Chanting Growers Group

[PassTheDoobie]

How Those Initially Aspiring to the Way Can attain Buddhahood through the Lotus Sutra

How Those Initially Aspiring to the Way Can attain Buddhahood through the Lotus Sutra

(continued)

Written by Nichiren between 1271 and 1282

Question: The Flower Garland school propounds the doctrine of the five teachings (14) and declares all the other sutras to be inferior, and the Flower Garland Sutra, superior. The True Word school puts forth the doctrine of the ten stages of the mind, declaring that all the other sutras, being exoteric teachings, are inferior, while the True Word school, because it represents the esoteric teachings, is superior. The Zen school rejects all the sutras as belonging to the realm of written teachings and asserts “a separate transmission outside the sutras, independent of words or writings.” Because enlightenment, they say, is gained merely by sitting and facing the wall, the Zen school alone is superior. The Pure Land school sets forth two kinds of practices, correct and sundry. (15) The Lotus Sutra and the various other sutras are rejected as belonging to the category of sundry practices, and hence one is urged to “discard, close, ignore, and abandon” (16) them. The three Pure Land sutras, on the other hand, they claim, are adapted to the people’s capacity and are wonderful sutras belonging to the realm of correct practices. Thus each school in its conceit maintains its own biased attachment. But which one represents the true intention of Shakyamuni Buddha?

Answer: Each school declares its own sutras to be superior, all other sutras being dismissed as inferior, and on this basis labels itself the correct school. But their arguments are based merely upon the words of teachers and not upon the Buddha’s teaching. Only the Lotus Sutra was proclaimed superior by the Buddha himself when he expounded the simile of the five flavors, likening them to the teachings of the five periods. He also declared that of all the various sutras that he “has preached, now preaches, and will preach,” in terms of the path of attaining Buddhahood, none could rival the Lotus Sutra. These statements are in truth the Buddha’s own golden words.

Therefore, when people declare that their own sutra surpasses the Lotus Sutra, or that their own school is superior to the Lotus school, they are like persons of inferior rank calling someone of high rank a commoner, or retainers whose families for generations been in the service of a certain lord turning against him and declaring him to be their servant. How can they escape grave retribution?

On the other hand, the assertion that the various other sutras rank below the Lotus Sutra is not based upon the words of teachers, but is plainly stated in the text of the sutra itself. In this respect, it is like a ruler asserting that he is superior to his subjects, or a samurai calling a commoner a person of low rank. What penalty could this possibly bring? This sutra, The Lotus, represents the true intention of the Buddha, and the prime concern of T’ien-t’ai and Miao-lo.

14) A comparative classification of the Buddhist sutras. The five teachings are the Hinayana teaching, the elementary Mahayana teaching, the final Mahayana teaching, the sudden teaching, and the perfect teaching. The perfect teaching indicates the Flower Garland and Lotus sutras, between which the Flower Garland Sutra is assigned the higher place.
15) A classification established by Shanyao of the Chinese Pure Land school. “Correct practices” are practices for attaining rebirth in the Pure Land of Amida Buddha. The term is used in contrast to “sundry practices,” or all Buddhist practices not directed toward Amida Buddha.
16) Honen does not use these words in particular form, however, Nichiren Daishonin took these words from The Nembutsu Chosen above All and put them together as a set.

 

[SoCal Hippy]

Vancouver sounds awesome

Vancouver sounds awesome

Thanks Bog for such a nice description of BC. I could picture everything. I am truly a ocean guy (growing up in SoCal of course) and miss it alot. And being in the desert now for going on 4yrs, I miss the trees and green. Gordy, I would never miss the white, snow that is. Never lived in it, never will, I don't think. I hate the cold. Looking forward to the trip. Gottta be able to make that happen. Cora's son is moving back to Washington this week and moving to Mt. Vernon which I believe is about 45 mins from there in Canada. and her other 2 son's are in Seattle, so we could accomplish alot on that trip. Not sure how she is going to accept the smoke freedom, but I am sure with the group we assemble, she couldn't help to accept.

Just got back from a Holiday SoCal trip and really had a great time. Made significant progress in mending a torn relationship with my 2 youngest. Both Lisa(21) and Derek(18) made time and we some good talks. That was 6 months of difficult emptiness; most all of it my fault. Just sucked it up and did what I had to do. I am so thankful and determined never to let that happen ever again. Won't go into the details. the past is the past. Honimyo(sp) 'From this moment on'
Spent time with my mother, she is so much better and being well taken care of in a private residence now. Was previously in a convelescent home and she was getting worse after my father passed last Dec. Saw my brother and his wife, my 2 nieces and their families. Visited my fathers gravesite. Just saw a hell of alot of ppl in 2 days; I am wiped out but feel good.

Keep up the great posts everyone and Happy Holidays! (gotta watch the wasteline, ouch) :wink:

 

[SoCal Hippy]

Right on words, Gordy!

Right on words, Gordy!

"Hundreds of years have now passed since the writing of those words and IMHO, here we remain in a defiled and evil age. Hooray for the Bodhisattvas of the Earth for bringing hope and reminding us a doorway exists for all of us to walk through from this age which plagues beings to this day and moment." :friends:
(previous quote by Gordy)

 

[GordyP]

It's all BOG's fault!!

It's all BOG's fault!!

Boy is my face red!

There I was, writing questions about the Lotus Sutra when I let my mind wander to BOG's posting about mastering the Kama Sutra. Then I screwed it up altogether and started refering to the Karma Sutra?

Doesn't anybody proof-read these things?!

Seriously, I hope my brain fart didn't blow too many minds. Yes, I was actually refering to the Lotus Sutra in my last posting. And BOG, stop making my imagination take over like that!

Hey SoCal, how ya doin'? Yeah, that was a powerful quote and unfortunately we're still stuck here in an age where plague and evil still exist. Let's create a lot of good group Karma together in Vancouver and tip that Good vs. Evil scale a bit in the right direction.

S.G., hope you got those cars registered in Texas by now!

PTD/stonegirl, hope you're doing well and rejoicing in the thrills and experience of parenthood. With both my babies grown and gone, I've got no one to play Santa Claus for anymore. Looking forward to the 22nd when my youngest comes home on break. Haven't seen her in six months. Don't blink an eye, or your crew will be all grown up and gone before you know it.

Keep Em Green and Growin'
(it's freakin' 6 degrees in Indiana right now, with a wind chill of -25!)

GordyP

 

[Guest]

Hey Gang!

Hey Gang!

So Cal! So glad to see you back. Wondered where you were. Glad your trip was successful and left you in a better place. It is always nice to get in a a better place with your kids, if I understood that right.

And Gordy P! What were you thinking? I'm a little concerned that Bog took you there! Or where exactly is your mind? Honestly, no kidding, I didn't catch it until I read it the second time. I thought.....I don't know what the KARMA SUTRA is....if I ask PTD will blast me for not knowing! And no.....I did not go do the cars today. I went shopping. I always do my shopping the week of Xmas all in one day and that was today. I promise I will get it done tomorrow.

Well it looks like we are all ready to go. Just waiting for the time of when to plan. I am very very excited. Southern Girl

 

[PassTheDoobie]

How Those Initially Aspiring to the Way Can attain Buddhahood through the Lotus Sutra

How Those Initially Aspiring to the Way Can attain Buddhahood through the Lotus Sutra

(continued)

Written by Nichiren between 1271 and 1282

Question: The teachings of the Buddha’s lifetime were all intended to benefit the people. And because people differ from one another in their innate nature, he expounded the various teachings. Nevertheless, his basic intention in all cases was simply to enable everyone to attain the Buddha way. Therefore, [people reason that] the sutra that is pertinent to oneself may be quite irrelevant to others, while the sutra that is pertinent to them will be irrelevant to oneself. Thus, for example, for persons who can attain the way through the Nembutsu teachings of the sutras other than the Lotus Sutra, the Meditation and related sutras will be of greatest benefit while the Lotus sutra will be of no help. Conversely, for those who can reach Buddhahood and achieve the way through the Lotus Sutra, the other sutras will be irrelevant while the Lotus Sutra will be of greatest benefit. When the Buddha said, “In these more than forty years, I have not yet revealed the truth”, (17) when he said, “Though they [the Buddhas] point out various different paths, in truth they do so for the sake of the Buddha vehicle”, (18) or when he said, ‘Honestly discarding expedient means, I will preach only the unsurpassed way,” (19) he was addressing persons with the capacity to attain the way through the Lotus Sutra. Everyone in the world agrees that this argument is reasonable. How should we understand this? If this view is correct, then there is really no difference between the Mahayana and the Hinayana, and no dissimilarity between the provisional and true teachings. Thus I find myself in great doubt as to which sutra the Buddha defined as representing his true intention, and which in fact he proclaimed to be the teaching for attaining Buddhahood.

Answer: From the very beginning, the Buddha’s intention in appearing in the world was to preach the wonderful Law. But because the people differed so greatly in their capacity and were not ripe to receive it, the Buddha first pondered for a period of three weeks, then spent the following forty years and more preparing and readying the people, and then finally preached this wonderful Law. The Buddha said: “If I merely praised the Buddha vehicle, then the living beings, sunk in their suffering, would be incapable of believing in this Law. And because they rejected the Law and failed to believe in it, they would fall into the three evil paths.” (20) He also said, “The World-Honored One has long expounded his doctrines and must now reveal the truth.” (21)

The meaning of these passages is that the Buddha from the very beginning intended to preach this doctrine of the Buddha vehicle. But he knew that the people, having no inclination to hear the Buddha’s Law, would not put their faith in it, but on the contrary would undoubtedly slander it. Therefore, in order to develop the people’s capacities to the same level, he spent a period of forty or more years preaching the Flower garland, Agama, Correct and Equal, and Wisdom sutras, and then at the very last preached the Lotus Sutra. At that time, Shariputra, Maudgalyayana, and the others of the twelve thousand voice-hearers; Manjushri, Maitreya, and the others of the eighty thousand bodhisattvas; the ten thousands of millions of wheel-turning kings; as well as Brahma, Shakra, and countless other heavenly beings, who had all been present during the Buddha’s more than forty years of preaching, each exclaimed with regard to the teachings they had heard before, “We would never gain the immeasurable insight of the Thus Come One.” (22) But when they heard him preach the Lotus sutra, they rejoiced, exclaiming, “This cluster of unsurpassed jewels has come to us unsought.” (23) Therefore, they said, “Since times past often we have heard the World-Honored One’s preaching, but we have never heard this kind of profound, wonderful, and superior Law.”(24) They also said “The Buddha preaches a rarely encountered Law, one never heard from times past.” (25)

The intent of these passages is to praise the Lotus sutra by saying that, though those present at the assembly had heard the Buddha preach a considerable number of times during the preceding forty years and more, they had never heard anything like the law of the Lotus Sutra, and that the Buddha had never before preached a doctrine such as this.

The doctrines heard by the assembly in the preceding forty-two years cannot in any way be compared with those of this sutra they were now hearing. Therefore, it is a grave error to assert that this sutra was preached for the sake of persons who can attain the way through the Lotus sutra, but that it is useless for persons who can gain the way through the sutras preached earlier. In the case of the sutras preached during the previous forty-two years, since they were provided as expedient means for individuals each with a particular capacity or relationship, one can perhaps speak of them as being relevant to some persons but not to others. But in the case of the Lotus Sutra, the different capacities that had enabled individuals to benefit from hearing one or another of the earlier sutras were all drawn together and readied so that they became identical and pure; the sutra was preached to such people. Therefore, there can be no question of it being relevant to some persons and irrelevant to others.

How lamentable that the distinctions between Mahayana and Hinayana, or between provisional and true teaching, should become confused in this manner, so that the purpose of the Buddha’s advent has been lost, and the people go about declaring that the Lotus sutra is useless for persons with the capacity to attain the way through the earlier sutras. One should guard against and fear such errors! In past times there was a man known as the Great Teacher Tokuitsu who taught just this sort of doctrine to others and fully believed it in his own mind, reading the Lotus Sutra in light of such interpretation. But the Great Teacher Dengyo attacked him, saying that though he praises the Lotus Sutra, he destroys its heart. (26) After that, the Great Teacher Tokuitsu’s tongue split into eight pieces and he died.

17) Immeasurable Meanings Sutra
18) Lotus sutra, chap.2.
19) Ibid.
20) Ibid.
21) Ibid.
22) Ibid., chap. 3. In the text of the sutra, these words are spoken in the singular by Shariputra. The Daishonin interprets them here as expressing the thoughts of the entire assembly.
23) Ibid., chap. 4. In the text of the sutra, these words are spoken by Mahakashyapa.
24) Ibid., chap. 4. In the text of the sutra, these words are spoken by the sons of gods.
25) Ibid., chap. 17. In the text of the sutra, these words are spoken by Maitreya.
26) Outstanding Principles

 

[SoCal Hippy]

actual proof is yours

actual proof is yours

SG,

Just wanted to acknowledge and congratulate you on the recognition for Nurse of the Yr! That is so cool. I give more credence to your award than "Times" 2004 Man of the Year. It just about made me gag and throw up.

 

[PassTheDoobie]

SG! When do I ever blast you for not kowing something unless I've already said it to you a thousand times?

(and even then, I say it again....)

T (SoCal, chant more Daimoku!)

 

[Guest]

Exactly!

Exactly!

Big Brother! That could have been one of them! Cause I sure didn't remember the karma sutra! And GordyP was talking like he knew what he was talking about! :friends: And you always keep telling me until I get it. Just try to stay in your good graces! By the way, do you have some sort of Buddhist activity planned for our trip?

And thank you SoCAl. If it hadn't been for the school money I might have felt the same way! It just doesn't look good for the lesser degree to know more than the bigger degree. If you get my drift. So they validate keeping me after 30 years. Southern Girl

 

[SoCal Hippy]

PTD..u psychic???

PTD..u psychic???

I got your not so subte msg. Will do. Have to. Just hit the big 50 on the Doobie Bros day as you know and my 31 is coming up. Wow, 0ver 60% of my life has been striving to devote my life to the Lotus Sutra. Incredible!

 

[Guest]

Wow SoCAl!

Wow SoCAl!

I did not realize you had been chanting as long as Tommy. NOWWW I know who you are! My light is slow to come on sometimes. We all need to chant more! Life gets too fast sometimes with too much going on. I'm having to be real careful not to get caught up in the fast lane here. I have been hitting the edge lately. Will really be glad when the holidays are over and the new year is here. I'm ready. I'm sure it is full of new changes. For the first time in a long time I look forward to it.

I guess I can share this now that it is over. I was told back in August that I had an 80% chance of having cancer. I had a multitude of tests done and over half of my testing was lost to the hurricane. Some of what I knew was bad and some good. I almost believed that the reason I was brought back here was to get my son home because I was going to die. So I had the barage of testing redone 10 days ago and went in for my reports yesterday. My son had even stayed up chanting about it the night before.
The Doc told me that I had lab work of an athelete. It was better than 90% of the people he sees daily. What had been found before was gone. They want me to recheck in 6 months but they are scratching their head. He told me to keep doing whatever it is that I do and take a good multivitamin, keep life simple and enjoyable and Thank whomever my higher power was because they did not understand. Some had been repeated. I cried all the way home. What a relief and how humbling a feeling it was to know. The kids were waiting on me when I got home. I told them what had been said. You could see the relief in my Son. He had tears in his eyes, said NamMyoHoRengeKyo and said I knew you would live forever! All you need is a good man! ha ha I put it on my Xmas List.
Seriously, I have looked very hard at my life in the last two day. How much wasted time, wasted energy and emotions. So.....that is why I'm excited about the new year. Hopefully, I'm different enough now from all the clearing this year that my life can be different. Once again! Never doubt the power!
Best to All, Southern Girl

 

[PassTheDoobie]

Didn't need to be psychic....

Didn't need to be psychic....

Knowing you for thirty years is enough! I could tell by how often you post and what you say when you do. Just keep in mind how much you want things to be different, and don't relax until they actually are, rather than look like they are going to be. It's easy with you, 'cause all I have to do is look at my heart in a mirror.

SG!!! As usual, you have spread joy throughout the universe by allowing the Buddhist Gods and Buddhas of the ten directions to rejoice in fulfilling their vows to protect the votaries of the Lotus Sutra. Actual proof of the power of your Buddha Nature is the BOMB, isn't it? Your life is a light that illuminates my path ceaselessly, and it is my honor to know you.

To say the least, I agree with your son.

Ditto on the wish for the well deserved Christmas gift!

I hope everyone is having a safe and happy holiday season.

Remember everyone! This is gampon-no-mumyo's favorite season too! There are millions of ways to fuck up right now. Stay serious about your goals and desires for change ALL THE WAY THROUGH THE NEW YEAR! Relax now and you could fuck all of the momentum you have struggled to build for the last five months! Let's all be smarter this year than we have in year's past. Win! No matter what! Live a life that others only dream about!

It is up to you. How bad do you want it?

 

[PassTheDoobie]

PS: Gordy, has any of what I have subsequently written from this gosho made any of my answers to your questions more clear? Are you catching the drift of the Daishonin's position on the issue?

T

 

[PassTheDoobie]

How Those Initially Aspiring to the Way Can attain Buddhahood through the Lotus Sutra

How Those Initially Aspiring to the Way Can attain Buddhahood through the Lotus Sutra

(continued)

Written by Nichiren between 1271 and 1282

Question: In a commentary by T’ien-t’ai, it is stated that the bodhisattvas had already gained entrance [to enlightenment] through the various sutras. (27) From this it must follow that the Lotus Sutra was preached merely for the sake of persons of the two vehicles and not for bodhisattvas, since the bodhisattvas had already gained enlightenment by the earlier sutras. If so, then one should understand that the words of the Buddha, “ I have not yet revealed the truth,” “Honestly discarding expedient means,” and all the pronouncements found in the eight volumes of the Lotus sutra, must have been spoken entirely for persons of the two vehicles and are not relevant to even a single Bodhisattva. Is this correct?

Answer: The doctrine that the Lotus Sutra was preached solely for persons of the two vehicles and not for bodhisattvas was expounded in China before the time of T’ien-t’ai by the ten leading scholars representing the three schools of the south and the seven schools of the north. But T’ien-t’ai refuted this doctrine and put an end to it, so it is no longer propagated today. If you say that there are no bodhisattvas who profit from the Lotus sutra, then how do you account for the passage that says, “When the bodhisattvas hear this Law, they will be release from all entanglements of doubt.”? (28) In view of this, can you possibly say that bodhisattvas derive no benefit from the sutra?

Or perhaps you will argue that the Lotus Sutra can benefit the bodhisattvas of dull faculties, as it does persons of the two vehicles, but that the bodhisattvas of keen facilities have already received sufficient benefit from the earlier sutras. If so, then how do you account for the passage in the sutra that says, “Those of keen capacity, of dull capacity—I cause the Dharma rain to rain on all equally,” (29) or the passage that says, “All bodhisattvas who attain supreme perfect enlightenment in all cases do so through this sutra”? (30) The meaning of these passages is that, regardless of whether their faculties are keen or dull, whether they abide by the precepts or break them, whether they are of exalted birth or humble, all bodhisattvas, all ordinary people, and all persons of the two vehicles shall become Buddhas and achieve the way through the Lotus Sutra.

If you say that those bodhisattvas who have received benefit from the Lotus Sutra are all persons of dull faculties, are you then prepared to say that Universal Worthy, Manjushri, Maitreya, Medicine King, and all the others of the eighty thousand bodhisattvas are of dull faculties? And if you maintain that the bodhisattvas of keen faculties had already attained the way through the sutras preached prior to the Lotus Sutra, then just who are these bodhisattvas?

Moreover, this enlightenment attained by bodhisattvas through the earlier sutras—is it the same enlightenment described in the Lotus Sutra? If so, then it is in fact the enlightenment of the Lotus Sutra and not the result of the earlier sutras. And if it is an enlightenment other than that of the Lotus Sutra, then in which of the sutras that the Buddha “has preached, now preaches, and will preach” is it contained? In any event, if it is not the enlightenment of the Lotus sutra, then it can only be a partial enlightenment and not a true enlightenment.

Therefore, the Immeasurable Meaning Sutra states, “Therefore the way living beings gained was not uniform but differed in different cases.” It also says, “[As for those living beings who are unable to hear this sutra…] they will in the end fail to gain unsurpassed enlightenment.” In these passages the Buddha is saying that the people attained different degrees of enlightenment through the sutras expounded prior to the Lotus Sutra, but in the end they did not attain the way of supreme enlightenment of the Lotus Sutra itself.

27) This statement actually appears in Miao-lo’s Annotations on “The Profound Meaning of the Lotus Sutra.”
28) Lotus Sutra, chap.2
29) Ibid., chap.5
30) Ibid., chap.10

 

[SoCal Hippy]

Can you do it?

Can you do it?

Can you do it? Can you do it? Can you do it?

How bout that?

SG, awesome girl. What a hosshaku kempon. Your mission still lives strong!

 

[GordyP]

Interpreting the Word

Interpreting the Word

PTDoobie: Yes, your transcriptions have squared away many of my questions concerning the LOTUS Sutra and it's history. Much appreciated! Was this your meaning from much earlier postings/conversations? My time would be better spent by going directly to the study of the Lotus Sutra and by-passing study of earlier sutras which came into existence in the 40 years leading up to the creation of this sutra; which defines the universal truth (Buddha nature) that resides in all of us, and all other living beings for that matter.

So you've given me lots of understanding about many issues I brought up, as well as created a "next stage" of questions and understanding to ponder. Hopefully I'll be able to convert this newly-found knowledge into the stuff of wisdom, from the heart, to help guide me the remainder of this life and on into eternity.

A Beautiful Awakening

GordyP

p.s. Who/What the hell is gampon-no-mumyo? Sounds like a bad-ass demon of some kind, and something to be avoided! Already had my radar switched on to monitor dem ol' holiday blues this season, but this gampon guy sounds like a bad motherf...(watch yo mouth!). I'm jus talkin' about gampon-no-mumyo.

 

[BushyOldGrower]

Southern Girl, I am so happy for your honor as a wonderful nurse. Evidence of how the giving of love is more important than the actual act of caring for a patient. They feel this and respond in kind giving them energy to overcome their trial. You are the proof as I see this as the fruit of your beliefs. Don't worry about my sexual nature because I am shy in person and not at all suggestive or sexual. But Gordy can blame me.

Gordy, I always seem to stir up trouble a bit wherever I go. You got me thinking on this again however. It seems there have been hindu teachers who said that some return to earth already enlightened as a reward and that they can engage in a lot of gratuitious sex without inhibitions or guilt. That sounds good to me but maybe next lifetime eh? Seriously I think jealousy is one of those big problems this world has and much of what people do to place barriers between themselves is due to this. Enlightened people should be sure of their loved ones enough to trust. Someday I hope people aren't afraid to show affection toward each other. I am not really as touchy/feely as you might think but when I worked in the medical field my hand was on the frightened persons shoulder. It felt good to be able to provide help and to be entrusted with their lives. When times get rough people do come together.

Everyone of you have to know that I am very happy and this place is a big reason why. Just chanting has brought clarity to what I have always known. My faith this holiday season is stronger then ever and I thank all of you. So much love and wisdom here. We are a great team. Together just imagine our strengths and the many people we could have join us.

My post always reflect my thinking anywhere I post and in my private correspondences with many people I have shared this chant and its meaning. Never have I been so clear in my thinking and I feel my power of soul growing.

I believe also that very hard times are coming soon but we live for today confident that no matter what we can face anything with dignity knowing what we should all know. Nothing can harm us. Nothing can kill us and the only possible outcome is enlightenment and nirvana. I admit I desire complete nirvana but I know my work isn't done by a long shot. If I do leave prematurely my son will be my legacy and he will carry on my work. I feel well and I can wait however.

Tom, thanks for the info you just posted. I think I see similarities again with the teachings of great masters who emulate Buddha. I feel Jesus knew the truth but when he returned to his ministry to the Jews the truth was far from their beliefs. They had progressed from belief in many Gods to one God which was progress in the evolution of religion. The truth of a non personal God was just too foriegn to the Jews and sounded like no GOD, no justice in the universe. So he did what I think you said here...

Answer: From the very beginning, the Buddha’s intention in appearing in the world was to preach the wonderful Law. But because the people differed so greatly in their capacity and were not ripe to receive it, the Buddha first pondered for a period of three weeks, then spent the following forty years and more preparing and readying the people, and then finally preached this wonderful Law. The Buddha said: “If I merely praised the Buddha vehicle, then the living beings, sunk in their suffering, would be incapable of believing in this Law. And because they rejected the Law and failed to believe in it, they would fall into the three evil paths.” (20) He also said, “The World-Honored One has long expounded his doctrines and must now reveal the truth.” (21)

Later in the ministry Jesus delivered his Sermon on the Mount speech and I just love that. He cites many principles that buddha would understand and agree with. Jesus was just a man like any other in reality but his words spoke volumes to those deluded so horribly. This world still has the same problems and what Jesus said is still true. People tried to make him GOD and stories of his works were probably exaggerated but when truth is spoken it can't be denied. True religion = true science and images of GOD on a throne were the best they could understand at the time is all.

As Jesus said that he was a fisher of men I told Tom that what I do is really just my bait but that getting young people seeing truth is what I hope to do. This site is nice but there are people with wrong action in their hearts. Trouble in this world is unavoidable but we are together. The only reason we are together is because we all want the same thing. Devotion to promoting the understanding of the spirit of the universal law. I think we help and that by chanting we join all those in the entire universe who might be buddhists. They are chanting for the lives of the people of this planet but they know that none of us will die.

What matters is that through the hard times or the good times we continue our work. We can't just rest and expect the new age to just come. Action must be taken because evil flourishes when good men and women rest. We work every day and not just to make money. We are working toward a new age of love and human compassion. An age when humans grow up and behave like civilized beings with respect for the planet and every living thing. I won't even kill bugs anymore.

But, don't piss me off because I am an imperfect creature.

I think I will stick with Buddha. BOG

 

[SoCal Hippy]

definitely one 'bad ass demon' Gordy!

definitely one 'bad ass demon' Gordy!

Here is the definition of fundamental darkness
(Jpn.: gampon-no-mumyo) from the Dictionary of Buddhist Terms


Also, fundamental ignorance or primal ignorance. The most deeply rooted illusion inherent in life, said to give rise to all other illusions. Darkness in this sense means inability to see or recognize the truth, particularly, the true nature of one's life. The term fundamental darkness is contrasted with the fundamental nature of enlightenment, which is the Buddha nature inherent in life. According to the Shrimala Sutra, fundamental darkness is the most difficult illusion to surmount and can be eradicated only by the wisdom of the Buddha. T'ien-t'ai (538-597) interprets darkness as illusion that prevents one from realizing the truth of the Middle Way, and divides such illusion into forty-two types, the last of which is fundamental darkness. This illusion is only extirpated when one attains the stage of perfect enlightenment, the last of the fifty-two stages of bodhisattva practice. Nichiren (1222-1282) interprets fundamental darkness as ignorance of the ultimate Law, or ignorance of the fact that one's life is essentially a manifestation of that Law, which he identifies as Nam-myoho-renge-kyo. In The Treatment of Illness, Nichiren states: "The heart of the Lotus school is the doctrine of three thousand realms in a single moment of life, which reveals that both good and evil are inherent even in those at the highest stage of perfect enlightenment. The fundamental nature of enlightenment manifests itself as Brahma and Shakra, whereas the fundamental darkness manifests itself as the devil king of the sixth heaven" (1113). Nichiren thus regards fundamental darkness as latent even in the enlightened life of the Buddha, and the devil king of the sixth heaven as a manifestation or personification of life's fundamental darkness . The Record of the Orally Transmitted Teachings reads, "Belief is a sharp sword that cuts off fundamental darkness or ignorance."

 

[PassTheDoobie]

From Gordy:

"Was this your meaning from much earlier postings/conversations? My time would be better spent by going directly to the study of the Lotus Sutra and by-passing study of earlier sutras which came into existence in the 40 years leading up to the creation of this sutra; which defines the universal truth (Buddha nature) that resides in all of us, and all other living beings for that matter."

Yes, but I had not yet read this gosho. When I read it, I knew it conveyed perfectly what I was trying to say to you. Gordy, this gosho's for you!

T

 

[GordyP]

Thanks SoCal!

Thanks SoCal!

Thank you for such a quick response to my question about gampon-no-mumyo! I joked a little about it, but was serious about hearing about this manifestion of evil, this Fundamental Darkness. I can understand how these fast and sometimes stressfull times make it easier open the door to the Fundamental Darkness and the terrible delusions (ignorance) it can create in false opinions of one's self and one's lot in life.

Really surprized me when I read your quote from Nichiren "...both good and evil are inherent even in those at the highest stage of perfect enlightenment". That, my friend, is blowing my mind right now and giving me a lot to think about! Another challenge to ponder and come to understand. I certainly do not have any doubts about this reality related by Nichiren and will work to better understand this truth given to us by him.

Thanks Bro,

GordyP