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    Serious talk about legalization

    So I had been thinking of this for a long time now as to what would be a grand plan for legalization. I think that it can be done and once the US does it most the rest of the world will follow suite I believe.

    I want to open this up to discussion pros/cons lets put some serious # down for if we were writting a bill to be past. Tax%, lic fees, I would like to model it after how we handle Alcohol production currently as I think that system worked and got organized crime out of the business and cut crime rates dramastically and created a new source of wealth and a new sector of the legal taxable economy.

    Please dont come in and be a nay sayor, offer a solution to the current problem. Or shut your mouth and bind your typing fingers as pointing out a problem with out offering a solution is worthless. Find another thread to post your its never going to happen pesamistic, Raygun's an idiot for starting this post, additude.

    For everyone else that can keep an open mind and solutions please contribute

    This is what I would like to see happen:
    • Legalize cannabis for personal use

    • Grows for personal use only are ok with out a lic., registration or inspection.

    • Growing on a commercial scale would need to be controled by an ajency similar to alcohol beverage control (ABC). For all commercial brewing opporations they need to register and get lic for production. ABC also keeps tabs on the amount of ingrediants used vs. produced product. They keep tabs on water, grains, hops (if used) ect so they know how much should be produced to deter illegal production. So this would create jobs on the govt side.

    • commercial grows would have to register, pay tax and lic $$$ be inspected and keep strict records of production.

    • Licensing and production guidelines for what would be acceptable levels would have to be decided on a local (state/county) level, similar to how alcohol is regulated across the country. you have dry states, counties, even some places with % of alcohol restrictions on the beer that can be sold and even transported through the state.

    • Transportation would be restricted to with in producing gardens state. This would hopefully keep big business (PM, RJR or the other tobacco producers) from blowing it up. Also it would help support state business more. ***I really worry about big business taking control over the production but i guess they could compete with and perhaps get out the cartels from importing brick weed. I just don't see them being able to produce the quality desired on such a massive scale. You would have to get lic $$$ to transport large amounts as well.

    • Sales of it would be handeled just like alcohol or tobacco. Get lic and pay the fee $$$ for sale and have the local (city/county)communty.

    The amount of $$$ that would be made off the tax and lic of all this is so rediculous i can not believe it is not legal and regulated. This is what I want to get actually calculated. Find real #'s for the amount of $$$ to be made and saved, that is where this will ultimately have it's power, unfortunatly...

    The DEA could still go after the unlicensed commercial grower, cartels and free up more time for going after meth houses and other harder drugs that effect our society on such a greater level. Releasing non-violent MJ prisoners would save the tax payers X#$$$$$. These are the type of #'s that are needed to be compiled.

    Now I know this has holes all over it but i think its a very reasonable start or outline and I have thought for many many years about what would make most every one happy on both sides. There are still people who would like to see alcohol and tobacco made illegal... so you are never going to please everyone.

    I'm Raygun and this is my plan for a better, stronger America
    :canabis:"gota have my weedies":canabis:
    Perpetrecircoco grow show :lurk:
    Apollos Mist revisited:abduct:
    Sour Bubble Crosses thread
    Serious talk about legalization:listen2:
    400watt Bio-Bucket Cab Feat. Apollos Mist :rasta:

    #2
    I like how far you've taken the details for this, and would certainly love to see some numbers crunched someday. If enough information could be gathered, I agree with you that the amount of money we're talking about here would be astronomically large.

    There are a lot of models in our society for how something like this could be regulated; legal poisons (tobacco/alcohol) and pharmaceuticals of all levels have varying controls, taxes, and production standards that have been tweaked over a long period of time.

    If I didn't have to run right now, I'd try to dig up some research on these precedents, and maybe some general-use figures for cannabis consumption in legal vs illegal regions and in the US in general. With this sort of info, we might be able to roll out some speculative numbers. Even if we shoot low on all our approximations the result will still be massive.

    I'm going to subscribe this and try to dig up some info later.

    Good post,
    ~A

    Comment


      #3
      "The DEA could still go after the unlicensed commercial grower"

      That's the only thing I do not like about your plan. It's still a waste of time to pursue MJ

      Comment


        #4
        ~A:
        Thats what I'm talkin about!


        Originally posted by icmag.is.#1 View Post
        "The DEA could still go after the unlicensed commercial grower"

        That's the only thing I do not like about your plan. It's still a waste of time to pursue MJ

        Agreed but you can't have it all. You are allowed to grow for personal consumption. If you want to grow for profit get a lic go legit. Just like with a lot of other jobs/businesses in the world you need a lic to do. a carpenter, a mechanic, a Dr. even a hairstylist. Most business require a business lic. so why not your cannabis farm?
        Its about controling and regulating the market. They still go after bootleggers.

        Keep it comming
        :canabis:"gota have my weedies":canabis:
        Perpetrecircoco grow show :lurk:
        Apollos Mist revisited:abduct:
        Sour Bubble Crosses thread
        Serious talk about legalization:listen2:
        400watt Bio-Bucket Cab Feat. Apollos Mist :rasta:

        Comment


          #5
          Where you mention ABC controlling brewers and distillers thats only partially correct. They are also subject to the ATF. In fact at the level of actual production the ATF overseas most of it. ABC is usually a state or county agency in most areas. But hey it gives cops something to do so they don't lose their jobs either.... Also alcoholic beverages that are imported deal with customs and atf and don't have any oversight for their production the foreign governments do.

          Comment


            #6
            Freedom - You got the gist of it though. ABC is the localy controled eliment of the equasion. I think it should be more controlled on a local level. Let the people decide in there state what type of commercial production they want.
            :canabis:"gota have my weedies":canabis:
            Perpetrecircoco grow show :lurk:
            Apollos Mist revisited:abduct:
            Sour Bubble Crosses thread
            Serious talk about legalization:listen2:
            400watt Bio-Bucket Cab Feat. Apollos Mist :rasta:

            Comment


              #7
              I think your on to something there raygun but at what plant count would you separate commercial with registration and all that and personal grow. I feel that since mj has been illegial for sooo long that if this were to be the way, then those who had personal gardens and say grew 20 plants perpetual and had alot of left over mj, then just human nature to sell some of the excess and have alittle extra spending money non taxed. Thats where the Feds would step in and apply old law maybe since no taxes or inspections for public safety control was done. It would be cool since more and more states are putting in for med compassion and more press about the failed war on mj and how its not really as bad as the govt says....someday the govt just come out and say we cant spend any more resources to fight a war we havent won since the Reagan era, with new medical research it was found the original data was flawed and we will now allow consenting adults age(determined) to do as raygun outlined above. then the country could tackle the economy problem much more effectively and those who have dreamed of growing big could finally do in live out their dream in full peace and have a lifestyle they wouldnt have to hide and provide a valuable service to the med community and those who just wanted to smoke occassionally and didnt want the work of maintaining a garden.
              When will these people open their eyes and finally realize with all the state voting on mmj, maybe they were not right all these years and somehow them come out not looking like complete idiots. It is known that the law to enact prohibition in the 30's was so flawed and based on such immorality that it should be reviewed in congress at the very least. Alot of harmless people who could otherwise be living productive lives with their families are spending wasteful time in prison for growing a God given plant for Christs sake that positively enables the lives of millions daily.
              If we are a free country and this is a democracy, then start by reviewing the original prohibition act from in the beginning and getting rid of it. Let the all 50 states control their commercial vs personal and both benefit from the taxes gained by the sale. I guarentee you there will not be an incendive then to drop the market prices because of supply and demand will still be at what it is now and they will want to maximize their financial yeild as well. Let there be one standard recipe to follow as above and have penalties in place for those who abuse it. Honestly, I think that may be one way it could possibly work for both sides. The commercial guys wouldnt have to be so worried about them coming in for inspections cause they could rent warehouse space and such and work it as a day job and no disruption in the home. Man, doesnt hurt to dream at least. I think you have a pretty good idea there.
              This many years and still a new member???

              Comment


                #8
                If pot were legalized, then people would probably try it who never would otherwise, and likely a large amount of these people would find it pleasurable or at least see that it's not as bad as it is in the commercials. The problem is, FOR pot to be legal, these people would have to already know that, which is realistically not going to happen. It's like a catch 22.

                The reason I started smoking was because I was fed up with all of the propriety-related BS that everyone around me was doing (IE high school football, kissing teachers ass, etc). I needed to separate myself from those people, and think for myself, so I went the way of the green. These are probably the wrong reasons to start using drugs, but it was also out of curiosity. Problem is, the people who were worried about their rep are still worried about their rep, and without ever trying it they've dismissed it based on what they've heard and the fact that it's illegal. Granted, it's not right for everybody, but to at least understand the basics isn't that hard. How do we educate the stubborn, when they won't even listen to the arguments regarding the pragmatism of locking up so many people for a non-violent crime? when they think that cancer patients are just trying to get high? when the black market funds terrorism, and they use that as an argument FOR criminalization?

                Ignorance, self-righteousness, and greed are the enemies of legalization, and those threads run deep. I'm glad our president admitted to smoking pot, it's too bad now he just smokes cigarettes... yet strangely apropos.

                That said, your system sounds good and thorough. But unfortunately, it's just a little too rational for the US.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Great thread raygun! I like the way your mind works. My gut feeling is that you're on the right track.

                  I agree with Jaysplifferton that before we can get into actual legalization, we need a massive public education/marketing effort. I think marketing types are pretty evil (no offence to those on this board), but nothing big seems to get done without them. I've always wondered why NORMAL or other pro-weed organizations don't run full blown marketing campaigns with full-page newspaper/magazine ads dispelling the lies and misinformation related to our awesome plant. Seems to me they don't do much (that we hear about, anyway) but maintain a good Web site and comment occasionally on weed news.

                  Anyway, once the public is seriously educated about weed, THEN you submit your prepared legalization legislation brief.
                  Pull my finger.

                  None of this is real.

                  "I love these little people; and it is not a slight thing when they, who are so fresh from God, love us."
                  _Charles Dickens

                  Comment


                    #10
                    j~ you gave ne neg rep for this? Please tell me you're not that much of a douch and it was a mistake...

                    My girls going kick my but if I don't go and watch Iron Man...
                    I'll get back at y'all later. I like your thoughts and I have some ways and ideas.
                    :canabis:"gota have my weedies":canabis:
                    Perpetrecircoco grow show :lurk:
                    Apollos Mist revisited:abduct:
                    Sour Bubble Crosses thread
                    Serious talk about legalization:listen2:
                    400watt Bio-Bucket Cab Feat. Apollos Mist :rasta:

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Im keeping an open mind here. I love were ya going with it tho.

                      The Bad= The tobacco and alcohol industry make so much freggin money its going to be hard to get them on Mary Janes side.

                      The Possible= the tobacco and alcohol industry would have to gain control of it for it to become legalized.

                      The most plausible Solution= we continue to push for medical shops and allow the med shop owners to fill there pockets with enough money to were there influence matters in our government and they can run with the big dog billionaire tobacco and alcohol industry.

                      How i see it= pot smokers need to stand up in a single unite, march to the steps of the capitol and demand for the legalization of marijuana. as long as we live in fear and grow in stealth they are always winning. Its time we stand up as one and show the world that were not just a bunch of Doritos eating couch potatoes, but human beings just like them.
                      First Real Grow 400 Watts of GoodNess 6 Strains of Dankness.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Woah. I didn't think I did. that isn't something I would do man... I'll send some positive your way just for posterity. SRY, if that was the case, it was definitely an F-up. This is a good thread; I wouldn't post if I didn't think it was interesting.

                        Iron man is awesome, I love it when they say "tony stark."

                        Comment


                          #13
                          If it was legal guys like me would lose their houses. LOL

                          I'm all for legalization 100%

                          What would happen though is people like us - the people of this forum would be lost - Big corporations would jump in and make big money! Billions of dollars!!!

                          You dont see too many brew shops around becasue people dont need to spend the money when they have unlimited choices at the local bar or store.

                          yeah sure, its super cheap to plant a few seeds in your backyard like tomatoes but how many people live on the tomatoes they grow. There is a billion dollar tomatoe business owned by big corps rigth now.

                          My point being i think it would be great to legalize but...the people that profit will be the wrong people. The Chinese will mass produce this just like everything else and it will be less than a dollar for the best pot...

                          Tell me is that good or bad?
                          Lang Leve de Koningin DG

                          Fear leads to anger; anger leads to hate; hate leads to suffering.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Justa6655321 View Post
                            If it was legal guys like me would lose their houses. LOL

                            I'm all for legalization 100%

                            What would happen though is people like us - the people of this forum would be lost - Big corporations would jump in and make big money! Billions of dollars!!!

                            You dont see too many brew shops around becasue people dont need to spend the money when they have unlimited choices at the local bar or store.

                            yeah sure, its super cheap to plant a few seeds in your backyard like tomatoes but how many people live on the tomatoes they grow. There is a billion dollar tomatoe business owned by big corps rigth now.

                            My point being i think it would be great to legalize but...the people that profit will be the wrong people. The Chinese will mass produce this just like everything else and it will be less than a dollar for the best pot...

                            Tell me is that good or bad?
                            its already happening slowly in California, medical shops have great weed no doubt but there weed is no were close to the quality of weed you could grow yourself. it would become just like the other mass produced products on the market making it less and less desirable.
                            First Real Grow 400 Watts of GoodNess 6 Strains of Dankness.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by blakhash View Post
                              its already happening slowly in California, medical shops have great weed no doubt but there weed is no were close to the quality of weed you could grow yourself. it would become just like the other mass produced products on the market making it less and less desirable.

                              I don't know where to start with that, but I will start here.
                              California is the model of how NOT to do it.
                              The AG or Congress can have cannabis removed from the schedule of narcotics, which HAS TO HAPPEN FOLKS plain and simple. Regardless of what many apparently believe, the president really only has the influence to appoint an AG or ask congress to act. That's it. Then I believe if we hypothetically thumbed our nose to international treaty, then the world would follow suit. I agree, it should be regulated much like alcohol. People can still brew their own now, it would be very similar, it would really, change, the world.

                              Comment

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