The Ph goes UP The Ph goes Down

[Bubble Puppy]

Ph most likely is up from use of fertilizers and other crap

In soil to bring in down you can use Aluminum Sulfate found at garden stores

When the ph is low you can use Lime to bring it up @ garden stores ,good info given to me from the store owner

 

[rckymtnthuglife]

How bout you add 2tbs of lime per gal of soil mix and just forget about pH?

 

[BurnOne]

 

[MrFista]

Easy! For all we know username Bubble Puppy had an epiphany concerning organic soil and wished to share it with us. Though it is second hand information this is an information sharing site and some people are only opening their schoolbooks now, whereas others may well be professors by now.

Same road we're travelling, lets prop each other up not pull each other down.

It is my experience that the least likely candidates often have the most valuable hidden gems.

Bubble Puppy - Smoke some bubble and set yourself to reading. Organics for beginners is an excellent place to start for a medium mix. Then try compost teas to learn to give your girls some treats. After that look into the Organic Fanatic collective for a mind blowingly extensive thread on many many things organic.

ps: Take notes, or copy key passages, the OFC thread is a huge and unruly monster of a thread and it's hard to find things again.

 

[Bubble Puppy]

I must have gotten my second hand information mixed up,as it was explained .From now on ill just read,instead of offer something. which may or may not be helpful .


The last thing i want to do is post something ,"incorrect" or something "Everybody" already knows .Lesson learned

 

[MickTheBrag]

when you buy soil mixs from the growstore their already set at the right PH for growing weed. and the nutes you buy are all set at the right PH. so really theres no need to check the PH at all unless the plants show signs of PH fluctuation. peace

 

[MrFista]

WHAT???!!!

Nutes range anywhere from highly acidic (common) to alkaline. The average bag of potting mix is absolute crap.

Sometimes you get lucky, or get a store that actually knows what their doing with freight/storage and bacteria. This is rare but slowly some stores are trying to please their customers instead of their accountants (ultimately resulting in a happier accountant).

The statement was too broad, and wildly inaccurate. If you are finding nutes and soil in the perfect range, share.

 

[MickTheBrag]

WHAT???!!!

Nutes range anywhere from highly acidic (common) to alkaline. The average bag of potting mix is absolute crap.

Sometimes you get lucky, or get a store that actually knows what their doing with freight/storage and bacteria. This is rare but slowly some stores are trying to please their customers instead of their accountants (ultimately resulting in a happier accountant).

The statement was too broad, and wildly inaccurate. If you are finding nutes and soil in the perfect range, share.

look buddy all soil mixs from the growstore have the same PH. some plants like a acid soil like azaleas so you get a ericaceous compost which is a acid soil base. but your regular multi compost from the store has a alkaline soil. all mixs are tested before their bagged. iv'e done a couple of grows and i never checked the PH once and iv'e got some of the best weed on this site. the average bag of multi compost from the growstore is fine for growing weed. and if you checked every bag at your grow store you'd hardly find any fluctuation between them. cannabis likes a alkaline soil around 6.7 one tip is always check your tap water for PH as it can be acidic in some regions. if soil companys chucked any old sh#t in their mix they'd be out of bussiness in no time espeacially these days. soil and nutes at the growstore are in the "perfect range"

 

[CT Guy]

Personally, I'm not convinced that all growstore soils are balanced and biologically active. I'm guessing there's huge fluctuations in quality. I know that locally, there is a big difference in quality between some local composters on a biological level. It's important to consider what the starting materials that were composted were. The biology should balance the pH and that is what should be considered in my opinion when purchasing compost or soil mixtures for an organic grow.

 

[MrFista]

When Elaine tested about 50 organic compost products here, 'organic products' - only a few of them were worth using.

You got some of the best weed on this site MicktheBrag. Gosh darn I'm impressed with that little nugget shot, it's... a little nugget. It's the best just like all compost is perfect.

ps "the average bag of multi compost" - you can even make up new words as well as stories!

 

[B.C.]

In soil to bring in down you can use Aluminum Sulfate found at garden stores

When the ph is low you can use Lime to bring it up @ garden stores ,good info given to me from the store owner

This statment is true. If you grow somethin that likes acidic soil, aluminum sulfate will lower the ph in the soil. And if yer growing in acidic soil, lime will bring the ph up in the soil. Farmers have been useing this stuff longer than most of you have been alive! lol Btw, I've been useing a bag mix soil for about 10 years now, and I pull 2-4 oz's ina 3 gal pot everytime ( shrugs ). That's not too shabby eh? Alot of folks need ta stop and think, jus because it's not how -you- grow, doesn't mean it won't work! Take care... BC

 

[CT Guy]

Hey, let's keep it nice though fellas, even if we don't agree on everything!

 

[MrFista]

Point taken, sorry.

Yesterday was a bad day for me. Not fair bringing my attitude in here because of it.

Apologies.

 

[Suby]

I't ok to disagree let's just be civil about it .

6.7 is not an alkaline soil value as Toodles mentioned, it's slightly acidic.
Jane likes things slightly acidic and well aerated.
All composts and soils are not made equal, at least not in my parts.
Cold or hot conditions, the mix getting dry, fungus gnats, all these things affect the quality of compost as well as ingredients and the purity of those ingredients.

Dolomite lime acts as a buffer, most organic teas or fertilizers are acidic.
Not that it matters as most should be mixed with a good dose of humic acid or LK like product which will help the natural buffering capacities of the soil.
The lime slowly rises the soil ph until the next feeding, water quality here is an integral part of getting this balance right.
I've always felt this slight variation benefits the soil as different elements are made more readily available at different ph values.

 

[MrFista]

Yeah Toodles, it was Elaine Ingham. I'll reply here so others can read. Dr Ingham does have very high standards for compost, as it is to be used for teas, so must have the correct microbiology in it. Bacteria, fungus, protozoa, nematodes.

This also translates to nutrient content. A properly made aerobic compost with decent starting ingredients retains much of the nutritional value while a compost that goes anaerobic degasses nutrients out of the compost.

So, I guess a relatively easy test for your (or your supply of) compost/soil would be to make a tea of it and stick that under the microscope to see if the correct biology is present.

Or, find out what the good Dr recommends.

Soil mixes I've seen locally, organic ones, are often just peat perlite vermiculite dolomite, maybe some neem cake, and worm castings.

This grows weed just fine, but it's not as good as a mix heavy in good compost, in my opinion that is.

The biology, and a peat/wood/lignin and lime type mix, both assist in buffering pH. Organic acids react with the lime, but also, the lime reacts with peat type substrate, producing more organic acids, this constant playing off each other assists in breaking both substances down in the soil creating humus in the process.

The combination is most effective in pots, where the smaller environment changes in pH more rapidly.

Outdoors the Dr doesn't like the use of lime, or adding any nitrogen, I'm reading diligently, and will try to get details. The gist so far is that the correct biology do the pH buffering and collect free atmospheric nitrogen.

 

[MrFista]

Apologies again. The mention of pots as preferable for peat/wood substrate combined with lime is a conclusion I drew myself from tests made in Aquaponics using lime and peat to accelerate ATP and humus production. I'd also done a redickerlous amount of reading on the subject at that stage. This experiment accelerated growth.

Unfortunately, the experiment ended with too much lime in that system, and a pH of 7.6 that I had to fight to correct. For a while (pH 6.4 - 7.0) it was golden.

I was trying to explain why so many mixes utilise peat/wood and lime as a potting mix. I'd not mentioned the ATP - calcium process as it is complex and is a complete brain fart for me to put in laymans terms. I get the gist of it, I do not follow it all.

ATP - Adenosine Tri Phosphate - is required for photosynthesis. It provides energy. As the 'tri' or third electron is utilised for cellular division the substance converts to ADP, and another electron is 'gleaned' from the suns energy, I don't understand how yet, but once again, with the addition of an electron, the substance ADP becomes ATP again, to divide more cells. As a plant grows, additional ATP allows for additional growth, and a flush of growth is observed as these substances continue to multiply cells, reduce, and reform, in your plants structure.

Conclusions drawn is that a potting mix with woody stuff and lime will perform well for your plants but may cause problems in long term grows (trees). To avoid said problems, fungi and other microbial life (I also think yeasts and thier utilisation of metals are being greatly overlooked) need to be present, all partaking in the ATP cycle, many utilising organic acids for their own processes, thus regulating the persistent addition of CA++ to your pots from carbolic acid and calcium reacting. This 'sharing of the load' in microbial communities is a laymans way of saying - buffering.

Anyone who can correct the above or clarify things more for me is most welcome.

 

[CT Guy]

I'm in it for the tomatoes. I been growing tomatoes for a long long time. Sometimes I get to thinking I know everything about tomatoes.
My tomatoes make me completely delusional.

Love this quote! I get phone calls for people growing tomatoes all the time. It's funny cause they'll be growing 30 plants in 25 gallon pots. That's A LOT of tomatoes!

 

[MrFista]

Awww, I thought you was gonna correct my laymans rant above and increase my understanding.

25 gallon pots - I wish.... 8 gallons...

I had 200 ripe tomatoes on one plant before christmas last year (southern hemisphere, equivalent in Northern would be mid - late June). Go Aquaponics! 22 gallon bed.

Guess size does make a difference, don't tell my girl.

 

[MrFista]

Container size and it's ability to hold the food web has been examined, but I do not know to what depth (pun intended). I'll dig around and see if I can get the dirt on it. Hehehe. Somehing should crop up, if I root deep enough. See what transpires.

ROFLMAO!

With that I must go to work. Oh, I think the conclusion was reached that planted beds are the best option utilising max volume in a given space, next best, is the biggest damn pots you can fit in your space. Keeping the microherd active is part of what my obsession with mycos is all about. I'm a beginner too.

Doesn't matter the level of education, we're all learning here, and it's fun most of the time.