Homemade CO2 Generators for small grows

[krazycure]

dry active yeast of ANY kind is activated when mixed with water, period. Doesn't matter what kind. Take what you read on OG with a grain of salt. Brewer's yeast will last longer as it's able to survive at higher alcohol %'s, but is hard to find, so I use bakers yeast with no problems. I will add the method I described in your thread here: not really mine as it's been done before, but I thought the filter was a nice touch. laugh.gif

BTW, if you don't care for the smell of yeast and sugar CO2, then you'll HATE the smell of the vinegar and baking soda cube idea! The cannibusculture link is SPOT on, and a GREAT read for a brief overview of CO2.

Collection of my diatribes on the subject:
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Homemade CO2 Tanks:

2.5 Liters of water + ~1/2 pound sugar + tablespoon of yeast + 3L bottle.

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Pre-mix sugar in tap water which has been left out for a couple of days to let the chlorine evaporate (it will kill the yeast otherwise, you can also use RO or distilled water to skip the chlorine removal step). Pour another hefty scoop of sugar directly into the empty tank, then pour the sugar water in over it. Don't swirl. Next, add yeast to a small seperate amount of water and stir until it froths a bit (activated). Pour this into tank as well, and swirl gently (not enough to disturb sugar layer on bottom). An airtight tank like this will produce CO2 for around 4-5 days at which point the sugar must be re-introduced. Don't run this system without some kind of exhaust for the CO2, or it will explode! By airtight, I mean with the additional filter:

An optional (but highly recommended) addition to this system is a small filter or airlock. Run tubing from the top of the tank down into another smaller container. Fill this small container with a small amount of water or better yet, isopropyl alcohol. Run the tube from the tank thru the cap of the filter and down under the water level in the filter. Then, add another tube in the cap of the filter above the water level leading directly to your grow area.

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Please do not underestimate the multipurpose usefulness of the filter. Besides being able to tell exactly how much CO2 is being released, it's an excellent catch for bacteria and prevents air from seeping back into the tank which will stall the fermentation process. Yeast only needs a little bit of oxygen present in the tank at the beginning of the reaction, afterwards excess O2 acts as a catalyst for the reaction. You can easily make one from just about anything, and it will save you headaches. I don't want to see your crop unimproved, or worse, molded because of my idea sad.gif

There ya go. Honestly, you don't have to get too technical. The yeast will reproduce so rapidly it doesn't matter how much you put in, and as long as the sugar water is pretty much syrup then it will make CO2.

Depending on how much initial pressure the water filter holds back (i.e. how much water is in the filter, I only have a cup of water in mine), the CO2 can take 4-8 hours to build up enough pressure to escape. Also, it will take a day or two for the yeast to get a good hold on the solution, it will multiply first, then start converting sugar to alcohol and producing CO2.

I just pour out half the bottle and pour in more pre-mixed sugar water every 4-5 days, or when I see the bubbles in the filter slowing down. I hardly, if ever, replace yeast. A yeast colony can survive even if 75% of it is destroyed from alcohol poisoning or dumping out or whatever. It's really the cheapest and best way to increase yields. Your females will LOVE you for it.

CO2 helping isn't a question of might, it will. I fail to see how anyone could not make the effort to introduce increased levels of CO2, read anything on plants and you'll see growing plants without it is like a human growing with exposure to sunlight once a month. Plants NEED CO2. They have for thousands and thousands of years, in fact, why do you think they were so much bigger in prehistoric times (don't make me put up a photo of fossilized jurassic plants)? Because there was ABUNDANT CO2 in the atmosphere at the time. Now, there's so little, if you don't supplement, you are robbing your plants of what their genetics can provide.

The fact is, plants can put CO2 to use immediately, they don't require saturation to take it in. It's true that this method will not make large amounts of CO2, nobody is claiming that it does. CO2 is just a byproduct of the reaction in the tank, not a primary reaction. The only requirement is that what IS produced must rain out *above the plants*. Even with ventilation, not all the CO2 will be sucked out right away, in fact, the air circulation inside the case will aide the CO2 in dispersal.

Sometimes people take this Co2 thing to new heights, like ALL iso in the filter (OVERKILL PEOPLE DON'T DO IT), you only need a few drops every day to keep it clean. Also, overkill on the sugar can cause problems. You want to provide yourself with a yeast culture, not a yeast MASS, if you use excessive amounts of either you're making a system that's not so great.

 

[badugi]

Stop wasting your time. All that CO2 is being leaked right out of your room and isn't doing anything but stinking things up (and giving you false hope and placebo feelings of increased yields). And if it's not, you most likely have a ventilation problem because I know you're not running a sealed room. (I know you're not running a sealed room because if you were, you wouldn't be using this system.)

A few seconds or minutes of unregulated CO2 enrichment isn't going to do diddly squat for you. (Except generate smell, that is.)

 

[stoner.hr]

yes i think so too that for your closet setup you dont need C02 man just grow it .
its enough that you spend an hour with your plants breathing into them while doing your work. and this DIY system is for aquarium setups...
when you plan going to a bigger setup then consider Co2 as a factor.

 

[philmb]

Hmm, Increased Co2 cant be a bad thing. BUT, If you've got decent anouth ventilation you shouldnt need it.. BUT, i have tryed it i gotta say.

 

[stoner.hr]

thats what i am saying this is one more thing to think of and you will probably get the same results maybe not the same but nothing worth of effort...

 

[badugi]

Hmm, Increased Co2 cant be a bad thing.

Yes, it can.

 

[messn'n'gommin']

Yes, it can.

How so?

 

[badugi]

CO2 O/D.

But even without concerns of O/D, you're basically throwing in something that will gain you absolutely zilch except a false sense of confidence, and take away from your time, money / resources, space, and focus... which should be spent on other aspects of the grow to improve, not some misunderstood CO2 system.

 

[messn'n'gommin']

I thought that around 1500-1800 ppm was considered max for growth. How could normal atmosphere at 300 ppm (or using the above method, say 310ppm) cause OD? Isn't CO2, H2O, and light interaction the requirements that defines photosynthesis?

mess

 

[badugi]

I thought that around 1500-1800 ppm was considered max for growth. How could normal atmosphere at 300 ppm (or using the above method, say 310ppm) cause OD? Isn't CO2, H2O, and light interaction the requirements that defines photosynthesis?

How are you confirming 310ppm? Sniff-test, just smelled like 10ppm higher than ambient? Sure it wasn't 300ppm? Or 3000ppm?

 

[messn'n'gommin']

I thought that around 1500-1800 ppm was considered max for growth. How could normal atmosphere at 300 ppm cause OD? Isn't CO2, H2O, and light interaction the requirements that defines photosynthesis?

mess

 

[badugi]

I thought that around 1500-1800 ppm was considered max for growth. How could normal atmosphere at 300 ppm cause OD? Isn't CO2, H2O, and light interaction the requirements that defines photosynthesis

I never said normal atmospheric CO2 levels caused O/D. Read again.

 

[messn'n'gommin']

CO2 O/D.

But even without concerns of O/D, you're basically throwing in something that will gain you absolutely zilch except a false sense of confidence, and take away from your time, money / resources, space, and focus... which should be spent on other aspects of the grow to improve, not some misunderstood CO2 system.

State again.

mess

 

[messn'n'gommin']

At any rate...

Thanks, Krazycure, it is always a good idea to review old methods and your post is an excellent tutorial.

Still, I wonder, as long as the cab is in a small room with a door and not often used, the CO2 was ducted into the grow itself (the cab filter would eliminate any smell of yeast), and using one or two five gallon buckets, would be enough to raise the ppm count to a level for a large enough gain in yield to justify, what...a 5 lb. sack of sugar and ten gallons of water a week ($3?)? I couldn't see CO2 ppm's getting to dangerous levels at such a slow rate, yet being enough to raise room percentages. Stealth would be shot to hell unless one had something to shield the buckets from sight.

lol...Maybe through a can or two of frozen strawberries into the buckets and at a harvest party one could get his buddies fugged-up on wine...saving his weed!

Namaste, mess

 

[badugi]

I think you think you proved a point, but I think you're still lost.

 

[SuperThrowed]

without a proper way to regulate the ppm in your room CO2 is useless imo

 

[messn'n'gommin']

Firstly, a thousand pardons to Krazycure and all who would open this thread for knowledge and enlightenment by taking it off topic.

I think you think you proved a point, but I think you're still lost.

Secondly, I would also offer my deepest apologies to Badugi, there was a more subtle point I was trying to make that seems to have been missed. Badugi, I know you don't owe me anything, but I would humbly ask that you reread your first post in this thread. But, read it from the perspective of Krazycure, the ICMag community, or even the beginner looking to find a feasible way to increase yields without breaking the bank (whether it works well or not). It may not have been meant that way, but it came across as condescending, abusive, dismissive, and bordering on, at least to me, arrogance. If you wish to inform, educate, and enlighten then this is not the way to go about it. The ones who yell the loudest, the ones who are most insulting, the ones who take pleasure in the humiliation of another human being, are rarely the ones who are right. If you would think back to your grade school days, who were the teachers that commanded (note: I did not say demanded) the most respect from the students at large? I am guessing they were the ones who had compassion in their hearts, reason in their heads, justice in their right hand and mercy in their left. Truth on their tongues and wisdom on their lips. Sir, you strike me as a bright and intelligent individual, with a wealth of knowledge to teach and that is what truly saddens me, that you chose the road most easily traveled.

Again, my apologies to Krazycure, the ICMag community, and especially to Badugi.

Namaste, mess

 

[badugi]

Sorry there's no need for all that, I'm not trying to be arrogant or "above", I'm just telling you that it's a true waste of time and won't gain you anything because of the cost dynamics involved. (If you want, and can easily afford, a monitor / controller along with a sealed room that will actually make it effective, then you can just as easily afford a burner or bottle refills.)

 

[krazycure]

Wow... some people take growing too seriously.

Here's the shake down guys: think what you want, you won't change MY opinion. I grow small, little, tiny autoflower plants in spaces you would feel ashamed to cram your hamster in. I have seen the difference in growing these little bastards with and without CO2, multiple times mind you, to compare and recompare. The frost is always a little thicker, the leaves a little greener, and the final product just a little heavier. When you are talking RAZOR thin margins like mine (getting 12-20 grams a plant), this is worth it.

Still, go ahead and pan the idea completely, it's not like I haven't heard it before.

No hardcore grower is ever going to be convinced that this is worth the effort unless they are there, with a PPM meter, in my space, for a grow with and a grow without. Sorry, not available.

Edit: Here's some anecdotal evidence to chew on. Same strain (SNL Sweet Tooth #3 x MasterLow, bred to be about the size of a beer can cola topping out at around 9-10 inches tall), same pots, same lights, same nutes, same conditions, both about to be harvested in 10-12 days, EXCEPT one did not have constant CO2 in the cabinet. If this happened over and over to you, would YOU not be convinced?
compare with size reference:

CO2 Enriched atmosphere

Regular CO2 Levels


Closeup of CO2 Enriched trichomes

Even Closer Closeup!

 

[krazycure]

Addendum:

Carbon Dioxide (Co2) Enrichment
Air Fertilization

The Importance of Carbon Dioxide (Co2)
for Healthy Plant Growth

Most of the applied research on greenhouse crops has dealt with effects of environmental conditions on plant growth. Factors such as water, light, temperature and nutrients are more easily controlled for optimum growth. It is now possible to also control and accurately measure Carbon Dioxide concentrations in greenhouse and Controlled Environment Garden (CEG) atmospheres.

Carbon Dioxide (CO2) contributes to plant growth as part of the miracle of nature known as photosynthesis. This enables plants to combine Carbon Dioxide and water with the aid of light energy to form sugar. Some of these sugars are converted into complex compounds that increase dry solid plant substances for continued growth to final maturity. However, when the supply of carbon dioxide is cut off, or reduced, the complex plant cell structure cannot utilize the sun's energy fully and growth or development is curtailed.

Although carbon dioxide is one of three main components which combine to produce the products necessary for plant growth, the amount of carbon dioxide in the air is only 0.03% (250 to 330 parts per million). This compares to 78% nitrogen, 21% oxygen and 0.97% trace gases in normal air. Numerous tests have proven that during the winter months carbon dioxide concentrations inside greenhouses is invariably much lower than in outside air. This same phenomenon has been shown in controlled environment gardens.

CARBON DIOXIDE (CO2)
IMPROVES PLANT GROWTH AND QUALITY
Research has shown that in most cases rate of plant growth under otherwise identical growing conditions is directly related to carbon dioxide concentration.

The amount of carbon dioxide a plant requires to grow may vary from plant to plant, but tests show that most plants will stop growing when the CO2 level decreases below 150 ppm. Even at 220 ppm, a slow-down in plant growth is significantly noticeable.

Colorado State University conducted tests with carnations and other flowers in controlled CO2 atmospheres ranging from 200 to 550 ppm. The higher CO2 concentrations significantly increased the rate of formation of dry plant matter, total flower yield and market value.

CARBON DIOXIDE (CO2)
CUT OPERATING COSTS
WHILE INCREASING PRODUCTION
During the winter months, plants near the middle of greenhouse beds generally do not grow as rapidly as plants at the edge. Tests have shown CO2 concentration lower in the center of greenhouses than near the outer walls. Outside air leaking in through small openings around windows carries enough carbon dioxide to satisfy requirements of plants at the edge of beds. The lack of adequate CO2 lowers the average plant yield quality and market value.

Costly methods of stimulating plant growth, in order to market them at optimum profit, are presently being used. One of these is extra heat (with open vents). This, however, increases operating costs and decreases profit. On the other hand, growers using CO2 are cutting their heating costs as much as 50% while realizing extra profit from increased crop production.

SAMPLE RESULTS FROM CO2 ENRICHMENT STUDIES
BIBB LETTUCE
By adding CO2 to the atmosphere around the plant, a 40% crop increase was achieved. Whereas previous crops averaged 22 heads per basket, lettuce grown in the increased CO2 atmosphere (550 ppm) averaged 16 heads of better quality per basket.

CARNATIONS
CO2 levels to 550 ppm produced an obvious increase in yield (over 30%), but the greatest benefits were earlier flowering (up to 2 weeks) with an increased percentage of dry matter.

ROSES
The addition of controlled carbon dioxide provided a remarkable improvement in blossom quality, number and yield. Plants consistently produced many more flowers with 24 to 30 inch stems. Average yield was increased by 39.7%.

TOMATOES
Work in experimental stations has shown that crop increases of as much as 29% have been obtained by increasing the CO2 concentration. More desirable firmness and more uniform ripening are also observed.