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bounty29's Conceptual Passive Coco System

bounty29

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Disclaimer: This hasn't been thoroughly tested!

This is a result of a few different things. First, I started using pure coco. I loved the growth rates, I loved the amount of control it gives you over what the plants get, and I loved the texture. Once a good sized root mass is built up, coco dries out very fast.

I'm trying to keep my grow as simple as possible. This means minimal electronic devices, minimal maintenance, minimal feeding program, with the best possible result. This led me to Hempy Buckets. I've played around with those for a while now, and they solve the problem of the coco drying out in less than 24 hours when the plant has a sizable root mass.

This made me start thinking how I could expand on the Hempy Bucket concept, to make it even more hands off, but continue using the same basic principle.

I'll be using five 1 liter bottles in a tray. This tray will hold about an inch of standing water. The water level will be maintained by a sealed 2 liter bottle in the tray, with a hold cut in it at the maximum water level. The water will only drain to the specified level since it's a sealed bottle, so until the bottle runs out, the water level will remain constant.

The 1 liter bottles that the plants will be in will have drainage/feeding holes at the very bottom, so they can use the water for as long as possible. The water line is at 1.5" from the bottom of the containers, and the perlite extends from the bottom up to 2.5". This leaves a 1" buffer between the perlite in the water, and the beginning of the coco. I think this buffer is very important to the success of this project.

I got the tray idea from pictures of DrBud's setup, and I wanted to integrate it with the Hempy Bucket concept. I also wanted to make the Hempy style reservoir have a larger holding capacity. These things all came together in this design. I haven't seen anyone else use this, maybe that's because it doesn't work, but either way I have a good feeling about it and I'm looking forward to seeing how it does.

Since this system will be a bottom feeding setup, I plan on flushing from the top and giving fresh nutes once a week. Other than that, I'm shooting for zero interaction with it. Obviously I'll be there every day, but I don't want to need to be there every day. Because of the density of the plants, I'm going to have to top them right when they go into 12/12, down to just a couple inches. Yay Budscicles!

Parts List said:
  • Five 1 liter bottles
  • One 2 liter bottle
  • Bottom of 28lb kitty litter bucket
  • Fluorescent light grating, cut to fit bottom of bucket
  • Perlite
  • Coco
  • General Hydroponics Flora Micro
  • General Hydroponics Flora Bloom
  • General Hydroponics Liquid KoolBloom
That covers everything that will be involved in this grow, from start to finish. Here's a step by step of setting up one of the 1 liter bottles. I know there's been a lot of text so I'll let everyone rest their eyes with some pictures.:D
 
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bounty29

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1. Mountain Dew 1 Liter
2. Cut the top off where it begins to get narrower
3. Cut hole(s) in the very bottom of the bottle



4. Fill with perlite to bottom of the label
5. Rinse perlite and make sure there's an even layer
6. Fill with coco. This was freshly hydrated, never rinsed



7. & 8. Rinse coco until runoff is clear. Use low pressure water, or else you'll mix up all the coco and perlite.
9. Add to tray
 
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bounty29

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The First Candidates... 3 Sour Diesel IBL seedlings, and 1 Blockhead cut. The Blockhead was successfully rooted using an extremely simple passive vermiculite cloner. (Seeing a pattern yet?) More details on that can be found here.

I mixed up a normal nute solution, and added in around 2ml of PH down. I think my PH meter's probe is broken, can't calibrate it with brand new solution. I've been making this same solution for months, using the same tap water, so I should be alright. The second I see a problem I'm buying a new meter, I'm not gonna lose my plants due to my being cheap.

I transplanted them all and watered heavily, getting the coco to fill in any spaces around the roots, so they can take off as soon as possible. I filled the tray up to the line, filled up my bottle, and set it in there.

12:00am, Tuesday, Sept 23
Let's see how long they can go before they need me. Note: I plan on topping the Sour Diesels as soon as they show they've had no problems with transplant, probably in a couple days. Obviously growth will be slower than normal with a clone taking hold and three plants recovering from an early topping. But, we'll see how things go...


Any input, positive or negative, is greatly appreciated. Let me know what you think!:wave:
 
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BoB91

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My hypothesis is....

My hypothesis is....

that it will work. But only time will tell. I hope everything works because it looks so easy. Best of luck!!! :rasta: :joint:
 

bounty29

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I'll be transplanting a bunch of seedlings in the next week, I will definitely be putting this into action. I'll update here, probably more than anyone will need, but it will be good documentation of whether it works or not.
 

bounty29

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So between the surprise successful rooting of my Blockhead cuts and the eagerness brought on by thinking of this and putting it together in less than 24 hours, I've submitted the first test subjects to the set up. I'll be keeping post #3 updated with relevant information.
 
S

snookster

Just wanted to tag along....runnin' Coco for the first time. Interested in how you do. THANKS!
 

MedResearcher

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I like it, I think it should work well once dialed in.

Is the water in the 2 liter bottled PH'd, and or has nutes in it?

Think algae will grow in the bottom of the tray?

Wonder if the roots will be getting less air, since the water isn't being exchanged very often, nor being pumped full of oxygen?

I would like to adapt a method like this too, watering every to every other day is the pits.... hand watering that is.

Cool project, gl on it. I got my eye on the thread.

MR ^^
 

bounty29

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Thanks for the support everyone! :D

MedResearcher - The 2 liter bottle is full of PH'd nutes. The surface area of the water is quite minimal, the bottles are really packed in there. That's one thing I'll be keeping a close watch on though. My thoughts on the amount of oxygen in the water are something like this...

The hempy buckets I've been working with get watered, and the water then sits in the perlite res for up to several days, never being oxygenated, and they do fine. I think this is because the water gets wicked up through the coco, and only the tips of the roots sit in the standing water. According to Hempy's original reasoning, I belive this is supposed to mimic the water table, which plants don't seem to have issues with.

I noticed I didn't mention it earlier, but I don't want the roots coming out of the containers and going all over the res, so I'll be cutting off any root tips that come through the holes in the bottom. This should keep roots contained, and also help build a more solid rootmass inside.

Thanks for the questions, they definitely help. The more questions I can answer about it the more I can work out if there will be any problems. The only two things I'm concerned about right now are algea growth, which I really don't think will be an issue, and DO levels in the water, which I'm hoping won't be an issue. Stay tuned! :wave:
 
D

DEDHEDFRED

Hey Bounty......Budsicles sound cool........My main concern is that once the coco absorbs the max moisture and they`ve still got the 2 liter rez keeping solution levels constant for whatever the amount of time it takes for the bottles to wick up the 2 liters of juice that the rootzone will suffer cuz MJ doesn`t like wet feet for extended periods without major dissolved oxygen ....The prime example being DWC... The only way it works is with airstones in the rootzone.........Without air to roots with plants sitting in water , they`ll drown.......Hempy buckets dry out and wick the reserve before being fed/watered again....Other than that.....Maybe they`ll drain the 2 liter mini rez fast enough not ta worry about it.....But then that kinda sorta kills your passive type thingy you were hopin for with less maintenance........Hope all goes well..........I`m pullin for yas.........DHF.......... :joint: .........
 

bounty29

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Good points DHF, all things that I considered, and if there is any downfall with this design that would be it. I'm really looking forward to seeing how the roots develop and adapt to this situation.

Even if they can't deal with the standing water at the bottom, there's not a doubt in my mind that they won't thrive in the coco portion. The wicking of the perlite really keeps it at what I feel to be the perfect moistness. If roots grow into the water and don't work, they don't work. That won't stop the roots that are above the waterline from feeding and drinking. These are my thoughts, we'll just have to see how things go! :wave:
 
D

DEDHEDFRED

I`m in total agreeance about the perlite in the bottom Bro.......And like you said the upper roots not submerged will be drinking and feeding but I suppose it boils down to how much juice the coco holds to see how saturated the total rootzone will be....Hell ......I hope your golden.......New type mini-system that pumps out budsicles........I`d give it a go for shits and giggles........Who knows.......It could possibly get super-sized ...I`ve got some concerns about algae growth in the clearish green rez and the plant bottles but that`s easily remedied.....Here`s wishin yas good luck Bounty.......Peace.......DHF....... :joint: .........
 

bounty29

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Thanks for the input DHF, I really appreciate it. The more people that voice their opinions on it the better, maybe there's something I missed that someone else will catch. I checked and the roots are just starting to reach the perlite now, the plants have looked perfect since the transplant. Leaves nice and flat, pointing straight out from the sides, no drooping or anything.

If this works I'd imagine it'd be pretty easy to scale the system up. I'd keep the perlite and water depth about the same, just increase the pot size and amount of coco for the plants. What I really look forward to seeing is how much water the plants use once they've reached a decent size, with a system like this it's easy to monitor exactly how much the plants have used.

One thing I've been thinking about is if the plants use the water faster than nutes, or nutes faster than water, that would mess with the PH/EC of the water in the tray. I assume the water from the bottle would mix with it, even while still in the bottle, to act as a sort of buffer and keep it near the target numbers. I'd test it out but I think my PH probe has shit the bed and I'm broke at the moment so I can't do any tests like that.
 

bounty29

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So as I said, the roots are snaking their way down towards the bottom. I just checked them and couldn't be more happy with what I saw. The PERFECT roots! I'll let the pictures do the talking...
...hmm, those look kinda hairy! :chin:





I didn't even consider roots like this, but it makes a lot of sense. I can't express how much I love seeing the hairy roots like this, you get so much surface area on these kinds of roots compared to normal ones. You can see that once the roots reach the perlite, they change from hairy roots to smooth roots, which goes right along with the plan.

So for so good... :D:D:D
 

icough2getoff

Active member
I also love seeing hairy roots, and those are pretty damn hairy! I'm going to enjoy following this thread.

I keep my mothers in coco and the thing I hate the most about it is how often I have to water them. This could be an easy fix, thanks Bounty. Will be watching with interest. :rasta:
 

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