LED Retailers...

[GP73LPC]

first off i have only included what seem to be the most popular models. if anyone has others and have the following info, speak up...

none of these prices include shipping. if you are in north america, expect shipping to be triple or more on some of the models.

this chart in no way reflects what each individual light is capable of doing.

Enjoy

btw, if anyone notices price changes or errors please speak up. this is way to much for me to follow up on a continuous basis..

 

[SOTF420]

Nice chart

The Lumigrow 330 is much cheaper than $1500 though major online retailers have it for less and they sell them direct to people cheaper also, a friend recently got his for $1200 each.

Much love, LED rules

 

[GP73LPC]

hey SOTF, thanks for you're thoughts

assuming the 330 can be had for $1200 (and i'm not doubting what you say) the results would be as follows:

$3.64 per Advertised Watt VS. $4.14 per Real Watt.

that would move the 330 up 4 spots in the Ad Watts and 2 spots in the Real Watts category...

from your grows i have no doubt what those Lumigrows can do...

 

[SOTF420]

Thanks for the conversions man and I hope people give you the respect here for doing all this leg work compiling this data.

It would be nice to see warranty comparisons too, that is very important I think.

+K!

 

[rives]

Interesting comparison.... I still struggle around with the wattage ratings of these devices - there are a number of ways to look at it, and most viewpoints have some validity, although there is also some blatant bullshit involved! As an electrician, I expect the device to pull the wattage that is on the nameplate (let's call that the "gross wattage" for the purposes of this discussion) - a deviation from this would mean that there is most likely something wrong with the equipment. When I check my Lumigrow ES330, I expect it to be pulling very close to 330 watts at full power or I would start delving into what was ailing it.

You have the ES330 listed as pulling 290 "real watts". I understand that you have the fan and driver wattage backed out, but I would call this the "net wattage". If I checked a device that was rated at 290 watts and it was pulling 330, I would suspect a problem and start trying to chase down a non-existent problem.

Things start to get really goofy when you consider the manufacturer's rating of the LED itself. The fixture that I am building uses Osram "1 watt" diodes, but when they are applied at the conventional voltage, they pull .86 watts. With adequate cooling, they can be pushed up to 2.8 watts. This is where a lot of the manufacturers start pushing the truth envelope, as far as I am concerned - they may be using LEDs that are nominally rated at 3 watts, but because of inadequate cooling and warranty concerns, they only drive them at half of that. The result is a fixture that is marketed as being much more powerful than it really is. However, we have probably all bought some lumber at one time or another, and a 2x4 is actually 1-1/2 x 3-3/8.

I would like to see some standardization on this, and the most reasonable way that I see to approach it is to rate the fixture based on what it pulls at the plug (the gross wattage). This is the standard convention for most equipment, and while I realize that this is seemingly at odds with HID lighting, you have to realize that we are referring only to the lamp when we say that we are "running a 600". Everyone knows that there are ballast losses with HID's, but going by the lamp wattage puts everything on equal footing - there are simply far too many variables with LED's to approach it the same way.

Any thoughts?

 

[GP73LPC]

It would be nice to see warranty comparisons too, that is very important I think.

no doubt warranty is important...

that will take more research on my part. please send me any info you have...

i will try to compile what i can.

 

[GP73LPC]

Interesting comparison.... I still struggle around with the wattage ratings of these devices - there are a number of ways to look at it, and most viewpoints have some validity, although there is also some blatant bullshit involved! As an electrician, I expect the device to pull the wattage that is on the nameplate (let's call that the "gross wattage" for the purposes of this discussion) - a deviation from this would mean that there is most likely something wrong with the equipment. When I check my Lumigrow ES330, I expect it to be pulling very close to 330 watts at full power or I would start delving into what was ailing it.

You have the ES330 listed as pulling 290 "real watts". I understand that you have the fan and driver wattage backed out, but I would call this the "net wattage". If I checked a device that was rated at 290 watts and it was pulling 330, I would suspect a problem and start trying to chase down a non-existent problem.

Things start to get really goofy when you consider the manufacturer's rating of the LED itself. The fixture that I am building uses Osram "1 watt" diodes, but when they are applied at the conventional voltage, they pull .86 watts. With adequate cooling, they can be pushed up to 2.8 watts. This is where a lot of the manufacturers start pushing the truth envelope, as far as I am concerned - they may be using LEDs that are nominally rated at 3 watts, but because of inadequate cooling and warranty concerns, they only drive them at half of that. The result is a fixture that is marketed as being much more powerful than it really is. However, we have probably all bought some lumber at one time or another, and a 2x4 is actually 1-1/2 x 3-3/8.

I would like to see some standardization on this, and the most reasonable way that I see to approach it is to rate the fixture based on what it pulls at the plug (the gross wattage). This is the standard convention for most equipment, and while I realize that this is seemingly at odds with HID lighting, you have to realize that we are referring only to the lamp when we say that we are "running a 600". Everyone knows that there are ballast losses with HID's, but going by the lamp wattage puts everything on equal footing - there are simply far too many variables with LED's to approach it the same way.

Any thoughts?

it's true that LEDs are not driven to what they are advertised as...

if retailers/manufacturers won't be honest best thing we can do is put a kill a watt on each device and post it here...

 

[GP73LPC]

i do want to re-iterate that this chart is only useful in purchase price.

as SOTF as pointed out, warranty info is not included here.

also, actual GRAMS PER WATT out of these lights do not correlate to price per watts in all cases

 

[SOTF420]

I put a kill-a-watt device on the Lumigrow and it pulls like 330 watts as advertised

5 year warranty too on the 330 ES model, total coverage with no bullshit.

 

[GP73LPC]

I put a kill-a-watt device on the Lumigrow and it pulls like 330 watts as advertised

5 year warranty too on the 330 ES model, total coverage with no bullshit.

damn, gotta pic?

i'm not doubting you, but now i am trying to remember where i found that 290 watt information....

the warranty i am pretty sure cannot be touched...

in fact you're making me want to add one to my lights...., stop it !!!

 

[SOTF420]

290 watts is the 58 count x 5 watt LED chips each = 290 watts I think the rest is the fans although I think the 5 watt chips may actually be overdriven slightly for more output since they have such excellent heat management set-up I think I recall something about that from the Lumigrow post by the company owner back in one of the old comparison threads where it beat the hell out of the light by you know who "girl" of comparable power. They really do grow some kick ass fat dense frosty buds man you would not believe what I recently grew with just one of them with T5's around the edges it was pretty epic.

I don't have pics with the light hooked up to the kill-a-watt but trust me it pulls what is stated give or take a few watts.

 

[smokefrogg]

...i just want to chime in that the lumigrow es 165 was pulling 164 watts when i plugged her into the kill a watt...i checked this before mine had the leds not coming on issue that it is currently having

 

[rives]

My 330 pulls exactly 330 watts on the Kill-O-Watt. Whoops - the picture made a liar out of me - 331!

 

[rives]

Well, for some reason it wouldn't allow me to edit the previous post and add a picture.https://www.icmag.com/ic/album.php?albumid=27193&pictureid=759601

 

[zymos]

I've read in some manufacturers' blurbage that some underdrive the LEDs on purpose to reduce heat/increase life...

 

[GP73LPC]

thanks for the pic rives...

here is my welthink wex-c150 plugged into a kill a watt

it would be great if we could get a 'kill a watt' pic from at least each manufacturer, not necessarily each model.

can anybody help out?

 

[GP73LPC]

Well, for some reason it wouldn't allow me to edit the previous post and add a picture.https://www.icmag.com/ic/album.php?albumid=27193&pictureid=759601

just pasting it in the thread for easier viewing, thanks

 

[T_B_M]

Interesting comparison.... I still struggle around with the wattage ratings of these devices - there are a number of ways to look at it, and most viewpoints have some validity, although there is also some blatant bullshit involved! As an electrician, I expect the device to pull the wattage that is on the nameplate (let's call that the "gross wattage" for the purposes of this discussion) - a deviation from this would mean that there is most likely something wrong with the equipment. When I check my Lumigrow ES330, I expect it to be pulling very close to 330 watts at full power or I would start delving into what was ailing it.

You have the ES330 listed as pulling 290 "real watts". I understand that you have the fan and driver wattage backed out, but I would call this the "net wattage". If I checked a device that was rated at 290 watts and it was pulling 330, I would suspect a problem and start trying to chase down a non-existent problem.

Things start to get really goofy when you consider the manufacturer's rating of the LED itself. The fixture that I am building uses Osram "1 watt" diodes, but when they are applied at the conventional voltage, they pull .86 watts. With adequate cooling, they can be pushed up to 2.8 watts. This is where a lot of the manufacturers start pushing the truth envelope, as far as I am concerned - they may be using LEDs that are nominally rated at 3 watts, but because of inadequate cooling and warranty concerns, they only drive them at half of that. The result is a fixture that is marketed as being much more powerful than it really is. However, we have probably all bought some lumber at one time or another, and a 2x4 is actually 1-1/2 x 3-3/8.

I would like to see some standardization on this, and the most reasonable way that I see to approach it is to rate the fixture based on what it pulls at the plug (the gross wattage). This is the standard convention for most equipment, and while I realize that this is seemingly at odds with HID lighting, you have to realize that we are referring only to the lamp when we say that we are "running a 600". Everyone knows that there are ballast losses with HID's, but going by the lamp wattage puts everything on equal footing - there are simply far too many variables with LED's to approach it the same way.

Any thoughts?

Ding ding ding, this is why there are so many nay-sayers to LEDs. The original 100W UFO was probably less than 50W of actual light power. When people realized that little light brite didn't grow worth a damn, the bashing began.

I would rather they state LED power and not include fan/driver power losses. 6 fans at 10W each is 60W, that is quite a bit of non-light power waste.

To get your LED power, it is quite easy to calculate with a DMM. Take the current of each string and multiply it by the voltage of each string. Add up the total power from all strings to get max light power. Too bad they won't release that.

They would rather say they have a 400W light rather than a 240W light. This amongst other things turns me off to 90% of the LED retailers. Learn to build your own. Better quality for less money than a good unit, such as Lumigrow.

 

[GP73LPC]

i agree T_B_M, but most of the fans in these units are probably not drawing more than 1-3 watts each.

i am just guessing, but these are all pretty much 12V DC powered, PC type fans, correct?

mine are...

 

[T_B_M]

Depends on the size. Look at the labels on the fan. If they don't give power rating, multiply (operating voltage x current).

I would assume 5W at least, unless they use smaller fans that can run faster RPM with that low of a power rating.