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The ULTIMATE stealth strain

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    Originally posted by teide View Post
    That is why I think subterfuge#1 is the best option. Stable mutant leaves throughout the whole life cycle.

    You are in my opinion lucky to have found them, even strong ones, nice. No breeder has so far wanted to work with those pearly phenos. I get that, due to the low yield. The only reason must be the stealthy appearance, and now that stable freak leaves exist, the pearl pheno has merit.
    What is your opinion on the genetics of the grape like buds, are they recessive? Have you seen them in filial offspring? At what percentage? You as a breeder surely have experienced opinions about introgressing the buds.

    Yeah, I read how you lost the original seeds, meant to be in safe keeping, that sucked..
    to be honest i havent seen those pearly grape phenos pop up with any consistency,

    it could be a recessive trait but i havent played around with any to give an opinion ,

    having said that they seem to pop up in haze progeny on occasion,
    here is the last i saw that was wheat/pearl like ,
    its a tom hills haze x c99 x c99 ,, most were very chunky as one would imagine , but then this one popped up ,
    i think heat may have had an influence on it as lower growth from cooler times was more bunched up ...

    despite its look , it was the more potent of the bunch ...


      Originally posted by teide View Post
      Awesome to have you in the thread, Miasa!

      Totally agree.

      Great! I have their cambodian landrace, working it to auto. Also have their shebergan. Don't know if these have the pheno. The Cambodian might be related to thai, so there is a small chance..
      You work the beldia, I work my golden tiger and cambodian, the race is on..

      Good info.

      Totally agree. From the photos I've seen, ABC and subterfuge #1 have the best leaves.
      I have read that original ABC is poorer quality compared to regular strains, and that subterfuge#1 is a vastly improved version. Few grow reports yet to give any real verdict, I guess. What are your ABCs like? Worth using as is, potency wise? My thought is that potency might not be so important, the leaf structure is the vital thing. Potency might be governed mostly by the bud genes, which in the hybrid need to come from the other strain, grinspoon, thai or beldia..

      Hyb, the breeder of subterfuge, has already made an auto version. It is called auto bastard. Regular seeds are available.
      I thought about buying those, to save time in getting both the leaves and the auto genes stable.

      This is great!
      I am excited to see what you find in the Cambodian, Golden Tiger & Sherbergan!

      I have only grown a male so far. Smoke reports on the flowers say the same thing that you are with a low potency but my plan is to work it in with some Thai or OG along the way to give it some kick

      That's awesome! I should pick some of those up and see what I can find

      Looking forward to seeing the progess, awesome to see you're working on the same thing I am
      Ya don’t know, if you don’t grow!


        teide, subterfuge#1 looks unusual and interesting. tons of pics are posted on IG so its "stealthy" feature is gone already :( .
        Last edited by Sava; 04-06-2020, 21:15.


          yeah sava, I know it won't be a secret. but with different buds it will still be the stealthiest option.
          non smoking bypassers near a gorilla grow would not be familiar with the IG posts, hopefully..

          I am really interested in seeing how your auto bastard grows. you will make a grow and smoke report of your subt#1 and auto bastard, I hope?
          The ultimate stealth strain


            thanks for the photo, DM!
            Just goes to show that it doesn't have to be a verified BF grinspoon seed, and though the beads are small, they can pack a punch. more good news.
            the bad news is that we still don't know all there is to the genetics of this pheno, and if it differs between strains. you suspected external factors could have influence in the specific Tom hill x c99 x c99.
            I fear that not all phenos have the same genetics, some might emerge if given the right (or wrong) conditions only.
            some are stable and inheritable, though.
            Mystic Funk has confirmed that at least that is the case with the pearl pheno in his Oaxacan gold.
            Originally posted by Mystic Funk View Post
            Yes it stays this way for me if cloned or reveg. I'm up to F3 on the haze x Oaxacan gold and I still get them. I can't comment on the grinspoon though. Never had it.
            The ultimate stealth strain


              Hops and cannabis split so far back they can't be crossed with each other. Even if you could get it to make seeds, which you can't, the seeds would be sterile. Kind of like fucking a chimpanzee. You can try all you want but you aren't going to have kids. It is possible to graft one plant onto the other, something I need to try one of these days.

              As far as Kaly Seeds, it's either Japanese Hops or funky Ruderalis/hemp type stuff. It's pretty cool what they've done and what they're working with but some of their claims aren't legit. Hops produce terpenes and similar chemicals to THC but they lack the engine to convert it into CBD or THC. There's been quite a few bogus claims on the internet over the last few years, people claiming to get CBD from hops. All have turned out to be false.

              I'd question some of the high THC numbers Kaly claims for their cannabis plants, I doubt some of that Ruderalis looking stuff is 15% THC. They don't show actual lab test results, just post numbers. I'd look at their stuff as novelty. I wish they would't make shit up but it's easy to make unsubstantiated claims on the internet. Maybe it helps them sell a few more seeds, finance their weird breeding project. It's telling that as many discussions as we've had about it there aren't a lot more people posting pics and talking about their strains. Except as curio.

              One more note about hops, almost all hop cuts (actually rhizomes) you buy are female. I can think of one variety, Fuggles, that's a hermaphrodite. I've grown hops for 20 years and never seen a male. Come to think of it, I'd like to pick some seeds out of a bag of Fuggle and plant them. See if I get any males though probably not.

              This has gone off topic, almost forgot what this thread was about. Maybe better in the future to make polls consisting of yes/no questions. Makes them easier to answer. We're talking about plants with an extremely high leaf to calyx ratio, long flowering tropical mutants from Thailand or India. I'm not sure how stealthy a plant that flowers for 20 weeks outdoors is. Even though it doesn't produce typical colas it still has the basic leaf structure, smell, and growth.

              It seems to be common wisdom that these strains are very potent, I've never grown one so I wouldn't know. It seems a lot of time and space to grow a plant with such a low yield, not much total resin to be harvested. I understand that's not the point, they're cool looking plants and a fun idea but I can see why they're so rare. Not just from a commercial viewpoint. Trimming would consist of removing individual calyxes. Also from the practical aspect, how many seeds could a plant without buds produce? At what point would the maximum number of receptive pistils be available? It seems like it would keep growing tips, producing more calyxes over time. Over 20 weeks of flowering that's a lot of male pollen to keep dolling out.


                Loving this thread, this is fantastic.

                Will be following, thanks guys.


                  The ultimate way to trim the ultimate stealth strain. Hold a stem in left hand. Wrap right hand around the stem.
                  Pearls in a bucket.

                  Originally posted by mack 10
                  i once bought some from dampkring coffeeshop.
                  the realstring of pearls pheno.
                  the bud tender stripped the calxs off the stalk with his hands,
                  i nearly passed out...
                  he really thought was doing me a favour too.
                  Last edited by teide; 04-07-2020, 07:09.
                  The ultimate stealth strain


                    those little ducklings look awesome when they are so young ...

                    here are the last ones i grew a few years back ..


                      Uhh...ducksfoot was and is my dream to grow...can't find it anywhere in stock.

                      I've seen a phenotype of ABC that looks like....nest...hehe. Just are going to water your plants and found it full of eggs. Sounds like one more advantage of cannabis plant
                      Attached Files
                      Last edited by Sava; 04-07-2020, 09:49.


                        Originally posted by Sava View Post
                        Uhh...ducksfoot was and is my dream to grow...can't find it anywhere in stock.

                        I've seen a phenotype of ABC that looks like....nest...hehe. Just are going to water your plants and found it full of eggs. Sounds like one more advantage of cannabis plant
                        I can honestly say I've never seen a cannabis plant quite like that.

                        Thanks for the photo!


                          Australian Bastard Cannabis has an amazingly different appearance compared to normal weed. Those genes must be the best starting point for a hybrid with freak leaves, as the shape is different, but stable throughout the whole life cycle.
                          From what I've read though, the potency is not great. As a standalone strain it seems the most stealthy, but it needs further breeding work.
                          Subterfuge #1 seems to have improved bud size, and it is stated to have terpenes and potency on par with the average non freak strain. I wonder how hyb the breeder increased potency, I am pretty sure he crossed ABC with higher potency strains and then backcrossed or interbred offspring to retrieve the leaf pheno.
                          The same can be done with a haze or thai, is my hope. I know nothing about genetics governing bud shape and leaf shape. Are those separate genes? To get sativa buds, will you also need to get sativa leaves? Sativa high can carry through in a indica/sativa hybrid, as in ACE's kali china, but the shorter stature and flowering of this hybrid was accompanied by indica leaves. To maintain the pearl bud pheno in a stealth hybrid, would the genotype of pearly buds found in the long flowering sativa lead to a long flowering period also in the hybrid?
                          I think difference in flavor, aroma, potency and even colour can be achieved when crossing the ABC/subterfuge with another strain. And still keep the ABC leaves. But maybe bud structure is tightly connected to leaf structure genetically, so you can't change one without changing the other. Anyone knows? All the strains that show the beady buds also have sativa leaves. I have never seen a grinspoon/quaze bud on a plant with indica leaves. Maybe pearls cannot show with ABC leaves either.
                          Can anyone call SamS?
                          Last edited by teide; 04-11-2020, 13:48.
                          The ultimate stealth strain


                            Originally posted by HydroOrganicFla View Post
                            I can honestly say I've never seen a cannabis plant quite like that.

                            Thanks for the photo!
                            This is not my photo. It is from a guy Yantra. Searh IG, there are a few more pics of this plant in his gallery.
                            I know from a man who is a parts of this australian weed story, that there is even more unusual phenotype than on the picture in previus post.


                              Originally posted by q3corn View Post
                              I wanna vote for both "can it be done" and "will you grow it" but I don't know how
                              If you vote that you will grow it, you also state that you believe it works.
                              If you vote that it will work, you don't necessarily think it would be good or even worth it, but it's at least doable.
                              Third option is that such a cross doesn't work.
                              The ultimate stealth strain