Fungus gnats or WINGED ROOT APHIDS???

[EastBayGrower]

i have battled RA for over 3 years indoors now, tried everything, recently did an orethene/ri[tide drench but they keep on returning.. ive really resigned myself to the fact that they are just around and ill have to deal with them without killing my plants...

i tried all the organic fungus based treatments, met52, botanigaurd, foliar pack, ect.. but none of them worked as advertised for me... until i ordered the PFR-97, THAT STUFF WORKS! they take really good care about overnight'ing with coldpacks, and ask that you store in 40* temps this is all meant to keep the spores alive and as fresh as possible... once i started adding this to my watering mix, 10-15ml per gallon is working wonderfully.. it doesnt eradicate them completely, atleast hasnt for me so far but i went from seeing 10 RA on the lip of fabric pot to one or two at most when watering and it stay at one or two next watering... usually it was an exponential increase when using foliar pack until i hit em with some kind of poison (riptide usually)

anyway the main reason i went to try the PFR97 is the fact its cheaper than the others, 5pds for $150 and you actually use less, i was using 2tbl of foliar pack and i use half that now with PFR97, and i remember someone saying if foliar pack was so good then real organic farmers would use it... the real farmers are using CERTIS PFR97 bet...

give it a shot, water at lights out and kill the fans for atleast an hour to raise humidity, and your golden... i remember whenever i hit like week 2-3 of flower my plants would ALWAYS die off from RA and i was limping to a disappointing finish,,, dont suffer like that, get some pfr97 if you are

this was a huge find for me, i havent hafd flowering plants this healthy with RA ever..

 

[RedBeardy5]

Nice find eastbaygrower, I use met52 as a preventative and have had no success finding it the past couple months. Going to have to order some pfr-97

 

[Jerbear's dead]

Winged RA or????

Winged RA or????

Recently got some cuts from a dispensary and these bastards showed up in my quarantine area. Anyone seen these before? Don't exactly match winged RA and I'm not seeing any evidence of RA in the root zone, but had already dunked everything in triazicide and followed with botanigard right outta the gate.

 

[RedBeardy5]

Your pictures are not coming up..

 

[Jerbear's dead]

I can see the pics when I'm logged in. Any suggestions as to why they don't show up? Can anyone see this now?

 

[burny downz]

Looks more aphid than gnat....
Sometimes just the smell of incoming pesticides makes the crawlers grow wings and flee....

 

[Granger2]

I'm not sure how you can hazard a guess from that photo. FG has pointed rear end, RA has blunt rear end with 2 talepipes.

 

[Jerbear's dead]

Hey thanks for the input guys, it's much appreciated!
Granger2, so the adult RA(winged) will have the tail pipes too? I'm not really seeing those...and don't the antennae look like they're too short?
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]new insect1.jpg [/FONT]

 

[George]

Its cool...obviously I hit a nerve.

BTW, I am not the one the chimed in this thread about a product that is not available to purchase on the internet. Standing by my words--"We will have to take your word for it".

Fuckin lame dude. You sound like all the new kids these days trying to grow. Jesus Christ.

To everyone else, there are many different types of aphids and most species develope a winged form. Just cause you see a winged aphid does not make it a winged *root* aphid! I say this because I see so many people misidentify their pests it's ridiculous, then they go rummaging around looking at roots when the answer is in the leaves or vice versa depending on your pest. How many times have you seen someone say x and x product doesn't work, then they post up a picture of the pest and you're just like

Everyone needs help at some point, I asked for help a while back, it's normal, but come on. unfortunately we need legalization and the raping of the plant WE as a group saved through prohibition because dudes just don't care. Spraying shit all over the god damn place like it has no effect on anything else. I use chemicals too, I'm no organic farmer, but there are judgement calls to make with this shit. I have citrus trees with aphids, but I don't go feeding them Imid because I knew the flowers were ready to show. Bees fly around here like drunk birds with no aim and direction because of people that have access to these chemicals and have no idea how to properly use them. Whatever, ending my rant, shouldn't of even posted it but I'm venting so fuck it

 

[George]

Doesn't look like an aphid or a fungus gnat. Post a direct link somewhere so we can get a clearer pic. Some of the hosts downgrade the photo making it difficult to identify anything

 

[DocTim420]

Its cool...obviously I hit a nerve.

BTW, I am not the one the chimed in this thread about a product that is not available to purchase on the internet. Standing by my words--"We will have to take your word for it".

Fuckin lame dude. You sound like all the new kids these days trying to grow. Jesus Christ.

To everyone else, there are many different types of aphids and most species develope a winged form. Just cause you see a winged aphid does not make it a winged *root* aphid! I say this because I see so many people misidentify their pests it's ridiculous, then they go rummaging around looking at roots when the answer is in the leaves or vice versa depending on your pest. How many times have you seen someone say x and x product doesn't work, then they post up a picture of the pest and you're just like

Everyone needs help at some point, I asked for help a while back, it's normal, but come on. unfortunately we need legalization and the raping of the plant WE as a group saved through prohibition because dudes just don't care. Spraying shit all over the god damn place like it has no effect on anything else. I use chemicals too, I'm no organic farmer, but there are judgement calls to make with this shit. I have citrus trees with aphids, but I don't go feeding them Imid because I knew the flowers were ready to show. Bees fly around here like drunk birds with no aim and direction because of people that have access to these chemicals and have no idea how to properly use them. Whatever, ending my rant, shouldn't of even posted it but I'm venting so fuck it

Did I offend you in a prior life?

My quote and your accompanying rant appear to be 100% disconnected. If I stated unequivocally, that something was available on the internet and you discovered that it wasn't...what would you do? Call me out on it on my bullshit or give me a "thumbs up"?

I called the guy out on his bullshit...if that offends you, then I guess you are one monster sized snowflake that bruises easily!

 

[Jerbear's dead]

For anyone interested, I believe I've finally identified my pest. Looks to be some kind of shore fly. A pretty innocuous insect to have compared to RA or broad mites. Kinda weird to find adults from the dispensary, but maybe they came from outside or under the house.
The shore fly photo in this link is closest to what I got going on. Stumbled on it by mistake googling to see how effective botanigard is for fungus gnats.
Good luck to everyone battling RA! I beat them back in '07 by cutting my stock up, dipping them in avid and line drying them before putting them in rw cubes to root out. Then cleaned the shit outta my rooms with 1:1 beach/water mixture with some safer's in there too. Fuckers decimated my aeroponics scene back then.
http://mrec.ifas.ufl.edu/lso/fungusgnats.htm

 

[mc23q]

A)How bad was your infestation and what effects have you observed in your plants/grow?

Pretty bad. Bugs were crawling everywhere.

B)Have you grown the same way before with success or with the same problems? Have you grown a different way before with success or the same problems?

Growing in soil and perlite. Organic ferts and mushroom compost. Have grown with success last season. Was hit with spider mites at some point but it wasn't that bad.

C)Have you treated them before (if so, how and what were your results/conclusions)

Nope. Only treatment I gave them this season was a bit of dishwashing liquid and veggie oil.
I also gave them a few sprays of aspirin water (hoping this will be my saving grace now).

D)What type of medium/nutrients and what type of setup (hand water, ebb/flow etc)

Soil (simple bag) + perlite + mushroom compost. Been feeding them with Seasol seaweed solution and Powerfeed. Added some Dynamic Lifter (organic) at some point.
In terms of nutrients, they never showed any burn or deficiency. I believed I had a really good balance until the infestation showed itself.

Conditions: It rained 17/24 days. After about 3-4 days of rain I moved them under cover to avoid waterlogging. This is when symptoms started showing.

Damage: Yellowing of lower leaves at first. I thought it was a nitrogen deficiency because it was early flowering. I resisted adding significant amounts to avoid problems.
Tips started burning as if they were over fertilised. New growth tips were slightly twisted.
I initially thought it was a lockout due to the wet so I gave them a few foliar sprays of low N plus PK.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=339512
I started a thread in the infirmary about it as well.

I have added pics for what they look like.

I've also uploaded a Youtube video.
https://youtu.be/pXUPvTdrwCU

There seem to be three different types of bug. I'm not 100% sure they are aphids. The winged ones definitely look like winged root aphids.
I only saw them yesterday scurrying across the top soil.
I nuked all 4 pots with Imid last night (one is about 25 days into flower and the others are 7 days in).
There has been a dramatic decrease in their activity. I struggled to find any today but they are still around in small amounts. I will wait a few days before giving a significant spray of potassium + fatty acids.

Can anyone confirm or deny these are aphids? Can anyone tell me what the little white one is?

My fear is that I'll also get spider mites if I can fight the aphids.

Appreciate any help in advance.

 

[Miraculous Meds]

The first picture looks similar to h. Miles soil mite. The other pics, I can't tell for sure. Look for cornicles on the crawlers backsides to help identify if those r aphids in the root zone. They look like tailpipes sticking out. Research this thread n google identifying characteristics of the flyers. Flying ra's generally have a more rounded butt, while fg's have a pointed butt. Imid, in flower especially, isn't a great choice. Research the health risks. Gl, n keep updating here, there's plenty of knowledgeable folks who will chime in with some help soon enough.

 

[F. Dupp]

That winged little bitch is an RA flyer for sure.

 

[Granger2]

I'm not so sure of that. Can't see the abdomen. -granger

 

[mc23q]

Sorry for the bad picture quality. I'm using my phone.

This is a side view but it's a bit blurry. Hoping that it can shed some light.

I was almost sure that they are winged RA because of the angle of their wings.

By way of update:

Main plant:
I can't find any crawlies on her anymore. I've been digging around all day and there are practically 0 bugs around. She suffered the most. There some nice green growth springing up on her stems (more lower than upper).

Clone 1: Very few bugs crawling around in the top few cm of soil. I'm not sure if I should wait a few days for them to die out from the Imid, or if I should take further action. No visible plant defects yet.

Clone 2: Significant reduction in bugs but I can still relatively easily find them if I scratch the surface. No visible plant defects yet.

Plant 4: Just entered flowering. Can't find bugs on her but there are lots of ants in the top soil. I understand this could indicate aphids and gnats are around. No visible plant defects yet, although it has slowish growth.

I can't decide whether to be patient and see what happens (I'm out of town until Monday morning), or to take further action right now.

If I have to use Imid again it has to be in the next 4 days otherwise it will be too risky.

Appreciate all your responses and efforts.

 

[Miraculous Meds]

Yeah it's too blury to tell. U should be able to see in person if the back side is rounded n has cornicles. If ur already doing the Chem route, I'd go with spectracide triazicide. It's a contact killer u can flush thru ur medium. I think the flush dosage was 30ml per gallon. It won't be systemic like Imid, so it should be out of the plant in days compared to who knows how long with imid.

 

[medicalmj]

first pic looks like a soil mite (probably harmless and they would def be expected in healthy compost google Oribatid), second has features of a Thrip except the legs seem a bit to long usually closer to body, the last pic could be an Aphid flyer, pluck the wings if possible and better pics all around to get better look...

 

[mickmick1]

new user here....ive been scrubbing through this aphid forum and decided to contact you for your advice. i currently have a very small infestation of these bitches.....noticed it when digging up a few seeds that had beautiful taproots going into dirt but they never broke ground. after a few days i dug one up....completely covered in root aphids. i treated immediately with a neem/mosquito plug/tobacco tea concoction. anyway you mentioned playing with this gamma stuff and also had contacted the company but never listed the EXACT product you purchased. would you be willing to share that info?