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    Satori F2's what could i expect?

    Just popped 10 satori F2's i made 3 maybe 4 years ago. wondering if it is possible for the breeder or anyone with some experience to give me an idea of what i might expect from these as far as phenos, flowering times, and any other info possible. i don't remember to many specific details about the plants used for crossing. i do remember the female being quite potent compared to others in the orignal seeds, had a very high bud to leaf ratio, strong stems, and good yield. also flowered for 9 weeks. could probably have been taken to 10 without issue, but was well done at 9. i didn't fully flower the selected male, just long enough to aquire pollen. i do remember he had very thick stem and branches, a strong smell even in veg, and was the last to show sex of the males i had at the time. maybe this isn't enough to really glean anything, as it is my limited understanding the F2 generation from a true F1 hybrid is usually quite varied. just hoping maybe mike has done some more generations with the line and can give me some possible things to look for. also grew out sadhu at the time, i was very impressed by both strains considering the price and plan to purchase some of his newer wares for testing purposes. these were just made for fun. thanks in advance to anyone who offers their thoughts.
    Last edited by Mister_D; 08-29-2013, 13:57.
    Satori F2 Vert Grow (Completed)
    https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=213034

    D's Vertical Redemption (Completed)
    https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....57#post4840157

    D's Gone Hunting (In limbo)
    https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....=1#post5941311

    Cannafornia Seeds Caliente Kong & Alaskan Thunder Kong Test Thread (Completed)
    https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....15#post6280215

    D's DIY Automated Vertical Feed and Drain System
    https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....90#post6323290

    ""Get It Fucking Done. It’s the truth, it’s the one thing you learn real fast in life is that nobody gives a fucking shit about excuses and the sooner you learn that nobody really gives a fuck about you, that you need to get off your ass and make shit happen then the better off everyone will be""". - Zakk Wylde

    #2
    Expect nice plants with some more variations IMHO.......
    peace
    boz
    My indoor Mandala grow :wave:
    :ying:Ninja farming guerilla style 2011 ĦɎɃ®ɨɗs Ƒ®Øɱ Ħ£ɭɭ :wave:

    Comment


      #3

      but 10 is not much to begin with, but hope for the best...
      Create your garden...

      Comment


        #4
        bozga and quiet riot i thank you for your replies. still hoping mandala mike will drop in and give me his perspective. i only started ten seeds to see what comes out of them, i have many more if i find promising phenos in these. i don't necessarily need any new genetics, i posses multiple high end and rare clones already. just enjoy popping some new seeds here and there to see what i find. all in fun so to speak. so mike where ya at man?
        Satori F2 Vert Grow (Completed)
        https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=213034

        D's Vertical Redemption (Completed)
        https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....57#post4840157

        D's Gone Hunting (In limbo)
        https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....=1#post5941311

        Cannafornia Seeds Caliente Kong & Alaskan Thunder Kong Test Thread (Completed)
        https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....15#post6280215

        D's DIY Automated Vertical Feed and Drain System
        https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....90#post6323290

        ""Get It Fucking Done. It’s the truth, it’s the one thing you learn real fast in life is that nobody gives a fucking shit about excuses and the sooner you learn that nobody really gives a fuck about you, that you need to get off your ass and make shit happen then the better off everyone will be""". - Zakk Wylde

        Comment


          #5
          Mister D- often the quality of the strain can be told in it's f2s. Personally, I feel that the quality of the f2s will depend on the parents you selected. If the plants you selected were excellent, the f2s should be excellent.

          Many people are four or five generations in on other strains without degredation- go for it. Make the seeds

          Many people remember the best weed they've ever smoked to be seeded also... Just a thought.

          Comment


            #6
            how's it looking MD?
            I am not the boss of you, just a fellow man with ideas to share. Im Just trying to help. << >>
            Truly Unique Smells Thread CHECK THEEEEESE OUT ....................BOO!
            "LOLA CLONING" FOR NOOBS & HARD TO CLONE MUMS My Hempy Hybrids; water less often
            Apollo11 Journey DrBudGreengenes Compact SOG

            Comment


              #7
              Here you are One Q, and any other interested parties for that matter I appoligize for the poor quality pictures, lost my camera cord so these were taken with the back up. There are nine of them, the tenth seed was killed by accident while transplanting from the paper towel. two of them are growing significantly faster/taller than the others, probably males. The remaining seven are all very uniform, only major difference being one of them has started the alternating branch structure assoiciated with females. They are being fed with General Hydro's Biothrive. Currently only using the grow and bloom as i am testing the line. they are being fed with 10ml/gal grow and 5ml/gal bloom, at every watering. Also noteworthy is i am currently trying the use of napa floor dry (calcined DE) in place of perlite with these plants. so far no problems to report. this was first brought to my attention by our own member mad librettist, though it has been used by bonsai growers for years with great success. if anyone is curious about this, do a search here on the mag or google for calcined DE. there are several threads that explain it's use in greater detail.
              Sorry about the small pictures, not sure how to get them to show up larger in my post. If someone could explain how i would be most greatfull. If not just click the pictures to enlarge them


              The Burn on the plant in the lower left of this picture is from direct contact with the t-5 bulbs these babies are vegging under.


              Satori F2 Vert Grow (Completed)
              https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=213034

              D's Vertical Redemption (Completed)
              https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....57#post4840157

              D's Gone Hunting (In limbo)
              https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....=1#post5941311

              Cannafornia Seeds Caliente Kong & Alaskan Thunder Kong Test Thread (Completed)
              https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....15#post6280215

              D's DIY Automated Vertical Feed and Drain System
              https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....90#post6323290

              ""Get It Fucking Done. It’s the truth, it’s the one thing you learn real fast in life is that nobody gives a fucking shit about excuses and the sooner you learn that nobody really gives a fuck about you, that you need to get off your ass and make shit happen then the better off everyone will be""". - Zakk Wylde

              Comment


                #8
                Those look good man.

                You shouldnt, imo, germ in towels. This is what I find is best for a few reasons.

                Fold and label paper towel. Put seeds in and wet, real wet, shake of the drips tho.
                Put them inna ziplock and somewhere cozy.
                Do this in the afternoon, and take them out the next morning. You dont need to get the tails out of the seed in the paper towels... and you see that you can kill a seed by doing so.

                Just let the seed absorb water and at most barely crack, then get them into the medium where there is a better O2 environment. Never had a good seed die on me this way. Not counting the seeds that were just not good to begin with and turn black before the go into the dirt. keep the dirt moist too duh
                I am not the boss of you, just a fellow man with ideas to share. Im Just trying to help. << >>
                Truly Unique Smells Thread CHECK THEEEEESE OUT ....................BOO!
                "LOLA CLONING" FOR NOOBS & HARD TO CLONE MUMS My Hempy Hybrids; water less often
                Apollo11 Journey DrBudGreengenes Compact SOG

                Comment


                  #9
                  Thanks One Q

                  I have never had much luck planting seeds directly into soil with no tails. When I have tried that method I put seeds in a shot glass of water for between 12-24 hours, then planted in beer cups of soil. It worked fine but germ ratios have always been higher, for me at least, when i used the paper towel method. i have successfull popped somewhere in the range of 500+ seeds this way and maybe killed 3-4, always due to me being a little to rough in my handling. i would love to be able to for go the paper towel all together, but if it's not broke i don't have much desire to fix it. Thinking I might turn this thread into my first grow diary, seems there may be some interest in mandala F2's after all. The plan right now is to veg these ladies another 5 or so weeks, then flip. Not currently happy with the growth rate of the T-5/ T-8 light mix they are vegging under. either going to put them under a 600w hps or possibly just add some more T-5 lights. Never used T-5's for anything other than rooting clones, so I am testing them. Also less than impressed with happy frog soil. I am used to my own custom mix of coco, ewc, perlite, compost, and some peat. however i moved recently and it wasn't feasible to bring my soil with me. when i started the current grow i wasn't familiar with the stores in my area and didn't have time to properly search out the usual ingredients. I have since sourced what i need to build a proper mix, these and all future clones will be placed in the usual mix. Barring any unforseen problems, perlite will be totally replaced with calcined DE in my normal soil mix.
                  Satori F2 Vert Grow (Completed)
                  https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=213034

                  D's Vertical Redemption (Completed)
                  https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....57#post4840157

                  D's Gone Hunting (In limbo)
                  https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....=1#post5941311

                  Cannafornia Seeds Caliente Kong & Alaskan Thunder Kong Test Thread (Completed)
                  https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....15#post6280215

                  D's DIY Automated Vertical Feed and Drain System
                  https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....90#post6323290

                  ""Get It Fucking Done. It’s the truth, it’s the one thing you learn real fast in life is that nobody gives a fucking shit about excuses and the sooner you learn that nobody really gives a fuck about you, that you need to get off your ass and make shit happen then the better off everyone will be""". - Zakk Wylde

                  Comment


                    #10
                    unless youre stuck on organics, REZ and Gr3atfullH3ad have narrowed the lucas formula down to 3 bottles (Micro Bloom and KB) and there's also the KISS method with Maxibloom at 1tsp max, but more like 3/4 tsp a gal. No problems, and you only need one bag of ferts, and MAYBE some epsom salt. one 5lb bag will last you FOR fkn EVER
                    I am not the boss of you, just a fellow man with ideas to share. Im Just trying to help. << >>
                    Truly Unique Smells Thread CHECK THEEEEESE OUT ....................BOO!
                    "LOLA CLONING" FOR NOOBS & HARD TO CLONE MUMS My Hempy Hybrids; water less often
                    Apollo11 Journey DrBudGreengenes Compact SOG

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Thank you again for your thoughts one Q, I always appreiciate constructive inputs. I have looked into the rezipe and gr3atfullh3ads takes on the lucas formula, both are obviously successfull methods one could use. I have done literally years of research on various forms of nutrients, and at some point I may again try out chem formulas. I started out as a chem grower and did very well at it, consistantly averaged 2 lbs per 1000w. Obviously those yields were after a good deal of learning and dialing my enviroment. However early into my research I found many people claiming a increase in smell and taste using organics. As quailty is ultimately what i am after, I was more than willing to sacrifice some yield if thats what it took for a better end product. I did alot more research into various organic methods and the fertilizers themselves, before finally deciding to use the bio-bizz line. I started with just the grow and bloom as i am doing with the biothrive line. with only two weeks use on a crop grown other wise completely chemically, i noticed a huge increase in taste and smell. These plants were clones I had run many times before, and as I generally run a perpetual garden I had fully chem samples on hand to compare. No other variables were changed at this time. Needless to say i've been organic every since. As for the other side of coin, yield, I never saw any drop or loss in average yield. In fact my yield has increased, I am now able to achieve 2+ lbs per 600w light. I don't attribute that to going organic at all, just that i have become a more skilled grower. My point being i disagree with the people that say you will take a hit in yields going organic. Again obvious to some, but for the sake others who may not know and read this, genetics, enviroment, and grower skill are the biggest contributors to improved yield and to a degree quality. I'm still trying to figure out what it is about organic nutes that increase the smell and taste of properly grown herb over properly grown chem herb. I read a post from rezdog on here once awhile back claiming the increase in taste was due to the impurities in organic ferts. If that were true, a specific taste would translate to whatever herb was grown with that particular fertilizer. I have not noticed any similarities amongst strains in taste grown with the same orgainic fertilizer. My current thinking is this: all high grade chem fertilizers are relatively pure and only contain what science has deemed "essential for life" nutrients, whereas orgainic nutes contain many other minerals not considered essential. Many of these non-essential minerals aren't understood very well, other than a plant doesn't show any outward signs of deficiency without them. I think these minerals may have roles in increasing the terpenes responsible for taste and smell in plants, possibly amongst other things. All a theory, but it makes sense to me with my research thus far. Whatever the case, I end up with tastier, smellier plants with orgainics so i stick with them.
                      Satori F2 Vert Grow (Completed)
                      https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=213034

                      D's Vertical Redemption (Completed)
                      https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....57#post4840157

                      D's Gone Hunting (In limbo)
                      https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....=1#post5941311

                      Cannafornia Seeds Caliente Kong & Alaskan Thunder Kong Test Thread (Completed)
                      https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....15#post6280215

                      D's DIY Automated Vertical Feed and Drain System
                      https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....90#post6323290

                      ""Get It Fucking Done. It’s the truth, it’s the one thing you learn real fast in life is that nobody gives a fucking shit about excuses and the sooner you learn that nobody really gives a fuck about you, that you need to get off your ass and make shit happen then the better off everyone will be""". - Zakk Wylde

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Also just wanted add, I am the type of grower who must always experiment with different things. I have been more than satisfied with the bio-bizz line, aside from the price. Though the results easily justify the cost. However i try to keep an open mind about things on my quest for the best quality. The bio thrive line caught my eye for several reasons, so i'm giving it a go. Thus far i'm am pleased with the results, though I am still dialing it in to my liking. I tried following the mfc. recommended schedule for part of a run that is currently flowering, not impressed. I have since used the cannastats calculator to develop a profile more to my liking, that is the reason for use of grow and bloom mixed during the veg phase. I will continue to feed this schedule at every watering until 3 weeks prior to harvest, when i will switch to pure ro or ph adjusted water. The reason for choosing this particular mix is, I used the same profile with chem nutes for years with great success.
                        Satori F2 Vert Grow (Completed)
                        https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=213034

                        D's Vertical Redemption (Completed)
                        https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....57#post4840157

                        D's Gone Hunting (In limbo)
                        https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....=1#post5941311

                        Cannafornia Seeds Caliente Kong & Alaskan Thunder Kong Test Thread (Completed)
                        https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....15#post6280215

                        D's DIY Automated Vertical Feed and Drain System
                        https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....90#post6323290

                        ""Get It Fucking Done. It’s the truth, it’s the one thing you learn real fast in life is that nobody gives a fucking shit about excuses and the sooner you learn that nobody really gives a fuck about you, that you need to get off your ass and make shit happen then the better off everyone will be""". - Zakk Wylde

                        Comment


                          #13
                          great posts. All this from BioBizz... I will have to check themout Thanks
                          I am not the boss of you, just a fellow man with ideas to share. Im Just trying to help. << >>
                          Truly Unique Smells Thread CHECK THEEEEESE OUT ....................BOO!
                          "LOLA CLONING" FOR NOOBS & HARD TO CLONE MUMS My Hempy Hybrids; water less often
                          Apollo11 Journey DrBudGreengenes Compact SOG

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Bio-Bizz is an extremely clean nute. What I mean by that is most fertilizers on the market, weather organic or chemical, contain varying degrees of heavy metals (arsonic, cadium, mercury etc). These are toxic to humans, and though the research done isn't fully conclusive (not alot of research has been done specificly on cannabis, but tobacco etc are similar enough for a comparison.) Many of these metals can be vaporized and inhaled while smoking. This may not be a concern to some, but my meds go to very sick people. Some with lung cancer, auto immune, nerve diseases etc. As these heavy metals are considered neurotoxins and/or carcinogens, I feel it is my responisblity to keep my meds as clean as possible for their sake and my own. Now the real point of why i wanted to post, my feeding schedule for bio-bizz nutes. As i run a perptual garden mixing different nute ratios for every weeks growth would be a nightmare. Also I understand that both soil and soilless mediums accumulate nutes over a period of time, and use that to my advantage. I have done this very successfully with both organic and chem nutes. The lucas formula is merely one example of this methodology, also look into heath robinsons grows if you need further convincing. Sorry getting to the point, for veg growth mix 9ml per gallon of grow and 9ml per gallon alg-a-mic fed at every watering from root to start of flower. The alg-a-mic isn't a must, I started without it. However it does boost the flavor, as well as providing extra micro nutes that give the plant a health boost. At the first day of 12/12 simply add 12ml per gal of the bloom to the normal veg formula and contine to feed everyday until 3 weeks prior to harvest. For the final three weeks feed with nothing, but RO or ph adjusted tap water. This formula has been tested on everything from pure indicas, to pure sativas with no deficiencies or burn. I have always used tap water so i cannot say if cal/mag would need to be supplemented if using ro water. Also worth mentioning, this formula is designed for an inert medium (no fertilizer). If using something like ocean forest, simply use ph adjusted water until plants are hungry then feed per the schedule above.

                            Veg = 9ml per gal. grow + 9ml per gal. alg-a-mic (optional)
                            Bloom = 9ml per gal. grow + 9ml per gal. alg-a-mic (optional) + 12ml per gal. Bloom
                            Satori F2 Vert Grow (Completed)
                            https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=213034

                            D's Vertical Redemption (Completed)
                            https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....57#post4840157

                            D's Gone Hunting (In limbo)
                            https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....=1#post5941311

                            Cannafornia Seeds Caliente Kong & Alaskan Thunder Kong Test Thread (Completed)
                            https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....15#post6280215

                            D's DIY Automated Vertical Feed and Drain System
                            https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....90#post6323290

                            ""Get It Fucking Done. It’s the truth, it’s the one thing you learn real fast in life is that nobody gives a fucking shit about excuses and the sooner you learn that nobody really gives a fuck about you, that you need to get off your ass and make shit happen then the better off everyone will be""". - Zakk Wylde

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Alright 500 views, so I guess some of you are interested in how this turns out. Not much to see right now, but everyone likes pictures right? Having a small issue with this happy frog soil's ph being too low, taking steps to correct the problem. All in all the girls are happy, and starting to show a more impressive growth rate under the flouros. Though i'm not 100% sure, the two tallest plants I thought would be males are in fact females. It's odd though, both of them have a single (instead of the normal two) pistil sprouted on the newest branches. I tried to get a picture but my backup camera just isn't good enough for micro shots. Also one of the little ones is a trifoliate, hoping it is female as I love the branch structure. If anyone has any questions, comments, concerns, feel free to ask.

                              Group Shot:

                              Group Shot 2:

                              Group Shot 3:

                              Trifoliate: Little hard to see, but notice there are three branches at every node. First one I've ever had in my garden, hope it's female.

                              Couple individual plant shots:


                              Satori F2 Vert Grow (Completed)
                              https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=213034

                              D's Vertical Redemption (Completed)
                              https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....57#post4840157

                              D's Gone Hunting (In limbo)
                              https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....=1#post5941311

                              Cannafornia Seeds Caliente Kong & Alaskan Thunder Kong Test Thread (Completed)
                              https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....15#post6280215

                              D's DIY Automated Vertical Feed and Drain System
                              https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....90#post6323290

                              ""Get It Fucking Done. It’s the truth, it’s the one thing you learn real fast in life is that nobody gives a fucking shit about excuses and the sooner you learn that nobody really gives a fuck about you, that you need to get off your ass and make shit happen then the better off everyone will be""". - Zakk Wylde

                              Comment

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