Nutes? When to use/start?

[Huey69]

Hey everyone, hope the grows are going good this year.

I'm currently growing several different strains(see my grow thread in my sig) in Miracle Grow. Up until this point, I have not added any other nutes besides what is found in the MG soil.

As the time for flowering is coming up fast, I wanted input as to what Flowering nute's you would suggest and WHEN to start feeding them. I have searched, but it seemed each person had a different answer(ranging in starting the feed in early july to starting the first of september). Right now I do have some Miracle Grow flowering nutes that is 2 years old and really, I'd like to get the best nutes I can.

Also, right now should there be any nutes I can add to help my babies get a little extra boost before flowering(most are currently re-vegging if that makes a difference as well)?

Thanks.

 

[Guest]

Hi Huey69

Almost 60% of total growth will be seen in the next 30-45 days. Ive been pouring on the juice since June 1 and in my view your running late. Get after it and feeding heavy is essential.

For big plants like this one, I use 1 heaping teaspoon of 46-0-0, combined with 1 heaping teaspoon of Miracle Grow mixed in 1 gallon of water and applied each week until mid July.









I reduce the dosage form smaller plants, porportionately to the plant size. One such as this 40" gets half the dose as above.



If they are container plants such as these, I use 1/4 dosage.



Feed weekly until the last week of July and then pull the nitrogen back as too much nitrogen during flower will cause problems, but until then, I would pour it on. Ive grown a bunch of strains and to my knowledge, there's no such thing as a nute sensitive plant outdoors. Althoug, I grow mostly indicas and sativas could resond differently.

Thats what I do and have done for some time. Bring on the yields. good luck
sb

 

[kallenavndk]

I feed mine 2-3 times weekly and they lovin it , its like body builders they need some ekstra juice hehe

 

[LemonCake]

I feed them everytime i go and water. other wise i let mother nature water them...Osmocote can be good... one heaping table spoon is about right ... good luck ..

 

[Huey69]

SB: I currently have the plants in either 4 galloon pots or in the ground (+1 in a 5 gal). So For each galloon of water I should add 1/4 teaspoon of miracle grow(is my 2 year old box still good? or should I get new?) and 1/4 teaspoon of a X-0-0 fert? I've been watering about once every 4 or 5 days with around 1/3 of a galloon of water. Does this sound sufficient or should I be watering with less/more more/less frequently?

Thanks guys

 

[Guest]

Goodness Huey69. Those plants look like they are in flower, are they? If so, forget the nitro. Ithought they were still in veg

As long as your MG has been kept dry it will be fine.

Honestly, those plants look healthy and in need of nothing. I don't see a yellow leaf anywhere at the bottom or any other sign that would indicate they need even light doses of nutes. I would keep doing what youve been doing. If you see slow growth or some yellowing you might feed them a bit. If your using MG, you might go get you a little bottle of Bloom Buster at lowes or some other brand and switch off with the MG week to week, but other than that, you're cookin.

Under the conditions you have there, I follow something near the Weakly Weekly model, like these other guys are doing but don't fix what aint broke if you know what i mean.. Dang, don't those black buckets get hotter than a 2$ pistol?

Let me clarify my use of the term "teaspoon". I can never find those damn green scoops they give you with ferts, even though I have 20 of them laying around, so I bought me a pack of these plastic spoons and keep them in a jar at my work station. Ill bet if i poured my heaping teaspoon into that green scooper, i would have about a level tablespoon. Ive just done it enough to know how much im putting on really.

Keep up the good work man.
sb

 

[Huey69]

SB: Unfortunately they started flowering sometime ago due to being put out too early. Right now they are re-vegging (it's hard to tell in that picture) so I think adding the N would be a good idea(until close to the end of june)?

This shows the re-vegging tops of an OG and a Chemdawg.
When you say switch off between Bloom booster and MG, do you mean the MG flowering ferts I have already?

And ya, those pots can definitely get hot! We had a heat wave a couple weeks ago and that Chemdawg(right, second to front) wasn't very happy at all, she got all sad and droppy, but a good watering brought her back to life (and I've been making sure that doesn't happen again).

 

[Guest]

I understand now. I suppose the higher nitrogen may be beneficial. Honestly, I have never revegged a plant so I have no experience with it but the nitrogen will produce veg growth.

Yes, I switch off from MG to BB,( it could be someother bloom fert), using 1 on one week and the other the next. There are different trace elements and levels of nutrients in different products that provide a more comprehensive feeding in my view over just using the same fert all the time and im convinced that i get better yield results when I do..

I hear you on the buckets. I use white ones and it helps a little,but probably not much. You don't hear much about soil temperature and its effect on cannabis, but Ive seen my yields reduced in containers over in ground plants and Im convinced that soil temps in the upper 80's or maybe more are one of the reasons why. I don't know of any natural setting where cannabis grows in soil that hot. Its something that i fight all the time.

 

[Jon]

I understand now. I suppose the higher nitrogen may be beneficial. Honestly, I have never revegged a plant so I have no experience with it but the nitrogen will produce veg growth.

Yes, I switch off from MG to BB,( it could be someother bloom fert), using 1 on one week and the other the next. There are different trace elements and levels of nutrients in different products that provide a more comprehensive feeding in my view over just using the same fert all the time and im convinced that i get better yield results when I do..

I hear you on the buckets. I use white ones and it helps a little,but probably not much. You don't hear much about soil temperature and its effect on cannabis, but Ive seen my yields reduced in containers over in ground plants and Im convinced that soil temps in the upper 80's or maybe more are one of the reasons why. I don't know of any natural setting where cannabis grows in soil that hot. Its something that i fight all the time.

+

When you start switching off is this late summer when flowering starts or do you do it during vegging?

If it is during flowering, does the extra nitrogen in the mg make your buds any leafier? I'm wondering because I'm using cheap miracle grow fertilizer sticks 6-12-6 for a plant that I will be harvesting in mid July and I'm worried I won't get the dense nugs I'm used to.

 

[Guest]

I usually start using bloom ferts a week or so before the first blooms appear and stop 2 weeks prior to harvest.
I think the higher N in MG, if used by itself does cause a bit of leafyness depending on the strain. A strain that is leafy to start with will see a bit more in my opinion if only MG is used. Thats one of the reasons i try an switch off weekly and use something lower in N.

I believe its at the margins though Jon. If the plants have all of the nutrients they need, and if you look at Huey69's plants, they clearly have everything they need as there is no visible signs of defenciencies, then to a great extent, bud size is going to be determined mostly by genetics. I think soil temps inside of one's pots may have a much bigger impact on bud size than the use of any particular brand of ferts. I think, (its hard to measure) that it may be beneficial to set plants in the shade for a couple of hours during the heat of the day rather than any benefit gained from leaving them out in the sun during that period. Im experimenting with a heat deflecting product they sell at Lowe's for my pots because of my belief that high soil temps have been reducing my bucket yield. Im also testing to see what impact watering during the heat of the day has on the plant, as it can reduce the soil temps by 20 degrees for more than 2 hrs.

ive measured soil temps in excess of 90 degrees in buckets like these during the hottest part of the hottest days and the plants suffer during flowering. Its hard to keep them watered..

 

[Jon]

I usually start using bloom ferts a week or so before the first blooms appear and stop 2 weeks prior to harvest.
I think the higher N in MG, if used by itself does cause a bit of leafyness depending on the strain. A strain that is leafy to start with will see a bit more in my opinion if only MG is used. Thats one of the reasons i try an switch off weekly and use something lower in N.

I believe its at the margins though Jon. If the plants have all of the nutrients they need, and if you look at Huey69's plants, they clearly have everything they need as there is no visible signs of defenciencies, then to a great extent, bud size is going to be determined mostly by genetics. I think soil temps inside of one's pots may have a much bigger impact on bud size than the use of any particular brand of ferts. I think, (its hard to measure) that it may be beneficial to set plants in the shade for a couple of hours during the heat of the day rather than any benefit gained from leaving them out in the sun during that period. Im experimenting with a heat deflecting product they sell at Lowe's for my pots because of my belief that high soil temps have been reducing my bucket yield. Im also testing to see what impact watering during the heat of the day has on the plant, as it can reduce the soil temps by 20 degrees for more than 2 hrs.

ive measured soil temps in excess of 90 degrees in buckets like these during the hottest part of the hottest days and the plants suffer during flowering. Its hard to keep them watered..

Since we're both at 38 lat, when would you say the first blooms typically appear?

 

[Guest]

Sometimes late july, but always 8/1. Ive had strains start later, but if its more than 10 days later, i dont grow it again unless its and indoor grow or I manipulate the flower time by setting it in and out. I alway s go out on the first, or within a day or 2 of the first to check. I can establish a general chop date by whatever i see on 8/1

 

[Huey69]

Thanks for all the help guys. I'm going to get some high N fert along with another bloom/flower fert when I go by the gardening shop in a few hours.

SB: When you find out more about pot/soil temps and yield, I'll be more then intrigued to see your results. After that incident I've wonder if the heat affects the plants adversely due to the roots at the edges being dried out faster then the rest of the roots.

 

[Huey69]

Alright. So I went ahead and bought some Urea 46-0-0 and FoxFarms Big Bloom.

I mixed in ~1/4 large scoop MG Bloom Booster and 1/4 tsp Urea(the dosage on the back says 1/2 tsp per 2 galloons) per galloon of water. Each plant got about 1/3 galloon of water besides the XXX, Schrom, and Red Grape which were just transplanted last friday, so they didn't really need a watering but I wanted to give them a little. Plants in the ground got approximately the same amount, although the soil drained FAST.
Is there a better way to feed my plants in the ground? They're watered by the sprinklers and so the soil is always moist(although they never show signs of overwatering), is it ok that I just do as i did and water them like my other plants?

EDIT: Just wanted to mention I'll be switching between the Big Bloom and Bloom Booster each feeding. So probably Saturday or Sunday they'll be fed Big Bloom + Urea.

 

[Guest]

Hey Huey69, On the temps, I think the bucket and the temps they experience are just such an unnatural situation that it has a negative impact on the plant. I don't think normal soil temps for native cannabis ever reach these high levels and the plant at its most basic level, just hasn't evolved any tolerances for it and hence it becomes a source of great stress that the plant has to fight to endure. I believe there is probably a direct correlation between the energy the plant spends trying to cope with the temps and the reduced bud size. We're forcing the plant to redirect its energy. Things like that are hard to prove though.

That urea is the stuff. I'm a farmer and I have tons of it dumped on my fields each spring as do all the farmers in my area. Im looking for results from crops,(including cannabis) and theres no sense playing around with fancy nutes in pretty boxes.

For your situation, for a while, I would stick with just the urea and MG combo. I wouldn't start the MG/Big Bloom combo until a week before the onset of flower.

Just a foot note Huey, sometimes in buckets, theres not a lot of choice on how you feed because the nutrients get washed from the soil so quickly because of the amount of water that has to be poured on them. I have to water every day when its really hot.
But for my inground grows and i wish for my bucket grows, i try to use organic ferts during blooming. Duiring the growth stages i pour on the chems in heavy doses, but frankly, if you use chems during flower thats what the smoke taste like. Its that metal taste you hear about.

In the field, i use soil syrup and other organics at the start of flower whenever possible. If i see a real deficiency i address it with chems, but generally, organics during flower really impact taste, especially with a good cure. Ive also found that a mixture of copper/ iron and plant sugar can really effect taste in cure and can take the nastiest old penny tasting strrain and turn it into a deep rich experience. I'd give anything to find a product that would allow me to do that in a bucket.

 

[Huey69]

The plants seemed to respond well to the feeding yesterday. I'll stick with the Urea and Bloom Booster for now until flowering begins(again for some).
The FF Big Bloom says it's natural and organic....so if I were to actually switch to only that(and possible another organic fert) I'd be strictly organic during flowering right? I don't recall the MG Bloom booster saying anything about being organic.

 

[Guest]

Sounds right to me Huey69. Im gonna check into that FF Big Bloom. Where'd you get that?

 

[Huey69]

Hey sorry to reply so much later, I never saw that you replied. I bought it from a local nursery store, Green Thumb (I know they have a few other stores, just not sure were). Lowes might carry it.