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    Magnesium deficiency

    Star Dawg-Corey Cut
    17days in to 12/12
    ocean forest soil

    Botanicare Pure Blend Bloom 2-3-4 ( feeding 18mg/gal) for first three weeks. City Tap water with water softener

    I have three other strains none of them show magnesium deficiency.

    I was gifted this clone from a friend and member here. It showed magnesium deficiency around 2-3 weeks into veg. I gave it a couple of teaspoons of epson salt and it greened back up.

    It is now starting to show mag deficiency again 3 weeks into flower. I read when you start to see signs of magnesium deficiency its been going on for a while.

    Do some strains need epson salt in every feeding?

    Would it hurt to add the epson salt to all the plants so I dont have to feed separately?

    #2
    Hamstring I’ve always been told softened water was no good for plants.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by Stinkhorn123 View Post
      Hamstring I’ve always been told softened water was no good for plants.
      Stinkhorn
      Thanks for the reply. Hoping to find out if some strains can be this sensitive to magnesium. I have 3 other strains and none of them are showing any signs of this problem.

      Comment


        #4
        I have no answers, I am only addressing this comment:
        "I read when you start to see signs of magnesium deficiency its been going on for a while."

        I decided to do second winter run. Not having any of my soil mix ready, I bought some bagged stuff of some notoriety; FF Happy Frog.
        Plants have been in that bagged mix for only 10 days now and are already showing signs of mag def.
        Ugg.

        JS. Shrug.
        "... You can't dance and stay uptight, it's a supernatural delight..." ~ Sherman Kelly

        "First there is a mountain, then there is no mountain, then there is." ~ Donovan

        Comment


          #5
          Water softeners tend to do nothing for the EC. Instead they swap salts. Dealing out sodium which we find palatable. High salt levels will push out Mg quite easily. In soil an excess of salt from a softener is just a matter of time.

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by hamstring View Post
            Star Dawg-Corey Cut
            17days in to 12/12
            ocean forest soil

            Botanicare Pure Blend Bloom 2-3-4 ( feeding 18mg/gal) for first three weeks. City Tap water with water softener

            I have three other strains none of them show magnesium deficiency.

            I was gifted this clone from a friend and member here. It showed magnesium deficiency around 2-3 weeks into veg. I gave it a couple of teaspoons of epson salt and it greened back up.

            It is now starting to show mag deficiency again 3 weeks into flower. I read when you start to see signs of magnesium deficiency its been going on for a while.

            Do some strains need epson salt in every feeding?

            Would it hurt to add the epson salt to all the plants so I dont have to feed separately?
            Basically water softening adds sodium, which will lock out nutrients.
            HOW MUCH SODIUM IS ADDED TO WATER DURING SOFTENING?

            For every 100 mg/l of calcium carbonate hardness removed from the water, 46 mg/l of sodium is added.

            Naturally soft water typically contains between 10 to 50 sodium parts-per million (ppm). The sodium content of any water is considered safe to drink by the Drinking Water Inspectorate up to 200 ppm.

            https://www.harveywatersofteners.co....ing-softening/
            An easy way to get around hard water is to:

            - Use an R/O filter
            - Put a teaspoon of magnesium lime in a quart of water for a day, pour off the clean water, and top up to a gallon with more R/O water.

            I've tried that, and it works very well. If a strain still needs more magnesium at some point in it's growth, just mix in 0.1 EC of epsom salt.
            OCEAN FOREST® POTTING SOIL
            Good Things From the Earth and Sea!
            Our most popular potting soil, Ocean Forest® is a powerhouse blend of aged forest products, sphagnum peat moss, earthworm castings, bat guano, fish emulsion, and crab meal.

            Aged forest products, sandy loam, and sphagnum peat moss give Ocean Forest® its light, aerated texture. Start with Ocean Forest® and watch your plants come alive!

            Garden tip: Designed for containers and ready to use right out of the bag. There’s no need for nitrogen fertilizers at first; instead try FoxFarm Big Bloom® Liquid Plant Food to get things started.

            Notice that even FoxFarm is now recommending you start light feeding with their Big Bloom fertilizers?

            Seriously, if you have a well fertilized soil like that, all you need to to is:

            - Feed with a relatively high P fertilizers to stimulate root growth. The roots will grow into fertilized soil and find their own nutrients.

            - Feed (fermented) sugars, to feed the microbes which will break down organic nutrients in the soil and feed them to the plant.

            Don't overfeed them because they are much smaller than the plant, however a little Kombucha goes a long way.

            I like to make a kombucha (I call it kombucha - there's no SCOBY involved, however it smells like wine/vinegar/lemonade) from:

            A bottle/container
            cane sugar (any raw sugar), 10% of the bottle's volume
            cannabis tops, 20% of volume
            tapwater

            Screw the top shut with very light pressure, so CO2 can still escape. Or get a fermentation lock with cork. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermentation_lock

            Put in a warm dark place for a week at least, or until the clear water turns into lemonade, then pour into another container for long term storage.

            This is really the best fertilizer in existence, from germination through vegging.

            For flowering, different products have to be used like hops flowers, hemp flowers, or similar.

            Comment


              #7
              Thanks everyone for the responses. I'm new to indoor growing and the problems that arise. As a avid outdoor grower I have never had to worry about these type nute deficiencies.

              I have read and reread all responses. I don't have a RO system in my house . It was time to feed all of my plants so I decided to use 2 teaspoons of epson salt per liter along with the 2-3-4 ferts. I added it to all the plants. Since softened water is know for locking out the plant I figured adding the epson salts to all of them shouldn't be a bad thing. We will find out.

              Thats the thing that has me second guessing some of the responses. I have three other strains in the same room and none of the others are showing the magnesium deficiency. From a simplistic point of view it seems to point to this one strain.

              Comment


                #8
                UPDATE
                I was way off base on my diagnosis. The tell tell signs of a magnesium deficiency are the iinterveinal yellowing of the leaves. I had yellowing on the edges. Calling out Potassium deficiency vs magnesium. Both mobile nutrients and show in the older leaves.

                Hey I am learning! I had mistakenly said above this is not showing in any other strains that I am currently growing. I now see the same yellowing of the edges in the GG4 also.

                As mentioned above I am growing in ocean forest soil , in the 4th week of flowering and having, "correctly identified potassium deficiency" ,in two of the four strains/plants I have growing.

                I am growing in soil and my fert is more of hydro fert containing some of the micro nutrients. Other than the NPK of 2-3-5 it has Ca1.0% and Mg0.5%.

                First time seeing any deficiencies in my limited indoor experience ,3 grows.

                Should I start feeding with a 0-10-10 fert --or --ultimately is the soft water problem?

                Comment


                  #9
                  The soft water is never going to be a good idea. Though at 4 weeks many feed regimes suggest it's PK time

                  Comment


                    #10
                    f-e

                    Hey brother thanks a bunch for the quick reply. Respect your advice and have seen you around many times. PK it is brother!

                    Thanks , I honestly didn't think the change from guerrilla to indoor would be that much different.

                    There is so much more math involved with indoor growing. No one told me about the math.

                    Outdoor in the midwest add slow release NPK 20-20-20 or some close ratio. into black gold lowlands soil ---done.

                    The outdoor war is with leaf spot or other related fungal diseases.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      I do outdoor to lol Plant it and forget it seems a good policy. Just a few visits to spray them as needed. Chuck a bit of ferts down. Done Though its progressed to soil sampling now instead of compost. It's a lot easier to carry in amendments than bags of compost.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by TanzanianMagic View Post


                        - Feed with a relatively high P fertilizers to stimulate root growth. The roots will grow into fertilized soil and find their own nutrients.

                        - Feed (fermented) sugars, to feed the microbes which will break down organic nutrients in the soil and feed them to the plant.
                        I'm trying to figure this out.. I've always been told soluble phosphorus will be detrimental to organic systems, especially in conjunction with fake exudates. I have problems establishing strong myco networks in containers though (No, you can't 'notill' a 20 gallon pot, not the way I grow/harvest at least?).

                        Recent studies show the plant actually CAN uptake organic forms of phosphorus, along with all kind of organic acids in the soil. Now, if I was a chemist that would be useful info. Mono ammonium phosphate is the goto clone booster in commercial setups, but I'm not about to use anything that's going to make my fungal network suffer, and sure as hell not going to use some chemical that makes my bud smell or taste like I'm smoking meth or pcp.

                        And on that note, ditch the PBP, Op! Never used the stuff but I've smelled its "plastic flower" smell all over
                        High Vpdville, Botanicareland, USA ( Phoenix Arizona). The shit is so commonly overfed by people who think it's organic for some reason, it's astonishing. Same with Mills. That shit is NOT organic but the hydro shop tells people it is.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by CrustyCruz View Post
                          I'm trying to figure this out.. I've always been told soluble phosphorus will be detrimental to organic systems, especially in conjunction with fake exudates. I have problems establishing strong myco networks in containers though (No, you can't 'notill' a 20 gallon pot, not the way I grow/harvest at least?).

                          Recent studies show the plant actually CAN uptake organic forms of phosphorus, along with all kind of organic acids in the soil. Now, if I was a chemist that would be useful info. Mono ammonium phosphate is the goto clone booster in commercial setups, but I'm not about to use anything that's going to make my fungal network suffer, and sure as hell not going to use some chemical that makes my bud smell or taste like I'm smoking meth or pcp.
                          1. You can use a low concentration of mineral nutrients in an organic grow.

                          However, the purpose is to only feed the root to make them grow into fertilized organic soil.

                          This liquid feeding happens only once or twice in the grow - at a) seed germination and b) when new soil is added or the plant is repotted at the start of flowering.

                          Also, the nutrient concentration is much lower than recommended on the label. 0.4 EC for the high P/K or flowering nutrients, and 0.1 EC of epsom salt (MgSO4) for magnesium.

                          Micro life in the soil can easily survive this. Obviously what they cannot survive is the standard strength mineral nutrients being poured over the soil 2 or 3 times per week.

                          When looking for organic phosphorus sources, the following also work in stimulating root growth:

                          bone meal
                          rock phoshate
                          bat guano (high P)

                          -------------------------------------------------

                          Another approach is to make your own nutrients. Take a bottle or container and add:

                          1. 10% of the plant parts you want to grow
                          2. 20% of a raw sugar like cane sugar, which still has lots of the micro-nutrients in it
                          3. Add tapwater
                          4. Put in a dark warm space for 1 week or more

                          The resulting product should smell like lemonade/vinegar or wine. It will beneficially influence the taste of the cannabis.

                          You add a little to your water and feed right away. Remember that this is mainly for feeding the microbes, which are much smaller in mass than the plants, so even though it's very benign, don't overfeed with it.

                          In combination with supersoil, that's really all the nutrients you need.

                          The only adjustment needed to be made is to feed with plant parts that were in the same stage as the plant you're feeding with it, after flowering starts. In other words:

                          Germination, seedling and veg: cannabis tops
                          Early Flowering: hemp flowers, hops flowers or other flowers
                          Late flowering/ripening: ripe flowers, ripe fruit.

                          I haven't tried them yet, however I'm looking into fermenting hempseed sprouts next.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Most homes depending on age I think are plumbed with water softener in mind as in at least kitchen cold water and outside bibs are not on the soft water side. I have a GE RO system that has a 2 gallon tank for ice maker and a tap on the kitchen sink for coffee etc. Makes enough water I can even use a couple gallons a day for my humidifier in the grow closet. I mix 50/50 RO and kitchen cold for plants.
                            My Corey cut has what looks like a tad of N deficiency on bigger fans @ end of week 3. First time I have ran it and it’s along side two cuts of Ice Cream Cake I sourced from Cali clone vendors and a GG4 cut. Corey is only one showing issue but overall looks really good. Just 2-3 big fan leaves for now.

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