Need help making a big decision

[Cadfael]

get a lawyer..... make a bulletproof contract that has raises, and their expectations of production, etc all figured in so they sign something as well..... dunno about the family thing. but id talk to the fam and a laywer......

This.

Your brother you can trust, but his partners? or who or what entity is running the show in 6 months/2 years?

Many a story has been heard of people who get the "golden ticket," financial backing, permitting, equipment.

Suddenly after 6 months or two years, they are out on their ass and the Entity owns everything.

I personally watched two young men, who were very good at their craft of extraction, get a new facility, 300k of equipment, was promised 100k/year jobs with profit sharing. They built the out the whole thing, worked the bugs out of the process, took less money than they were told (4k/mo) "until the biz was up and running" worked 16 hour days 6 days a week, and were promptly sacked after 12 months when it was running smoothly.

In the show Silicon Valley. i believe the term was "Brain Rape."

 

[GOT_BUD?]

Nevermind.

Other folks are already saying it. No need to pile on.

I will say this.

Twice this past year I was approached with similar "offers" that materialized into nothing. After doing a ton of leg work, things fizzled out. Everybody thinks that cannabis is the next gold rush. Then they really start to crunch numbers, and things don't look so attractive any more.

Imo, the best thing we growers in illegal states can do, is continue doing what we're doing where we're doing it. But prepare for the eventuality of going legit as a "craft" grower with a limited plant count where the only person in charge is you.

To the OP, you're already 3/4 of the way there because you own land. When Kentucky goes green, you'll be able to get up and running for the first wave and be able to hopefully make a name for yourself with a high quality and consistent product.

 

[Jack T.Ripper]

^^^
Don’t even waste the lawyers time until your brother and partners agree to at least double that salary and give you a stake in the company, 5% minimum.

A dream job ain’t worth shit if you can’t afford anything.

 

[DNM1]

Market research
5yr business plan if the capital wasn't there
Think yourself going into the bank asking for that loan
My approach, have to sell the idea ..... will I get the loan?
Working hours
Allienating yourself from family/home

 

[Ringodoggie]

Well, one thing for sure... you can always trust family. Especially when it comes to money. I mean... have you ever seen family fight over the possessions and money of a recently passed family member? Of course not. None of us have because it never happens. When it comes to money and family, family always comes first. Just ask anyone who's been there. LMAO


Here's my advice. Start a meth lab. Sell only to grade school children and hang around the schools handing out free samples. Believe me, your future with my scenario is way better than what you are setting yourself up for with your brother. At least with my scenario, you'll still have your brother as a friend.







.

 

[MountainBudz]

I would love to quote everyone individually, as there is so much to say. I agree with a lot of this and I disagree with a some, too. Very good key points and information has been brought about in the replies.

As for my decision, I am still not 100% decided, yet... Honestly, I can almost say that I likely will turn down the offer as politely as possible. Yes, it is my dream to get into the cannabiz and one day it may happen. I will likely tell him that I will be more than happy to work for him, once it is legalized here. And the guy that brought up the craft style operation, that is likely gonna be my thing. Just me and my wife. I want to grow and I want to breed. Those 2 things are my main goals.

As for the income he is offering me, all travel expenses, food, stay, etc would all be covered by him 100%. It would be straight pay, cash. However, that is only around $40k a year, which isn't too bad but after figuring it up I can do better here, blackmarketing things. I can double that easily with my setup and once outdoor is added into the equation i could easily triple it, maybe even more... My outdoor flower has always brought the same as my indoor, 95% of the time my outdoor passes as indoor "dro" "fire" "gas" lol... as they call it.

This whole thread actually made me think about a few things, priorities, plans, projects, etc.

For one, in order for me to triple the salary my brother had offered me I am going to have to get a perpetual setup going. I am going to get my setup back to how it used to be, harvesting ever 2.5 months. My issue for over a year now, is I have no veg room anymore after I got raided. For two, i need to to stay on top of odor control at all times, that's what got me popped. Had a fan go out and it just took one shit mouth asshole to drive by and report the odor of marijuana. There was really nothing I could have done to prevent it as it went out as I was sleeping, overnight. I guess i could have had an extra fan and filter scrubbing, so now i have 3 fans and filters going at all times in my flower room. I highly doubt i ever have to worry about my flower room being discovered as it is far far away from any passerbys and it is underground. Yes I know underground ops get discovered, but it's usually when there are snitch ass partners involved in it and someone isnt getting the piece of pie they are expecting out of the deal, or similar. Not my case, it's a one man operation and it always will be. But anyway, I need to get my veg room built.

I'm also gonna push it hard outdoors this year in the hills, gonna get things started soon, have everything lined up to go out early focusing on larger, fewer plants, instead of numbers. Numbers is something I had picked up on the last few years in the outdoor world, numbers overwhelm me and I am the type of person that has to put a lot of love and care into each plant individually. I can't do that with 300-400 plants anymore. My outdoor yields have suffered because of this as well as my timing and other key factors that is important for healthy plants. So this year, back to trees it is. I'll probably put out a bumper crop late in the year, a few "patches" as we call it around here... One of those things that if it does happen to be found, eradicated, stolen, etc it just simply wont really matter as I'll have my main stuff to look forward to.

Anyway, thanks a lot guys for the advice, opinions, experiences. I'll update again once I make my final decision. But for now, it's looking like ole MtnBudz will remain an outlaw....

 

[aridbud]

it's looking like ole MtnBudz will remain an outlaw....
Too many unknowns. Cannabis growing is hands on. V-e-r-y difficult to advise remotely. And the salary for the risk....not worth it, esp. either uprooting family or the amount of commuting. Others piped in....maybe for $85K a year, it might be tempting. And who is actually projecting FUTURE earnings? Saw it in CO, some doing ok, others were closed down. Regulations itself is a killer.

The underground will always remain stable.

 

[Bobby Boucher]

I'll take 500 a week sitting in the comfort of my armchair at home with my piano, my cats, and my family.

I was off making 3-4k a week running around like a chicken with my head cut off for years. Not worth it. Stress kills.

No amount of money could get me off my ass to do something I wouldn't do for free anymore. Call me stuck up, but if I'm not making at least 50 an hour, I'm either turning the job down or offering up my services pro-bono.

I lose a lot of time and money doing free work for people, but at least they know I respect myself and value my time enough to charge 100 an hour without batting an eye.

I would just say "Skype me whenever you have a question, day or night, and I'll answer it pro-bono. And if you make a million on my consultations, throw me a percentage."

My 2 cents.

 

[MarDog]

Sounds like you're pretty young and set up pretty well....No need to fix what isn't broke man. It would be cool to "help out" on Saturdays while they are setting up as there's so much to learn. So much is changing every year with canna laws and when they switch in your area, you'll be all ready to roll out the red carpet.

 

[forest.]

Im sure you will do the right thing , good luck!

 

[944s2]

Very best of luck whatever you decide Mountain Buds,,,
Sometimes all that glitters is not gold,,,s2

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

I would work consultation only. Extremely limited time on site, with planned return flight tickets in hand.

1. You will be working with people who do not understand growing. This puts a huge crimp on trying to explain why you need to spend X for Y result, or to prevent event Z.

2. What are the restrictions in the proposed growing state? How does this impact your personal growing style?

3. What's the largest sized operation you've personally run, and provided results which were the same each run? How many runs were you able to keep this up?

4. What is your past experience with training others to a specific task?

5. What options do they have for you to telecommute?

Theoretically you should be able to consult for them enough to get them running with a crew. High def cameras can be used, and occasional day trips, to keep things in line.

Ringdoggie is correct, you really don't want to spend much time away from your family. I really don't care how much it pays in fiat, commuting and long absences pay ridiculously little in family value and solidarity.

 

[BluesnChiefs]

To MountainBudz
Sounds like a great opportunity. I have lived my life with the realization that the best things in life come with taking chances/risks. If your wife supports the opportunity, then do it.

Having gone into business with friends/family, i would strongly suggest that everyone one with skin in the game put their expectations (for you and each other)in writing, that these be openly discussed and agreed upon, and put into writing. Clear and open communication in the beginning can help defuse or eliminate problems/miscommunications later.

And lastly, speaking of expectations, recent history has shown two things to be true: growing commercial is not like growing “outlaw”, and maintaining the level of quality you expect might be impossible. Second, until congress changes the laws, the present tax laws regarding cannabis businesses makes it extremely difficult to make an actual profit. I hope your brother and his financial backers have a good business plan.

Good luck.

In regards to your comment about tax laws making it extremely difficult to make a profit...am I the only one that believes there is a high possibility that most people or holding companies that have the capital requirements to open a legal mmj operation are using it to clean dirty money from other sources?


I mean after taxes and overhead I can not figure out how people think it is that profitable to own a mmj business. There is plenty of higher profit business models avilable that dont include mmj.

 

[sshz]

There's some good points made by everyone..........

1. Any top notch grower knows you need to be on site everyday, especially in a large facility. You cannot depend on others to have the knowledge or effort to do it right.

2. What are you expenses to stay near the grow- food, housing, gas, tolls, and time- $48K isn't a lot of money these days. I guess it really depends on what you are currently earning and compare.

3. I see the upside down the road but there are loads of what if's too.......... big money is enticing, but it's extremely difficult to run a successful operation with investors who have no knowledge about growing, pricing, distribution, regulations and fees, etc. Many of the big guys are suffering right now......... they better have very big bankrolls and don't expect a return right away, if at all the first year ot two.

4. The traveling is going to get tiring very quickly..........and what effect will it have on your family and kids- not good I imagine.

5. You'll be under a lot of pressure to perform. It's relatively easy to have success in a small operation. Big grows are a whole other thing and add in the pressure to produce a high grade product- it changes everything. Kind of takes the fun out it after awhile.

6. You have to consider you'll have issues with your brother at times. If it doesn't work out, will there be bad feelings? It can suck to work in a "family" business.

I could continue, I've been in a similar situation of sorts. I'm much happier doing my own grow, generating $60K tax free a year with no pressure at all. If I open my second room, it's been over $80K. There's much to consider, but you'll end up weighing the potential money vs. plenty of downsides.

If it was me, first thing I'd do is want to meet with the investors, talk about expectations and the ground rules of the business and grow. Personally, no amount of money is worth being away from the wife, kids, dog, my bed and home cooking- but that's just me. You will be away from home a lot more than you expect, bank on that.

 

[TychoMonolyth]

Is there an employment contract? There should be. All top level has one. I don't know how high your brother is, but sr. people would expect one.

Most master growers have been around the block growing weed for a while. Good luck.

 

[Norbyhaze2]

Do it man, but only if you are confident with your growing skills

 

[Dropped Cat]

Don't partner with a sibling, ever.

Unless you need some lessons about how family
will cross you, then blame you for their problems.

They'll whip you raw with the switch you give them.

lol

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Don't partner with a sibling, ever.

Unless you need some lessons about how family
will cross you, then blame you for their problems.

They'll whip you raw with the switch you give them.

lol

True. The unfortunate truths are, most families are dysfunctional and it gets worse when you add money/power. Get it in writing. Though a contract still does not record the variables of intent between the parties involved. If it did, 99% of lawsuits would never reach court.

Is this relative known for business acumen, emotional and economic stability? Are they known for successfully setting up other businesses, or running similar businesses in the past? After A64 passed in Colorado, EVERYONE had relatives who suddenly wanted to be growers, or set up dispensaries, or hire relatives like yourself for a grow op. Craigslist was full of nearly new equipment for years, from failed grow businesses. I'm sure more than a few were family dispute, and most were 'partner' disputes. Money/Success blinds people so quick it's not funny.

Look at the skill sets, look at the experience. Without those, you're literally walking into a cluster...

 

[santamartagold]

There are many good suggestions here. The one thing I would focus on is finding out who all the partners in the deal and who is calling the shots ("managing partner"). The money is not great and what you could ask for is an ownership interest that increases as time goes.
Maybe 5% after the first year, 10% after the second year etc...

Good luck.

 

[@hempy]

The thing people need to consider if they are going into the Legal weed industry is the over supply of cannabis that exists now in the legal states.I have been following it for some time we saw the writing on the wall 2 years ago that corporate cannabis was going to take a big hit and it is right now and will continue.

Going by what i have read and seen on YouTube in the way of interviews by people in the industry what will be the future is a cottage industry.A lot of them have down scaled.

Any chance to go legal is a good thing making a living from what you love is as good ass it gets so a tuff call.