Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Quest to find out WHY some BHO turns into "butter" or "budder" over time?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #31
    Originally posted by Really Sam View Post
    I wonder why the article would say such a thing? Maybe because whipping creams "contain emulsified droplets composed of fats that are partly crystalline and partly liquid (Rousseau, 2000), and the incorporated gas cells are stabilized to varying degrees by an adsorbed layer of partly coalesced fat globules." The article clearly states that "in physical chemistry terms, these kinds of aerated dairy products can be regarded as examples of particle-stabilized foams." They would still be foams even if they did not contain emulsified fats. Budder is still a SOLID foam. I'm surprised that you equate reading an article's abstract with purchasing and reading the entire thing. Is this how all your research is conducted?
    I am surprised you presume to assume that I don't have the full article, I posted a link to the abstract as the full article is not online unless you pay for it.
    Sure, this is how I do all my research, it saves me so much time.

    Next time "really sam" just ask me before you presume to assume, that way you don't have to waste your time presuming things that are not even real, you will have a lot more time to spend on your own research....

    -SamS

    Comment


      #32
      Next time before you presume to assume that it was an emulsion and linking people to something other than what you read yourself and knew contained information that proved your claim to be fallacious, just check yo'self and then Wikipedia. If you really had the full article then you would know that an emulsion foam is a combination of two distinct colloidal species. Then again you'd already have known that if your research skills were fit to impugn mine and wouldn't have claimed that budder is an emulsion to begin with. The reason Kut believes that budder is a crystalline substance is because he refuses to acknowledge that butane remains in his oil. I know, it's a foam made of terpene bubbles! Hilarious. At least you'll not plague us with such claims. Keep begging for people to hook you up with journals in the Strains and Hybridization forum since you're on top of all that research yourself.

      Comment


        #33
        funny shit guys...

        Comment


          #34
          Same batch, different states.









          Comment


            #35
            Scraped



            Comment


              #36
              Originally posted by Really Sam View Post
              Next time before you presume to assume that it was an emulsion and linking people to something other than what you read yourself and knew contained information that proved your claim to be fallacious, just check yo'self and then Wikipedia. If you really had the full article then you would know that an emulsion foam is a combination of two distinct colloidal species. Then again you'd already have known that if your research skills were fit to impugn mine and wouldn't have claimed that budder is an emulsion to begin with. The reason Kut believes that budder is a crystalline substance is because he refuses to acknowledge that butane remains in his oil. I know, it's a foam made of terpene bubbles! Hilarious. At least you'll not plague us with such claims. Keep begging for people to hook you up with journals in the Strains and Hybridization forum since you're on top of all that research yourself.
              Really Sam,
              I did not claim that budder was an emulsion, I was making a guess and I clearly stated I did not know for sure. Reread my posts.
              As for your claim that budder is made of terpene bubbles, do you know of any terpenoids that specifically help or hinder the budder process? Or do you think all terpenoids cause the same reactions? Have you ever tried to make budder out of pure THC, that would be an easy way to confirm your theory. Then add terpenoids and re-try.
              And while we are at it how about why some resin will turn whitey, even dry sift. What do you think is happening that makes the resin less adhesive, and less potent? As well as white? Heated it will re-melt the resin, but not be as good as it was originally before turning white. You can't look this up as far as I know, you'll need to do the research yourself to find an answer.
              -SamS

              Comment


                #37
                I get a kick out of the people who fear solvents like the plague. People munch food with all natural soy protein, not realizing the stuff is made by hexane extraction. Many food products are made in giant vats of solvent.

                Also, there is ammonia in the burgers at McDonald's and Burger King.

                Comment


                  #38
                  Sam you're missing out on what was me taking a good jab at Kut's mistaken believe that bubbles in oil are terpenoids and not residual butane due to improper technique. I didn't have a problem with your guess that budder was an emulsion, it was educated and close to the mark. I did find it somewhat misleading to the people who regard your advice as sage that you followed that post with one that linked to something people couldn't read for themselves. When those who can read the first paragraph of the actual article they easily see that an emulsion foam does not an emulsion make. To suggest that the article supported that emulsions were foams by offering up an abbreviated summary that made it look like that did no good at all and suggested you yourself hadn't read the article.

                  Hexane's not a solvent anyone should fear. They test hexane to make sure it's devoid of the solvents that shouldn't be in there in greater than carefully reviewed levels if it's to be used in a food. Pharmaceutical solvents should have to pass more stringent guidelines. Lighter fluid has neither guideline to pass.

                  Bob Clarke ain't told you bout white hash? The mystery you seek to solve is the aromatizing of THC into CBN. Check that Red Eye '98, man immortalized in 60's style art poster ought to have a few free copies. The tables. CBN, physical characteristics. So confident am I that I cite it from memory and as I do not have it here before me I have delivered it unto you nearly verbatim. Flakey, white substance. I think his source was the Merck.

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Commonly known truth is that even dark colored glass crumbled into flakes, sand and dust has white color.
                    Amber in 15 minutes from cutting - Быстрый Янтарь - - Absolute Amber from Banana Silver Ladyboys - Fem Pollen via Colloidal Silver - Home-made Charas

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by Really Sam View Post

                      Bob Clarke ain't told you bout white hash? The mystery you seek to solve is the aromatizing of THC into CBN. Check that Red Eye '98, man immortalized in 60's style art poster ought to have a few free copies. The tables. CBN, physical characteristics. So confident am I that I cite it from memory and as I do not have it here before me I have delivered it unto you nearly verbatim. Flakey, white substance. I think his source was the Merck.
                      Now I get what you were saying to KUT.

                      I thought I was pretty clear that I was not an expert on foams or emulsions, just trying to offer a few ideas to share. What about which terpenoids help or hinder budder making? Any thoughts? Cannabis has 140+ terpenoids.... They can't all be the same in that they all help, some must not help the budder process?

                      ROB Clarke and I have discussed why hash turns white many many times but he never mentioned to me he felt it was from THC aromatizing into CBN. But regardless if you analyze the whitey hash with a GC it is not higher in CBN, it is lower in THC. Hash can turn white overnight, THC degrades into CBN slowly over a very long time, months or years.
                      It was not clear in your post above what you are referring to?
                      The table I think you refer to is on page 203 of Rob's book: Hashish?
                      CBN, White crystalline powder in solid leaflets.

                      Any more guesses?
                      Last edited by Sam_Skunkman; 01-15-2010, 09:19.

                      Comment


                        #41
                        But when you test for degradation you don't test the CBN level straight up, you take a ratio of the CBN/THC (%). Wouldn't that increase the % and show that the THC had indeed degraded into CBN? I imagine you couldn't make your own CBN reference standard as with THC. Capitalizing Bob's name so it won't be diminished by Kut's?

                        Are these glands immature? Remember the chemical composition can be completely different if the plant hasn't completed its complex organic syntheses. You'll still be way up in the CBC / CBG part of the chain. Check for them and cannabigerol monomethyl ether and things. Polar bastards wouldn't melt if you sat on them all day.

                        Jump is right about glass and color. It's a physics refraction / reflection thing. Also I just remembered that Hashish! was dedicated to Rob's father so in case he's a Jr. I'll stop calling him Bob out of respect.

                        Comment


                          #42
                          this got way too deep.
                          Current grow: Motherlode Gardens 2020

                          Comment


                            #43
                            Originally posted by Really Sam View Post
                            But when you test for degradation you don't test the CBN level straight up, you take a ratio of the CBN/THC (%). Wouldn't that increase the % and show that the THC had indeed degraded into CBN? I imagine you couldn't make your own CBN reference standard as with THC. Capitalizing Bob's name so it won't be diminished by Kut's?
                            First of all that is one way to measure the degradation of THC into CBN. Another way is to first measure the THC/CBN level and after the resin turning white measure it again, that is what I did.
                            Sure I do have a prep HPLC and I can make my own Cannabinoid standards pretty easy, but I can buy Cannabinoid analytical standards here in the Netherlands, they are all legal except for THC.
                            I capitalized Rob's name to point out his name is not Bob.

                            Originally posted by Really Sam View Post
                            Are these glands immature? Remember the chemical composition can be completely different if the plant hasn't completed its complex organic syntheses. You'll still be way up in the CBC / CBG part of the chain. Check for them and cannabigerol monomethyl ether and things. Polar bastards wouldn't melt if you sat on them all day.

                            Jump is right about glass and color. It's a physics refraction / reflection thing. Also I just remembered that Hashish! was dedicated to Rob's father so in case he's a Jr. I'll stop calling him Bob out of respect.
                            No the glands were fully mature, and anyway in my experience the ratio of Cannabinoids don't really change much at all, only the absolute amounts increase with maturity.
                            BTW, both pure CBC, CBD, CBG, CBN, all white powders, and THCV melt when heated and turn into a puddle of oil like material before being vaporized or smoked. My THCV standard is a dark oil that was so solid it needed to be heated just to measure and weigh.
                            I have gram amounts of them all to use in my R&D.

                            What about the terpenoids? Which help or hinder Budder making? Any ideas?
                            -SamS
                            Last edited by Sam_Skunkman; 01-16-2010, 06:56.

                            Comment


                              #44
                              CBC was described by Claussen as a crystalline substance with a melting point between 144 and 146 C. CBG of course exists as the neutral carboxylic acid noted above. As you see Radwan et al. describe it as a white amorphous powder. Even if you consider it decarboxylated, Gaoni and Mechoulam still pronounced it as having a discrete melting point between 51 and 53 C in 1964. CBN appears in white leaflets according to Adams 1940, with a discrete melting point between 76 and 77 C. I find that these substances would make things less adhesive, especially for someone who makes dry sift and complains of lack of adhesion. Your body is not nearly these temperatures. Have you compared the neutral acid forms of these chemicals with those they could spontaneously decarboxylate to overnight?

                              Comment


                                #45
                                My dry sift is pretty much just THC, most Cannabis grown in the West are THC rich and other Cannabinoid's poor. CBD, CBC, CBG, CBN are much less then .1% and they are all in the acid form on the living plant, in dried plant materials, as well as resin. You can heat materials to decarboxylate them, but it is very slow at room temperatures. It does not happen overnight. I have measured the THCA to THC decarboxylation in the past and even after two years at room temperatures most of the THCA was intact.
                                I don't quite understand your last question, compared by what means? Most of my analytical standards are not in the acid form. So I would have to extract the acid forms and I don't have a reason to do so that I can think of.

                                What about the terpenoids? Which help or hinder Budder making? Any ideas?
                                -SamS

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X