SquallRealm
Member
stinkyattic said:
Even if I do a 2 week flush at the end? I just want to make sure the plants have enough N to keep growing/not lose too many leaves because the buds aren't that big yet and I still have 3.5 weeks to go.
Rapid yellowing @ 29 days flower
- Thread starter SquallRealm
- Start date
Even if I do a 2 week flush at the end? I just want to make sure the plants have enough N to keep growing/not lose too many leaves because the buds aren't that big yet and I still have 3.5 weeks to go.
otherwhitemeat said:
Thank you kindly Sirs! Glad you appreciated my input.MynameStitch said:
Absolutely agree Myname, that's pretty much my conclusion as well. The original poster virtually points to this being the cause in his first post.MynameStitch said:
They're 29 days (4 weeks) into flowering and were potted up into fresh soil before flowering. That's 4 weeks in the same pots, and here's the key - they're in 1 gallon pots. In those size pots, regardless of the richness of the soil they started out in, after 4 weeks almost all of the original N residues will have been used up and need replacing. So what's he been feeding to replace that lost N?
Tiger bloom, big bloom and Cal-Mag! What are the NPK ratios for those? Tiger Bloom is 2-8-4, Big Bloom is 0.01-0.03-0.07 and Cal-Mag is 2-0-0, that's why there's no N in that soil - because it hasn't been replaced in sufficient quantity to prevent a deficiency.
His soil is organic, Big Bloom is 100% organic, and Tiger Bloom is quasi-organic and Cal-Mag is a mineral based nutrient, so where's all this chemical salt build up come from? Particularly when there are no signs of burning on any of the leaves?
Organic based nutrients take time to be broken down in the soil by the beneficial organisms into plant useable forms. So not only have insufficient N quantities been provided, they take a while to become available and in that time his plants leaves have become deficient in Nitrogen.
You cannot approach an Organic soil based grow in the same way you'd approach a mineral based fertiliser one because of the different speeds and availability of the nutrients and neither can you solve problems with them in the same way you'd solve them in a soiless/hydroponic mix. I never ever advocate flushing in an organic grow when using organic nutrients, there's simply no need because salts do not build up to toxic levels in the same way as they would in a mineral/chemical based one. They will if you overfeed them, but not if the feeding is correct, and certainly not if they've been underfed! Personally, I think flushing causes far more problems than it will solve in an Organic grow.
The solution was to feed a vegetative 'grow' based nutrient with decent N values rather than flushing out all those nutrients and starting again - this is not a hydroponic/soiless mix. Neither would I ever advocate anyone foliar feeding at 4 weeks flowering due to the very real risk of mould.
In my opinion, this grower has received some poor advice in this thread. Please don't flame me, that's just my personal opinion.
SquallRealm
Member
tree&leaf said:
Hmmmm. I did add some grow big starting on Novermeber 9th and yesterday it was still yellowing even though the tops of the plants had gotten a little darker. What does that mean?
And just to get your opinion how do you think I should proceed from now until harvest in terms of nutes and all that? You say it's not necessary to flush with organics? Does that include tiger bloom? Should I just keep giving them nutes until harvest time?
No, you have to flush reguardless of grow technique or medium you use.
I would give them little bit of nitrogen, those leaves will continue to yellow all the way up until harvest, giving them nitrogen just slows the process down a bit. I would give it to them up until 2 weeks before harvest and just flush the last week 1/2 with just plain water.
I would give them little bit of nitrogen, those leaves will continue to yellow all the way up until harvest, giving them nitrogen just slows the process down a bit. I would give it to them up until 2 weeks before harvest and just flush the last week 1/2 with just plain water.
That necrotic tan blotchiness is what has me worried. Sure, the yellowing may be normal in flower, but not this early. I like to see yellowing starting at week 5.
For the record: My number one concern was with the pH which is why I explained the peat-lime interaction. The plants are showing N and Ca def; the pots are small and on top of that there is added perlite in the soil, functionally meaning that there is LESS soil, and less lime, and it's gone, and the pH is falling, and the plants are suffering.
The salt buildup discussion is just because someone asked.
Ever shake an old bottle of the FF liquid nutes? They rattle. They DO contain ionic substances that DO have the potential to combine and fall out of solution as an insoluble salt precipitate. I only had good results in FF when I started adding Soil Syrup (humic acid) to my feed as a chelator.
I specified low leaves only, not buds. Foliar feeding in flower should not be an issue in a properly constructed room. I foliar Silica Blast and SnowStorm up until the 5th week of flower with no troubles at all.
Just sayin'... in case the terrible advice comment was directed this way...
For the record: My number one concern was with the pH which is why I explained the peat-lime interaction. The plants are showing N and Ca def; the pots are small and on top of that there is added perlite in the soil, functionally meaning that there is LESS soil, and less lime, and it's gone, and the pH is falling, and the plants are suffering.
The salt buildup discussion is just because someone asked.
Ever shake an old bottle of the FF liquid nutes? They rattle. They DO contain ionic substances that DO have the potential to combine and fall out of solution as an insoluble salt precipitate. I only had good results in FF when I started adding Soil Syrup (humic acid) to my feed as a chelator.
I specified low leaves only, not buds. Foliar feeding in flower should not be an issue in a properly constructed room. I foliar Silica Blast and SnowStorm up until the 5th week of flower with no troubles at all.
Just sayin'... in case the terrible advice comment was directed this way...
Last edited:
tiktok420
Member
Way too many opinions. I do not see how this is a salt build up though. With salt build up you get nutrient lock out issues and get more than just yellow leaves. Like rusting, twisting, spotting, etc. Your plants are starving to death and are showing classic signs of Nitrogen deficiency. I use these same exact pots you have and they are a little over a gallon. I think they are 1.3 gallons or something like that. They are doable and I use them but they should probably be 2 gallons.
Let me give you an example. I run 100% organic during veg. and use soil amendments (bloodmeal). I do not add any bloom ferts until about 2 weeks after switching to 12/12 in these pots. About this time my plants will have used up everything in the soil during the stretch and I will need to heavily feed. I have one plant that looks exactly like yours, and its starving to death. A good dose of N fixed this problem and slowed the yellowing down. My yellowing leaves looked exactly like yours and faded from a lime green to a yellow then curled around the edges and fell off. This all started at the bottom, hint hint, and worked its way up. Now that you have flushed I am betting you will see your yellowing accelerate. One thing to help your plants out is to run up to Walmart and get yourself some brer rabbit molasses (blackstrap or full flavor) and water with 1 tsp for the next 2 waterings to try and get your microheard built up again.
Flushing is crazy, don't flush if you are using organics. The rule of thumb I follow with organics when watering is to let a half cup or less of water run off but that's about it. Also don't use perlite, any good potting soil will have just the right amount already like FFOF does. If you are using 50% perlite like some people its like taking a gallon pot and cutting its size in half.
Let me give you an example. I run 100% organic during veg. and use soil amendments (bloodmeal). I do not add any bloom ferts until about 2 weeks after switching to 12/12 in these pots. About this time my plants will have used up everything in the soil during the stretch and I will need to heavily feed. I have one plant that looks exactly like yours, and its starving to death. A good dose of N fixed this problem and slowed the yellowing down. My yellowing leaves looked exactly like yours and faded from a lime green to a yellow then curled around the edges and fell off. This all started at the bottom, hint hint, and worked its way up. Now that you have flushed I am betting you will see your yellowing accelerate. One thing to help your plants out is to run up to Walmart and get yourself some brer rabbit molasses (blackstrap or full flavor) and water with 1 tsp for the next 2 waterings to try and get your microheard built up again.
Flushing is crazy, don't flush if you are using organics. The rule of thumb I follow with organics when watering is to let a half cup or less of water run off but that's about it. Also don't use perlite, any good potting soil will have just the right amount already like FFOF does. If you are using 50% perlite like some people its like taking a gallon pot and cutting its size in half.
SquallRealm
Member
Hmmm. It seems like the yellowing has actually slowed down? The day after I flushed I watered them with 2tsp tiger bloom and 1tsp grow big per gallon. It looks like the buds have stretched up a bit cause they are fat around the middle but now they have some skinny tops and also I don't see many hairs turning over anymore. Does this mean the harvest is gonna be delayed a bit?
I used organics, I flushed with every grow I used bone blood meal, teas and other nutrients always flushed with my grows and I grew out trees.
if I did not flush the smoke was harsh as fuck.
That necrotic tan blotchiness is what has me worried.
That tan you are speaking of is what is left over after the tissue has been sucked dry from the plant
if I did not flush the smoke was harsh as fuck.
That necrotic tan blotchiness is what has me worried.
That tan you are speaking of is what is left over after the tissue has been sucked dry from the plant
Yes, I understand why there are tan blotches. The question was whether it was straight hunger or whether there was a factor locking out Nitrogen. Never mind.
SquallRealm
Member
New pics from tonight. How do they look?
They look like you are not only going to have a harvest, but you are going to have a good harvest.
SquallRealm
Member
Sweet! How far away do you think they are?
Impossible to say from here. Start checking your trichomes and get them all to cloudy, then allow ~20% or so to go amber before chop, more if you like couchlock, less if you like more buzz.
SquallRealm
Member
I harvested last Sunday and tonight its finally dry. Got a little over 80g altogether.
M
mexilandrace
well I'll be damnd, looks like you turned out pretty darn well.
Congrats, looks like you pulled through better than fine.
And think about all the knowledge you gained in the process.
Congrats, looks like you pulled through better than fine.
And think about all the knowledge you gained in the process.
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