting plants have only female chromosomes.....

(This is how a feminized seed is made...is it not?)

Continuing on page 181

.....When male flowers are artificially induced in female plants, the pollen contains only X chromosomes, the only sex chromosomes the female plant has. All the resulting seeds contain two X chromosomes, one from each parent.

This means all the seeds will be female

Can't find the paragraph where Ed Rosenthal states that you don't have to worry about genetic hermaphrodite seeds until the 4th generation of crossing in this situation with hermie/fem seeds...but I'll find it for you.

So, don't have a cow with my advice, blame it all on Ed Rosenthal! I assumed Ed knew what he was talking about...guess I should've given him credit for what I've learned in my first post....

See ya when I have that page number nailed down for ya'll.



New-n-skured: I think you will probably have some lovely seeds from this common unplanned pregnancy. I envy you the interesting plants you may grow from Bubblegum..always wanted to it! The BGWW cross sounds pretty sweet! Lucky you! If you decide to use them for bird food, I'll be glad to take them off your hands...

 

[ChaosCatalunya]

You guys are in real trouble, she has pulled her Ed R book out on you ..... ;-)

Kind of like the scene in Raiders of the lost Ark when Harrison Ford meets the Arab with the whirling sword, and casually pulls out his revolver .....

FWIW I do now think she and Ed may be right, I just had not seen it confirmed in print ... if it is right ... I am still suspicous as I seem to remember crap [DP?] feminised strains are quicker to Hermi than the normal parental material.

 

[JamieShoes]

I'm sure I'll regret adding this question but here it is - is the difference that when growing fem seed intetionally, you induce the herm trait and its not therefore "natural" to the plant so won't (or is less likely to) reappear as a genetic trait?

 

[greenatik]

from what I have read here fem seeds are more likely to produce mutations. but IME, my hermie seeds have turned out BOMB... got an 1/8th of purple erkle from the club infested with about 30 seeds and so far 8/8 have been females no hermie traits yet

 

[ChaosCatalunya]

I'm sure I'll regret adding this question but here it is - is the difference that when growing fem seed intetionally, you induce the herm trait and its not therefore "natural" to the plant so won't (or is less likely to) reappear as a genetic trait?

No, I dont think you will regret it, I am pretty sure you are spot on.

Accidental Hermies may well go themselves go hermie

Deliberate [selfed] Hermies do not, unless stressed by poor environments. Ever notice how many experienced outdoor growers love Fem beans while many inexperienced indoor growers with more 'ghetto' setups curse them ?

 

[facelift]

Bubblegum and White Widow seeds are keepers.

What's a club doing selling buds with seeds? hope it was discounted by say 80%.

 

[LolaGal]

Well, ED SEZ:

I'm paraphrasing here, back to page 181! If plants hermie early on there's an increased chance of hermaphrodite genetic seeds 50/50. BUT, if the plants throws a nanner late in life, then it's all Girls. Since this situation seems to be the latter, everything is OK with the seeds, just regular fem seeds at this point.

However, if you keep femming the seeds from this pregnancy for four more generations, you are liable to increase the chances of hermie genetics in the seeds.

So plant the seeds, and have fun. They should be great!


Indiana Jane

 

[Mr. Bongjangles]

Well, ED SEZ:

I'm paraphrasing here, back to page 181! If plants hermie early on there's an increased chance of hermaphrodite genetic seeds 50/50. BUT, if the plants throws a nanner late in life, then it's all Girls. Since this situation seems to be the latter, everything is OK with the seeds, just regular fem seeds at this point.

However, if you keep femming the seeds from this pregnancy for four more generations, you are liable to increase the chances of hermie genetics in the seeds.

So plant the seeds, and have fun. They should be great!


Indiana Jane

Why do you assume the herm happened later in the plants life?

If the seeds caused by the herm had time to develop, then it must have happened a month or so prior to maturity at least.

Pretty sure Space Ghost/Haps/everyone else is spot on, and this bit from Ed Rosenthal backs them up, not you. No offense, I know you're trying to help.

Personally, I would toss these seeds or be prepared to watch them like a hawk, as they will absolutely carry the trait to herm early on in flowering. Will they all express it? Prolly not. Will some? Almost certainly.

Especially considering Bubblegum and White Widow seeds are not hard to come by.. If you lose 25% of the plants on the batch when you run these seeds, how much will that cost you? Even if you don't sell, there goes 25% of your smoke. Is that worth less than a pack of Bubblegum or White Widow seeds? I'm thinking no way, so in your shoes I would just order new seeds rather than roll the dice.

 

[Space Ghost]

"....induce male flowers on female plants. Then the characteristics of both parents are known and all the resulting plants have only female chromosomes.....

(This is how a feminized seed is made...is it not?)"

This is how you make fem seeds, BUT any breeder/pollen chucker would his own weight in farts would not use a naturally(genetically) inter-sexed plant to make ANY seed. They would take a true female and cause sexual reversal by means of chemicals or flowering super long.


".....When male flowers are artificially induced in female plants, the pollen contains only X chromosomes, the only sex chromosomes the female plant has. All the resulting seeds contain two X chromosomes, one from each parent.

This means all the seeds will be female"

if this is 100% true why is hermaphrodism so rampant in female seeds lines(this is more of a question for ed not you, but feel free to chime in if you have input.)


"
Can't find the paragraph where Ed Rosenthal states that you don't have to worry about genetic hermaphrodite seeds until the 4th generation of crossing in this situation with hermie/fem seeds...but I'll find it for you."

I would love to see that paragraph(ed's words plz), mostly because I have experienced hermies in the f1 AND f2 generations of making fem'd seeds with plants that never herimied even under stress. So although I can't really explain it on a chromosomal level, it happened to me... so i'd like to see his reasoning. Also these were almost pure lines that I crossed, Malawi Gold X Skunk #1 so, i'm just baffled.

 

[Haps]

Fem seeda are made with male pollen from a reversed sex plant. This is different from the natural hermi made seeds, which can be good seeds, but you can count on them fucking up a crop when you are not looking. Fem seed should not do this.

In the last three years, all the true hermi's I have found have been the most spectacular plants in each of their seed crops, and they were all killed. But the genetics saved and noted. For the day when I grow out my viet black hermi seeds for a full hermi experimental grow. Most of the outrageous weed we got in the seventies were hermi land races. I just don't want them in my sensi crops.
H

 

[SweetnSourMad]

Well on my first serious grow I had about 10 seeds from a hermied ECSD cross, i figured they would be mostly hermies themselves. was i wrong, a friend named Doobie Nyce told me to pop them, as they should be female, and voila! all females of a sour d gene pool that surpassed my hopes that some generalized bagseed from a year ago could produce splendid herb. good luck, id keep them, at least for a last resort, and keep and eye for possible hermie tendencies.

 

[new-n-scured]

man wow!! thnx for all the help guys andi really apreciate it but lemi clear up some darkness in this thread ok i planted 8 plants 7 bubble 1 white these where good seeds i got from random kb sacks over time i veged for a month i transplanted 5 in 1 gallon containers 2 more in 2 galon trash cans and one plant in some big ass container i found when i moved in here im guessing 3 gallon the design of my box does not allow me to check the lowers of the plants very easy( i have to pull the plant out of my box to check) its just a bad design on my part buts its reallity. the 1 gallon plants were lookin sexy but one of the 2 gallon plants decided to grow a penis. my plants were so pregnant i dint really notice the male flours first i started noticing seeds in my plants heh and i was like WTF!!!! so i pulled my plants out for inspecton found the hermi n killed it on the spot the pistills on my 1 gallon plants darkened within a week and i choped those down. now that left me with the 3 gallon and 1 more 2 gallon that just would not finish. at this point the last 2 plants were in flour for 12 weeks all pistills glowing white and bud still growing. my 3 gallon plant was just a big huge bush so i begann to 1st it pulling it every wich way to get light down low.about a month later my top is ready on my 3 gallon plant im guessing feb 1st so i do so i top it wich i dubed " my big green baseball bat". last night i pulled the remander of the 3 gallon plant out for inspection to my shocking suprise i stop counting after 5 male flours and i choped both remaning plants down. im not shur but im guessing the stress of toping and the fact thet they were in there 18th week of flour may be the key factors. but there it is i hope this sheds a lil light on your arguments ;D thnx peeps!!

 

[LolaGal]

Back from Indiana

Back from Indiana

From Ed Rosenthal's Marijuana Success Volume 2, Grow a Great Garden

From the Article GENDER BENDING, making males

page 50: Paragraph 5: "There are some problems using all-female crosses. Some varieities are more affected by artificial techniques that induce hermaphroditism. These plants respond more strongly to these methods, producing more male flowers than other types. Such plants may be more likely to carry genes promoting natural hermaphroditism than plants producings less pollen. (Lola: Our situation here) A breeder may inadvertently be selecting for hermaphroditisim where using pollen from a plant with copious production. This will not be apparent in the first few generations, but increased hermaphroditism may appear after four to six consecutive all-female crosses"




So there you go, Ed's words, which seem to fit the situation we have been asked about by NNSkuured originally. I feel I was answering question correctly due to the knowledge gained from reading. (Sorry ED R! Should've given you the credit in the first place!)


Indiana Jane's word is sound