Sick of clear trichomes!!!

[HempKat]

Isn't reducing temps gonna increash RH tho?
cooler air can take less humidity so RH rises with same amount of humidity into the air, but lower temps.

All I know is when I'm growing in the winter and my grow room is 78 F with lights on the RH is around 60% but when the lights go out and the temps drop to about 62 - 58 F the RH drops to around 45-50% at least according to the devices I have measuring temp and humidity. But then again that's measuring the humidity in the air and like you said cooler air takes less humidity or perhaps a better way to phrase it is holds less humidity so you're not going to have the same amount of humidity in the air with lower temps. The humidity there I would figure is condensing into something like a dew and getting absorbed back into the plant and the soil and some is likely being carried out of the room due to air exchange and/or if a dehumidifier is in use. So soil will dry out slower at lower temps so you could say at lower temps there is more moisture in the soil but I'm not talking about what's in the soil. I do use a dehumidifier in my grow room and it does run more at the start of lights out then it does later on, so perhaps that accounts for the changes I see in my humidity meter?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humidity
As the temperature of a parcel of air decreases it will eventually reach the saturation point without adding or losing water mass. The amount of water vapor contained within a parcel of air can vary significantly. For example, a parcel of air near saturation may contain 28 g (0.99 oz) of water per cubic metre of air at 30 °C (86 °F), but only 8 g (0.28 oz) of water per cubic metre of air at 8 °C (46 °F).

 

[BobChronic6505]

Hey BobChronic6505 under what light do u grow?
there is a big discussion in an other forum that lm301 grown trichs turn amber very late, for some guys its cloudy is the new amber.
from my own experience i know that under lm301 some trichs will get more light yellowish than amber and its easy to overlook for me.

I'm using a 400w hps in a 32x32 tent.

edit: I'm assuming that is an led light, and I just wanna say I'm not surprised. When I first started growing with led I could hardly get any cloudy trichs much less amber lol. That's when I switched to hps and started getting more cloudy trichs, but theres still some clear, and still no amber

 

[BobChronic6505]

HempKat thanks for your help man I appreciate your thorough responses

 

[exploziv]

What you are describing is not possible unless your meter is off (and the cheap chinese ones are usually off by about 30% or more) or there is something that puts out water into the air when it gets hotter, or absorbs it as it gets colder. And I am not talking about condensation. To correctly understand humidity and relative humidity , you need to know relative humidity is not the same as humidity.
Basic explanation that holds for our needs would be:
Relative humidity is the water content of the air in relation to temperature.
Humidity is just the presence of water in some quantity, but doesn't account for temperature or relate to how much more humidity can the air take.. or not.
Hot air can take a lot of water in form of vapor (gas).
Cold air can take much less.
This explains 2 things: condensation (happening when air is cooling and can not keep as much water as before) &
evaporation (when the more heat there is, and the more potential for air to accept water, the faster water would evaporate)
So a normal, simplified growroom cycle would be rh lowering when lights start, and rh through the roof as the lights stop and air starts to cool. This, ofc is impacted by a lot of variables in real life, like a/c, ventilation, having humidifier and/or dehumidifiers, temperature, intake air temperature, reaching dew point or not, intake air RH and some more. Even taking all those possible variables into account, what you experiencing there is very improbable to happen ever. So maybe that rh meter is crap.

EDIT:
Sorry, I was high and misread your reply. You are right, the dehumidifier is the one taking care of that.
BTW, check a vpd chart, your rh should be higher at that temp, so maybe find a way to put that dehuey on a timer so you have better vpd for the plants on lights on. It can be stopped even a bit earlier than lights on, to start the humidoty going in time for it.
With a timer (if the dehuey is able to run when plugged in) you could achieve a basic vpd controller by powering it only when needed in each 24 h cycle).

 

[Greenheart]

I have never been impressed with clear trichome harvesting. Cloudy is good. I used to take them until I saw lots of amber. I like the knockout weed. I noticed if you wait to long the trichome heads start disappearing. What I look for now is dominant cloudy just starting to see amber and very little clear.

If you haven't read Simon's Thread on Curing it is the way to go. Growing is only half the show. A good cure is essential to decent smoke.

I hang them until I get stem snap. I then box and burp them until I get 60% rh. Then it is into opaque flip lock jar with a rubber seal until I smoke it all. Be sure to invest in a hygrometer. It isn't a requirement but it will sure eliminate a lot of guess work and errors.

Green or hay smell might be an indication of jarring too early. It should go away in about 14 days. After that point you should start seeing more flavors, better high, and smoother burning smoke. I would say at least 4 weeks to get the good stuff. Curing can be extended for a very long time if your storage conditions are right. Once you get below 55% rh the curing stops. Some people start the jarring at 65%. IMO anything above 60% you are risking mold.

HPS shouldn't have any issues getting to cloudy and amber stages.

 

[BobChronic6505]

I have never been impressed with clear trichome harvesting. Cloudy is good. I used to take them until I saw lots of amber. I like the knockout weed. I noticed if you wait to long the trichome heads start disappearing. What I look for now is dominant cloudy just starting to see amber and very little clear.

If you haven't read Simon's Thread on Curing it is the way to go. Growing is only half the show. A good cure is essential to decent smoke.

I hang them until I get stem snap. I then box and burp them until I get 60% rh. Then it is into opaque flip lock jar with a rubber seal until I smoke it all. Be sure to invest in a hygrometer. It isn't a requirement but it will sure eliminate a lot of guess work and errors.

Green or hay smell might be an indication of jarring too early. It should go away in about 14 days. After that point you should start seeing more flavors, better high, and smoother burning smoke. I would say at least 4 weeks to get the good stuff. Curing can be extended for a very long time if your storage conditions are right. Once you get below 55% rh the curing stops. Some people start the jarring at 65%. IMO anything above 60% you are risking mold.

HPS shouldn't have any issues getting to cloudy and amber stages.

In my very limited experience, I've found that jarring bud at 60ish rh doesnt give me good results. I think if you have bud in a jar that reads 60% then that bud is still wet. Why would I want to put wet bud in an environment with little to no oxygen exchange? I'm not against jarring bud once its dry dry but i dont like the straight into jars after its cut off the plant style

 

[fonzee]

In my very limited experience, I've found that jarring bud at 60ish rh doesnt give me good results. I think if you have bud in a jar that reads 60% then that bud is still wet. Why would I want to put wet bud in an environment with little to no oxygen exchange? I'm not against jarring bud once its dry dry but i dont like the straight into jars after its cut off the plant style

You want the meter in the jar to read 70-75% by my book, because this is where curing happens. Curing can definitely change the color of the trichomes.
Obviously, one will need to put the buds out and back in daily to reduce the risk of mold.
After 5 days you can start sampling and see when you are happy with the results. I usually got from 1 to 2 weeks.
Then, when you want to finish the curing, dry it down to 50% for storage or 45% for consumption.
I use a dehumidifier in a grow tent and keep the RH at 35% and temp not more than 32°C. Should take 1-1.5 days to dry the fresh buds for curing, and some hours (half a day?) to get from curing RH to consumption RH.
But this is just my way. There are so many ways to cure your buds - and it will get them more reddish resin.

Other reasons for the trichome color not to change -
My first guess is genetics. Some just don't change much.
Second is that your photographs are not good enough to show the color of the resin properly - reflection can be a bitch with these shots.

I, also, reap by the look of the whole plants and not by a microscopic look at the trichomes. If at maturity you didn't like the high - the color of the trichomes is not likely the problem.

 

[Greenheart]

Why would I want to put wet bud in an environment with little to no oxygen exchange?

Decarbolixation

Not wet bud.
Not straight into jars.

Into jars in the last 5% of the curing window. Until then try and get it into the curing zone and slowly bring it down. This requires frequent burping. Bags, boxes, tins, jars whatever method you want to slowly exchange the oxygen and extend the curing time without rotting your hard earned stash.

Straw or hay. That's either a poor plant or improper cure imo.

It isn't uncommon for it to have a faint smell like straw or hay for the first 2 weeks as the chlorophyll comes out. AFTER that it should begin to improve and continue to do so.

That's how the hippie explained curing to me and when I came to IC simon's thread confirmed it.

Anyway I really feel for you. That is a real downer to put so much effort into it and not get the goods. Best of luck on things.

 

[HempKat]

EDIT:
Sorry, I was high and misread your reply. You are right, the dehumidifier is the one taking care of that.
BTW, check a vpd chart, your rh should be higher at that temp, so maybe find a way to put that dehuey on a timer so you have better vpd for the plants on lights on. It can be stopped even a bit earlier than lights on, to start the humidoty going in time for it.
With a timer (if the dehuey is able to run when plugged in) you could achieve a basic vpd controller by powering it only when needed in each 24 h cycle).

My humidifier is always on but when it runs is controlled by the level the humidity is in the air and what I have the dehumidifier set at for when to cut on, which is usually at 60-65%. Unfortunately I have to run my grow room in a separate building from my house and because of that it's just not practical or feasible to monitor it enough to know what it's operational habits are throughout the day. That being siad I have been in the building where the grow room is at lights out on many occasions and I will say it does seem to start running frequently in the beginning of lights out. The next time I'm most often in the building where the grow room is, is just before lights on and I do notice at that time the dehumidifier seems a lot more quiet.

 

[HempKat]

I, also, reap by the look of the whole plants and not by a microscopic look at the trichomes.

This is why my preferred method of judging trichomes is with a good camera with a good macro mode. This gives me a much broader view of the trichomes then just looking thru a jewelers loupe or using something like an electronic microscope. Even with a good camera that lets me judge a larger area at once I still try to take pictures of as many buds as I can get to without disturbing the plant too much. That way I can base my evaluation on the collective results I'm seeing rather then just one small limited area of one or too buds. The only downside to this method is I'm often getting so close that resin frequently gets on my lens and it's kind of a pain to clean off.

 

[BobChronic6505]

If at maturity you didn't like the high - the color of the trichomes is not likely the problem.

Why do you think this, and if this is true, why? And ultimately my goal is to produce better bud. It's that all the info says that thc is made and stored in the trichome and that is why I put so much stock and emphasis on it. If my clear trichome bud got me fried I wouldnt care one bit what color they were.

 

[BobChronic6505]

That is a real downer to put so much effort into it and not get the goods. Best of luck on things.

Hell yeah it is. Each time it gets a little better, but dammitman it takes so fucking long

 

[fonzee]

This is why my preferred method of judging trichomes is with a good camera with a good macro mode. This gives me a much broader view of the trichomes then just looking thru a jewelers loupe or using something like an electronic microscope. Even with a good camera that lets me judge a larger area at once I still try to take pictures of as many buds as I can get to without disturbing the plant too much. That way I can base my evaluation on the collective results I'm seeing rather then just one small limited area of one or too buds. The only downside to this method is I'm often getting so close that resin frequently gets on my lens and it's kind of a pain to clean off.

I just don't find the stage of trichomes as that important. I can look at them easily.

Why do you think this, and if this is true, why? And ultimately my goal is to produce better bud. It's that all the info says that thc is made and stored in the trichome and that is why I put so much stock and emphasis on it. If my clear trichome bud got me fried I wouldnt care one bit what color they were.

There's way more to the high than the color of the trichomes. I still didn't get what strains you are working with. It might simply be not for you

 

[BobChronic6505]

There's way more to the high than the color of the trichomes. I still didn't get what strains you are working with. It might simply be not for you

I started with autoflower, crop king (lol) mephisto, night owl, was unhappy with that, switched to photoperiod. Got better results but still nothing on the level of what I think weed used to be and what weed "should" be. I've had luck with ethos skunk hero and I had rly good luck with barneys tangerine dream. I've had some luck with cannarado strains. I grew a cpl dna genetics kandy kush and la confidential. The LA was ok. I've got some top dawg flowering now and some bodhi seeds that I just started. I've just been trying a little bit of everything in Hopes I find something good in there

 

[Dropped Cat]

In my very limited experience, I've found that jarring bud at 60ish rh doesnt give me good results. I think if you have bud in a jar that reads 60% then that bud is still wet. Why would I want to put wet bud in an environment with little to no oxygen exchange? I'm not against jarring bud once its dry dry but i dont like the straight into jars after its cut off the plant style

If your dried bud goes into a jar at less than 55%, then no further development will occur,
hay will be the best you can anticipate, with little to no trichome maturity in the jar.

Likely your harvest is too dry to sweat in the jar, I go maybe 4 or 5 days air dry hanging/bagged pre jar.

Jarred bud at 60% is a good start, as the process goes, the bud is wettest close to the stem.

Allowing daily air exchange, the bud's moisture migrates away from the stem to the outer bud,
as moisture will be wicked away from the stem toward the outer dry area.

That's the sweat, like letting wet clay dry slowly to avoid cracking in the kiln.

60% is fine to jar, open jars daily to exchange air, do it every day or more if needed.

Sweating is not a set it and forget it thing,

Calibrate your hygrometer, maybe that can be a thing to take control.

You getting there, next harvest with those killer genetics you have now.

 

[flylowgethigh]

I started with autoflower, crop king (lol) mephisto, night owl, was unhappy with that, switched to photoperiod. Got better results but still nothing on the level of what I think weed used to be and what weed "should" be. I've had luck with ethos skunk hero and I had rly good luck with barneys tangerine dream. I've had some luck with cannarado strains. I grew a cpl dna genetics kandy kush and la confidential. The LA was ok. I've got some top dawg flowering now and some bodhi seeds that I just started. I've just been trying a little bit of everything in Hopes I find something good in there

It's the way it is done, more than the strain. My Strawberry Bananna was no where near as frosty and smelly as the stuff I bought off the hill packed. Not even close.

 

[Brother Nature]

If your environment isn't optimal you're plants won't mature properly, ever. In saying that, you should take most growing advice with a grain of salt too. Some strains are shit when too much amber creeps in, some are excellent, some never get there. I've always used it as a guideline, I tend to pull most plants when I get to a vast majority of cloudy, a few sort-of clear, and maybe an amber or two, because that's the high I prefer. It helps to learn each strain too, that takes a couple runs. Using a good loupe makes a huge difference too, going from 60x to 100x magnification shows you a lot of subtle differences you may not have noticed before. THere's a lot of good advice in this thread and site so I'm sure you'll get where you need to soon. Happy growing bro!

 

[BobChronic6505]

My Strawberry Bananna was no where near as frosty and smelly as the stuff I bought off the hill packed. Not even close.

what is the hill packed???

 

[BobChronic6505]

It's the way it is done, more than the strain. My Strawberry Bananna was no where near as frosty and smelly as the stuff I bought off the hill packed. Not even close.

Do u mean tom hill? I've seen that name in here but idk anything about who that is or anything

 

[HempKat]

I just don't find the stage of trichomes as that important. I can look at them easily.

Well if you can judge the trichomes accurately with your naked eye then you have an ability that the overwhelming majority of growers on this site lacks. But hey if your eyes are that good, then more power to you.