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Tom Hill - Has Arisen -

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    One minute were are talking haze, the next afghans, then haze again. We're talking about x to auto, then degen Y. One minute were talking maths, then you're off on a mystical quantum Y. Now maths don't count, not even laws of probability. Give me logic, give me mechanisms, give me maths or even a complete theory, and I'll spend my nights on it. But I can't go with the god sometimes plays dice stuff. I need reality to have walls.
    When as men, our only guide to right and wrong is the ability or inability to act, we cannot truly call ourselves men.

    Copyrights on all photographic work are reserved

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      Originally posted by GMT View Post
      One minute were are talking haze, the next afghans, then haze again. We're talking about x to auto, then degen Y. One minute were talking maths, then you're off on a mystical quantum Y. Now maths don't count, not even laws of probability. Give me logic, give me mechanisms, give me maths or even a complete theory, and I'll spend my nights on it. But I can't go with the god sometimes plays dice stuff. I need reality to have walls.
      Am i mistaken in that you should have ability to put all of that shit together at the same time haha?

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        I know what you're pushing towards. But I don't accept that autosomes can overpower sex chromosomes. I accept they may not respond at times, but that's not degen Y. Nor is it X to auto. Its simply naughty auto. Nor do I accept that naughty auto can be beneficial. And I know your going to laugh and say tris are naughty auto, but its different.
        When as men, our only guide to right and wrong is the ability or inability to act, we cannot truly call ourselves men.

        Copyrights on all photographic work are reserved

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          Oh shit. A Christmas Story is on TBS right now... fuggoff,,, don't put your eye out i busy lol.

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            Commercial break GMT autosomes<sex chromosomes is what i been saying all along.

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              Then you're stuck on a fantasy degen Y that only you know about, but can't explain either the maths for nor the mechanism of. Come on Tom, you have to either put forward more than an assertion or accept that assertion maybe flawed.
              When as men, our only guide to right and wrong is the ability or inability to act, we cannot truly call ourselves men.

              Copyrights on all photographic work are reserved

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                I can explain it for you sweetheart but i can not understand it for you

                Spelt it out in like 5 different language now pal x:autosome can not does not will not behave in the same manner as degenerating y populations. I have seen grown observed and pondered both for nigh 4 decade. You still just messing about in your head about it all.

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                  Its not enough to say its different. Its not enough to say "I'm more experienced than you so I know better, believe me". Its not enough to say one thing shows different numerical outcomes. You don't have to understand it for me. But you have to understand it sufficiently for yourself to be able to explain it to someone else. And just saying no, or its different, doesn't do that.
                  The questions unanswered are
                  How does a healthy Y degenerate. Meiosis doesn't explain that in a reliable and replicable manner.
                  How does a degenerated Y pass itself onto offspring?
                  Answer either of those and I'll discuss it, I may even accept it. But at the moment I can't answer either of them. Can you?
                  When as men, our only guide to right and wrong is the ability or inability to act, we cannot truly call ourselves men.

                  Copyrights on all photographic work are reserved

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                    Tom, mate, all I'm saying is, offering sophestry as a talking point, is one thing. But offering it as an education, is another. It takes you out of the realm of scientist or craftsman, and enters you into the world of religious preacher. Remember the wisdom of Socrates, and join me in saying, I don't know. Then at least we have a common ground on which we can theorise.
                    When as men, our only guide to right and wrong is the ability or inability to act, we cannot truly call ourselves men.

                    Copyrights on all photographic work are reserved

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                      https://sci-hub.se/10.3389/fpls.2020.569958

                      Genetic Architecture of Flowering Time and Sex Determination in Hemp (Cannabis sativa L.): A Genome-Wide Association Study.
                      Petit, J., Salentijn, E. M. J., Paulo, M.-J., Denneboom, C., & Trindade, L. M.
                      Frontiers in Plant Science, 11.(2020).
                      doi:10.3389/fpls.2020.569958

                      I will add it to my IC BIB this week

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                        Originally posted by Tom Hill View Post
                        View Image

                        Oh shit. A Christmas Story is on TBS right now... fuggoff,,, don't put your eye out i busy lol.
                        Lol.... I'd have been proud at any age to have had an eye put out by those...

                        I'd be wearing my pirate's eye patch like a badge of honor...

                        ...
                        ...

                        Isn't Mother Nature grand !

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by GMT View Post
                          Its not enough to say its different. Its not enough to say "I'm more experienced than you so I know better, believe me". Its not enough to say one thing shows different numerical outcomes. You don't have to understand it for me. But you have to understand it sufficiently for yourself to be able to explain it to someone else. And just saying no, or its different, doesn't do that.
                          The questions unanswered are
                          How does a healthy Y degenerate. Meiosis doesn't explain that in a reliable and replicable manner.
                          How does a degenerated Y pass itself onto offspring?
                          Answer either of those and I'll discuss it, I may even accept it. But at the moment I can't answer either of them. Can you?
                          I am admittedly coming at it from a different angle than you ala eliminating the impossible. Seen you ask Sam in that other thread what he thinks may be the mechanism behind such an observation. The absence of intersex plants (and duh the presence of y markers) pretty much kills the x:autosome possibility sir. Not sure what else you think is left.

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                            Yeah, I saw that quote before you quoted it, but chose not to go trampling around in that thread. But after you quoted it, I thought I'd quietly ask for a little background to it. I'm about to wade through the paper he posted above. I've had a busy day today, so this is my first chance to sit and read.
                            You're right of course that x to auto doesn't provide those numbers without intersex plants breeding. In the absence of intersexed, x to auto does become a bit of a non starter as far as answers go. Like I said, I feel no shame in filling gaps in my knowledge with "I don't knows". I'll try to put some crazy theory together, but I'll label it as that.
                            When as men, our only guide to right and wrong is the ability or inability to act, we cannot truly call ourselves men.

                            Copyrights on all photographic work are reserved

                            Comment


                              Oh, well according to that paper they are X to auto. I guess the ratio of the (sex-det1) gene is in low supply within a line with 70% females. Probably through breeding selections.
                              When as men, our only guide to right and wrong is the ability or inability to act, we cannot truly call ourselves men.

                              Copyrights on all photographic work are reserved

                              Comment


                                I've still got to tare up my model of x to auto though. Still at least we know how it works now. The implication though is surely that breeding active Y to X to auto, will shift the probability of an individual seed from female to male. Not just to equalise but to favour.
                                When as men, our only guide to right and wrong is the ability or inability to act, we cannot truly call ourselves men.

                                Copyrights on all photographic work are reserved

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