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I suck at cloning in coco. Can you help?

gmanwho

Well-known member
Veteran
cloning in coco. one thing i found, in my situation's, is that i loose less clones if i have no cut nodes submerged in the medium.

i find if temps and things arent as clean as they should be, that cut node is saceptable (sp) to mushing & rotting.

in my experiences that goes for coco, no cut nodes below the medium, no cut nodes close to the medium.

temps no higher then 80.

depending on the surrounding reflection of light, dont use too much wattage i use a 60watt cfl. if the leaves start yellowing early, raise the light. but i usually get some yellowing or leaf drop off after 12 or so days is fine IF i have root development. the cutting is only using the leaves for food to create the new root sysytem.

if the leafs material dies, twist them off the cutting, especially if the dead leaf is touching the coco, or any wet medium or puck. the leaf is dead and has no immune system, it cannot fight off disease, and must likely will transfer the disease to the cutting & rot.

I also found with bubble or diy aero set ups, change the water once a week, clean w/bleach every other week. I dont even bother to ph. and that if that cut nude ends up resting inside the puck, it will rot. cut nodes have to be lower the the puck. inside the puck is semi lite, warm & moist, perfect conditions to bring on rot.

oxygen is a natural sterilizer, and the water misted to the cuts is at it max capacity for the enviroment (unless the water is under pressure, then it could hold more oxygen) so if the cut node is lower then the puck, it is usually fine.

also i found the rooting powder w/fungicide works best in coco for me. i use a doom for the first few days, i take the dome off once a day, an hour or so the 2nd day. a few hours off on the 3rd day, and hopefully by the fourth or 5th day they can live without the dome.

U want the medium to be moist, but not to moist. they need to realize they need to root to get water, not just be given water by the dome or over saturated mediums.

if u recycle the coco, FLUSH THE SHIT OUT OF IT. a 5 gallon bucket full of coco, atleast 5 gallons of water through. Hands down best info you can get.

it may take time ,just try to be aware of the environment they are in. if u have failures, try to take a step back and look at everything. Piece by piece. why this time but not last time. or why failed this time, but worked perfect last time. temp, humidity, medium. genetics, and cleanliness all have effect

b-safe
 
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gmanwho

Well-known member
Veteran
also,, ,the gel or the rooting powder, dont ever dip the cut into the rooting medium in the container. take out what u think u may need, u can always get more if under. if u have extra, throw it out, NEVER put it back int tot container.

Use sterile sharp scissors or an xacto, every 10 cuttings sterilize the scissors with rubbing alcohol again. cleanliness could be a factor in your failures.


B-safe
 
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greenatik

Member
I have the rapid rooter trays with a dome, and "ez-coco." I also have a coarser coco, both rinsed very well, that I will be comparing with the finer ezcoco. I also purchased dip-n-grow. It is a pretty large tray and dome, and there are two small holes in the top - the hydro man put them there and said that they help?!? - thoughts/suggestions on this?

I am taking the cuttings off my outdoor plants (blue goo x gods gift, the chronic, ak-48) I was planning on bringing a small cooler with ph'd r/o in a container to immediately submerge the cuttings. bring them back immediately, cut up a little bit, scarify, dip it in the dip-n-grow, and into the tray with the coco loosely packed.

is there any advice or suggestions to help me get successful clones (first time)?

when do i start using calmag?

I also have the organic thrive alive b-1, the hydro guy said it is essential... how and when do I use this?

thanks for any help!
 
S

stoned teacher

Hey Gregor:

I just switched to the ProCoir bales you spoke of because my local shop now has them instead of BCuzz (cheaper and way lighter and smaller to get home/in the door). Besides the cloning issue, have you been happy with it?

I have measured the runoff of the ProCoir after expanding and mixing it up and I remember getting somewhere around 500-600 ppm (1-1.2 EC on my meter) runoff initially, which is more than my 250 ppm hard water). I flushed it till I got it down.



I clone in coco (mixed with perlite, but prolly no difference) and agree with the poster that spoke of leaving it alone (as long as the coco stays moist). I had prolly an 85% success rate with bubbling, terrible success with rapid rooters (I wasn't good at keeping them not too wet not too dry), but have found coco real easy...99% rate. I use 16 oz plastic cups w/ a few holes on the bottom, hydrate the coco, take cutting dip and put in the coco...then I water or feed real light every 4 days. No dome, heat mat in the winter. 16 oz cups can take me to flower.
 

clowntown

Active member
Veteran
After taking a break from cloning in coco-filled cells, I'm back at it. (Ran out of pucks & plugs.)

A couple of things I'm doing differently this time, though:
  • Using Atami B'Cuzz coir out of the bag, instead of Canna. Probably won't make any difference, but we'll see.
  • Packing the coco in as tight as I can, then bottom-soaking in a tupperware container (out of laziness) and shaking out the excess water.

Everything else is the same, for the most part. I'm packing them in at a higher density per-tray (72 per 10" x 20" nursery flat, whereas previously it was more like 40-ish), which results in more cuts at the outer edges touching the moist humidity dome. My small bottle of Clonex (almost empty, about a year old) is starting to look a little discolored, I'm not sure how bad this is. Good thing I'm almost out. (Next time, will be trying Dyna-Gro's new gel I got as a sample.)

I'll report back in a week or two.
 
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Burt

Active member
Veteran
i've used the same batch of liquid hormones ( hormex ) from home depot for 10 years now-it never does me wrong-the cheap brown bottle with both hormones in it-an old head passed the knowledge down to me and i always go 100% on my cuts rooting-not braggin-i don't like the gels
anyway-here's what i do-get yourself a clear container that is at least twice as high as the cuts will be in their new medium-spray the container down before placing cuts in it.
take cut at 45 degree angle so more stem tissue is exposed to hormones-i hold the cut in the liquid hormones for a count of 10-and gently place as far into the medium of choice-if using cocoa-i recommend moist but not too moist-this is where your probably experiencing "damping off" and the stem is turning to paste-so you've got your cuts in the coca now and their new home is at least 90% humid now due to you spraying it down right? cool :rasta:
i place the cuts in the container and place clear wrap on top-Do not spray the cuts!
there is plenty of humidity in the container now due to moisture on the walls and in the medium-breathe into the container 2-3 times a day for added co2 and within 15-20 days, your roots will burst out-no problems-i recommend slowly taking the plastic off-a little a day as the clones start rooting-you can tell their rooting cause the stems will feel firm to the touch and it's time to celebrate-cause your almost there! after they start rooting-i recommend a gentle/mild nutrient spray-but only if you notice the stem firming and lower leaf(s) getting yellow-you have succeeded in your endeavor now-place the cuts into bigger containers and let them grow! :jump:
BTW-i don't think the hormones are good for the environment so i dump what i don't use back into the bottle and reuse
 
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Sirius

Member
Burt said:
BTW-i don't think the hormones are good for the environment so i dump what i don't use back into the bottle and reuse

Isn't this a bad idea? I thought the reason you wouldn't just dip the clones into the bottle in the first place is that you risk contaminating the rooting gel, and dumping back in what you used would create that risk just the same. :confused:
 

clowntown

Active member
Veteran
Yeah every time I've done this with gels, it "contaminated" the original bottle always turning the bottle contents off-color, off-smell, off-texture, or otherwise fucking it up. Even from clean, healthy clones.
 

clowntown

Active member
Veteran
Oh yeah, forgot about that.

I had two trays of cuts... one tray was on a heat mat, and the other one was on a rack shelf above a few ballasts, to serve as a heating mat and to get the humidity going.

Unfortunately I suppose I misjudged the amount of heat put out by the ballasts (the tray wasn't directly on it, but maybe 5-6" above the ballasts on a wire shelf). Turned out just about ALL the cuts in the ballast-heated tray were cooked: stem below the surface turned into complete mush. On the heat mat tray, I didn't count but I'd say 95%+ rooted, with I think 2 that didn't root at all (didn't even look callused :confused:). Not sure what happened there, but I'd call it a success.

Once the cuts are a bit better rooted, they're real easy to take out of the cells by pushing the bottom and turning it upside-down, w/o any damage to roots or ball of coco. (Stays intact, just like a transplanted plant does.)
 

Sirius

Member
Sounds great. I'm going to be ready to take my first set of clones in the next week or so, just as soon as these side branches grow out enough (one or two more internodes to go, I think). The plan, of course, is to clone straight to coco.

To summarize what I've understood about doing so as well as how I'll attempt to do so, sterilize a razor blade, cut at like a 45° angle, peel one of the sides of the stem up a little bit to increase surface area for rooting, maybe even slice up the middle a bit to help with that as well....

As soon as the cut is taken, put the cutting in water. Now, I've read someone mention that they will leave it there for an hour or two, to make sure the cells in the cutting are as full as they can be... a good idea, or not? Otherwise, just leave them in for a minute or two, and then, after that, straight into this rooting gel I have (Clonex, I believe), and then, after that, straight into the coco.

With the coco, make sure it is flushed properly, maybe soak it in some ph-adjusted water (5.8), put it in some little water cups with good holes for drainage, and make sure it is moist but not too wet. Make a little hole in the middle to insert the cutting, make sure it stands up nice and straight....

They don't need very much light, so raise my fluorescents up quite a ways (4x18watt 6500 lumens, any idea on how far away they should be?). Then, the real question I'm having is with a dome over them. I've read from a few people who have stated that they won't use a dome, and that as long as they keep the coco moist, and the leaves somewhat moist as well, a dome isn't necessary. I'd personally like to go without the dome, but I think what I'll do is try some like that, and put two liter bottles over some of them as well, to see which one will work best.

Other than that and making sure they have a little bit of moisture and a little bit of light to encourage rooting, just leave them the fuck alone. This is pretty much what I've soaked in and decided to go with, so please, everyone, tell me what I'm right about and what I'm wrong about. I want to minimize the risks of failure so my first try will work out great. :D
 

Sirius

Member
Oh, also, that its a good idea to trim the tips off of some (most?) of the leaves so that the plant concentrates more on rooting instead of photosynthesis. What percentage of the leaflets should be snipped? Every single leaflet? All the leaves? Half the leaves?

Its best to wait until the side branches grow out to their fourth node, correct? Any input on this is greatly appreciated, want to have everything as dialed in as possible. :D
 
coco cloning it simple as 1,2,3 imo. cut @ angle, dip in water, scrape sides till the white meet lol, dip in olivia gel (although i got root without it also) put in coco, put in dome (plastic cake cover from walmart) I think a key essential to cloning in coco is rinsing the coco and ringing the water out of it. ive had very few clones to not root probably like 3 or 4 out of 25 not root. and it was because i had to much water in the coco the stem turned to mush. I dont water them till i see roots but i do spray the top of the dome lightly with water. And keep the clones in warm temps. Im sure this info has already been stated but i gotta get my post count up lmfao might as well share some useful info
 

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