Soil flush with peroxide?

[hoosierdaddy]

This statement may or may not be true.

Additionally if you are growing organic, you just killed all the enzymes and bacterias which break down the organic nutes to make them availible to the roots.

What are the tell tale signs of a plant having a problem with the chemical scenarios you have described? What should I look for to find this damage, and can you point me to some examples of damage from h2o2 use so I can be prepared?

 

[Fast_Pine]

After reading Badmf's post I will not use the h2o2....Thanks Badmf..

Cant fuck up the microherd. right..

 

[Whatever]

If you do use H2O2 it will kill the many beneficial bacterias that help control the root environment. In nature there aren't H2O2 rainstorms (actually some Ozone is transferred to rain along with other elements) and plants without our well intentioned intervention seem to do quite well.

Additionally if you are growing organic, you just killed all the enzymes and bacterias which break down the organic nutes to make them availible to the roots.

You will kill more or less of the beneficials depending on the H2O2 concentration. In nature the longer and harder the rain the greater the total H2O2 dumped onto the enviro and this is measurable. Rain during lightning storms has the greatest concentration of H2O2. The increased particulate concentration in the air has reduced the amount of natural H2O2 in the rainwater that hits the ground. Still...the amount of H2O2 in rainwater is very minute...and nature knows best.

In organics, or any enviro, the bacterial kill rate (aerobic or anaerobic because H2O2 does not differentiate on contact) depends on the H2O2 concentration. I know of some 'organic' growers who adjust the ORP value of compost type teas using H2O2 and there's a method to their madness...heh heh....and has to do with maximizing nutrient availability after fertigation at the temporary cost to some of the microlife. Talking DO in a soil enviro is just silly.

Here is just a small piece that helps folks understand what H2o2 is and what it does:

Basically using H2O2 as a cure for an out of balance situation meaning over watering, poor soil structure or some other issue like running a hydro enviro too warm.

I've yet to see someone post information regarding particular H2O2 concentrations and the associated effect on bacteria health/populations both positive and negative. Only thing I've really seen is peeps talk about H2O2 and pythium issues.

 

[badmf]

I wish OG's boards were still up, loads of info and pix. Somebody did a paper on it for their thesus. To save me time and get you the correct info, contact the nute company you use and see (don't settle for anything but a botanist)I have literally years of books, magazines etc and of course its not all cataloged yet. But I did check into some other sources and they have used it in extreme cases of root rot to stimulate more O there. But if I had a plant at that point I would toss it and seek to remedy what caused it to begin with. Most likely over-watering or a medium that isn't for these plants. I always go by the "An oz of prevention is worth...)
Now to answer your Q about plants with damage. You need a laboratory level microscope to see the extremely fine root hairs. There is where damage occurs to the plant. But as to nutes, you take a sample of the nutes before watering then runoff after H2O2 is applied compare the molecular structure. Voila! Free radicals attach to iron and other elements depending on N-P-K sources. Varying outcomes dependent on levels and nutes involved. It is amazing what these plants put up with, some folks add milk for calcium, purple Gatorade for color etc, now this isn't on that level but many times over the years this comes up again and again. Like driving a nail into the plant stalk to stimulate resin production. Withholding H2o and increasing UV will but to such a small degree it isn't worth your efforts. This was done very late into flowering, btw. http://www.fao.org/docrep/009/a0100e/a0100e05.htm
It is also not an insecticide, lol.

 

[Whatever]

H2O2 has been used for many purposes including cleaning, bleaching, sterilizing,

To quote your own reference Hoosierdaddy...at what point does H2O2 become a sterilizer in an agricultural enviro, whether hydro/soilless/soil and up to what concentration is it beneficial to beneficials? You can't say because you simply don't know and just refer to what manufacturers recommend for dosage instead of offering any concrete data. Where's all this research you've talked about?

 

[inflorescence]

Free radicals attach to iron and other elements depending on N-P-K sources.

Rust is the oxidation of Ferrous ion but my floranova uses Iron DTPA and my GH 3-part uses fe EDDHA and DTPA.
Can O oxidize a pentagon structured chelate?
I thought chelates protected against this?

 

[badmf]

Rust is the oxidation of Ferrous ion but my floranova uses Iron DTPA and my GH 3-part uses fe EDDHA and DTPA.
Can O oxidize a pentagon structured chelate?
I thought chelates protected against this?

No not the same, you are safe!

 

[smoketrichs]

Well from what I've gathered peroxide will cause some type of harm ie. burning nutes killing microbes.. But thats what I'm going for. When I had beginning signs of PM growing on the top layer of my soil a quick spray with some 3% h2o2 diluted w/ water killed it off w a quick sizzle and hasn't appeared again yet. This got me thinking in the last week b4 harvest hit the soil w a stronger h2o2 solution: burning root, hairs killing microbes.. ie. "Nuke the fucking fuckers". If they cant feed through their roots they'll feed on themselves right? or wrong? These are all hypotheses, just kicking ideas around for shits and giggles.

 

[Whatever]

wrong?

Wrong...cause if you use enough H2O2 to damage the root structure for it to take up nutes properly you'd also be damaging the plant's, through the roots, ability to take up water. It would not then be able to feed off itself effectively cause it will lose some hydration ability. It will take a very strong concentration of H2O2 to damage roots in a soil enviro and less, but still a lot, to do the same damage in a hydro enviro.

If you need some type of radical flushing at the end of flowering you've simply over nuted to begin with. H2O2 flushing is not the answer here. If anything, especially in an organic soil enviro, I'd want to put the bacteria into overdrive through something like a bacterial tea to promote the 'chewing up' of excess soil nutes, particularly N, a few weeks before harvest then just plain and simply water.

 

[badmf]

Well said "Whatever"!!

 

[John goodman]

what would be the correct ratio to treat over-watered coco with damaged to young plants? and how would i apply this ... can i then use it thru the whole grow cycle? how is this applied to the res if so ?

Any help input greatly appreciated

great read HD

I have used in my canna coco medium, rhitztonic and canna coco a+b