Water Questions

I have no idea how to measure the tap water ppm / EC b/c I lack a meter. I have noticed a few things and I have done pH tests, so perhaps someone can shed some light on this. Brita water (one filtration) comes out to a pH of 6. Tap water is a bit above neutral I believe (Since the color was darker than the color for 7 but not nearly 8, I am using a GH pH test kit). Boiling the tap water got me a pH of exactly 7. I am having some severe problems with a lot of my seedlings where the outer parts of the leaves become greenish brown and brittle. It seems to creep inwards. I am unsure of the cause, but perhaps it is chlorine or....something. I want to try to correct the pH issue I believe I have first. So, should I use brita water, tap water, or boiled water? I am using promix bx with extra perlite, no fertilizers. Strain is kalichakra if that helps.

Peace,
~Skylined

What type water have you given the seedlings up to this point? Any pictures?
They should get straight tap water no filters. My water is an even 7, I grow in Pro-Mix.

So I'm guessing the boiled water then since it is necessary to remove chlorine somehow (I'm pretty sure it's not chloramine although this summer I'm damn well getting a fucking water analysis). The boiled water is also closer to seven than the water straight out of tap. I was giving the seedlings brita water / unknown water. Is it bad for the water to be sitting in the bottle for weeks / months?

Peace,
~Skylined
(edit - i am using one gallon bottles, I'm not sure if the small opening has anything to do with chlorine evaporation as opposed to letting water sit in a kitchen pot or something).

TRY BUBBLLING YOUR WATER WITH AN AIR pump and STONE FOR A FISH TANK , BUBBLE FOR 24 HOURS WITH THE LID OFF whatever its in.this is TO ReMOVE CHOLRINE, and add o2 and co2 to the rootzone of you plants.

I unfortunately lack an airstone, that's why I was asking if boiling would accomplish the same thing. Will it? Also, I am using pro-mix, not hydroponics, so I don't have a reservoir at all, I just use one gallon plastic bottles.

Peace,
~Skylined

if you can get a five gallon bucket and let your water set wtih the lid off but in the dark at least one day but not more than a week cause without the airstone it will get nasty . the light helps alge grow in the water so thats why needs to be dark. keeps it fresher longer.
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I lived in a mining town were we had ARSNIC in our tap well water from all the tons of TNT "nitro" the N part of the tnt is still around seeping into all the water tables and the cancer and tumor rates are outraguos.along with other serous aliments .......i nver drank the water and was wary of the shower and brushing my teeth.

WHen in this place i used R/O ? pitcher for drinking water. is this the brita you speak of? they do work for most contamites. but like a condom it stops everthing danm near but AIDS. so boil that shit. than filter it so only bioled "clean " water ever toches your filter im guesssing increasing effencitcy...

HairyPlumz said:

TRY BUBBLLING YOUR WATER WITH AN AIR pump and STONE FOR A FISH TANK , BUBBLE FOR 24 HOURS WITH THE LID OFF whatever its in.this is TO ReMOVE CHOLRINE, and add o2 and co2 to the rootzone of you plants.

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just about to say the same thing, gotta bubble that water people!!! britta really wont due you much good anyway. teh most you really have to worry about with waterings is pH and chlorine.

i just pH'ed my res and it was darker than 8, so im guessing it may have been around 9-.9.5 tops. beginning at at the 9ish or so pH, i used 5cc of vinegar per gallon and that brought me to a 5.5-6 arena to work/waer with. so i have learned that 5cc of vinegar per gl of water would get me to that pH of 5.5 -6 starting from around 9ish.

Wow....So it looks like old ass water might have been the cause of the ailments I am seeing. The thing is, the Brita takes the pH down a full notch and I don't know why. I am therefore hesistant to use it before I can figure this out. Luckily I live out in the boonies (relatively) in a small college town with very little around it so I don't think there's too much pollution per se. I don't know if Brita is an RO filter, shouldn't RO water come out to exactly neutral pH? I'm not sure why it comes out to be 6. Any ideas on why this occurs? Leaving it to evaporate in a bucket for 24-48 hours sounds like a plan though.

Peace,
~Skylined
(edit- I water my regular plants with water direct from the tap and I have absolutely no problems )

Tap Water Only - I don't pH & it doesn't sit longer than 5 minutes, a few hours would be fine but I don't have time for that nonsense. Unless you have some wildly funky water use straight tap water.

Using the Brita hurt your seedlings.

I don't think my water is wild and funky. And since pro-mix is mostly peat doesn't that kick the pH down considerably? So if my water had between 7 and 7.5 it would supply magnesium, calcium, and keep the soil pH more stable. Am I correct in this thinking? I am also strongly considering investing in this air stone thing...how much would they cost?

Peace,
~Skylined

Old water is garbage, don't use it. Don't drink water from plastic bottles that have been sitting for long periods of time either.

The Pro-Mix is a soil less mix & it'll buffer your 7.5 without a problem exactly where it should be. You've chosen the simplest way to grow but you're over thinking it. There's no need to pH with Pro-Mix with your water IMO. Seedlings will have plenty with their cotyledon's & tap water.

When I start feedings with fish emulsion they'll get that with every watering. One full dose followed with the next 2 waterings @ 10-25% doses than back to full dose etc. Than as they enter Bloom I start 50-50 fish & PBP bloom for the first 2-3 weeks every watering using the same method 1 full dose followed by 2 - 10-25% doses than I give a bud booster like PK-13/14 with the PBP bloom every watering starting from the 4th week using a 1/4 dose - ending in the 6th with a full dose. Than I use the 10-25% leaching solution of PBP bloom for a flush in the 7th week, last couple waterings I'll give straight water. I use some molasses with all bloom ferts. I also add some Epsom's salt to the mix for extra MG. The combination of nutrients also help in keeping my pH swing in check.

about 2 bucks online the pump can be the smallest you can find so if you order that online it should be cheap. the pet stores sell thos all day long so dont trip if you just get it from one of those places it may be faster than shipping ........

stay away from hydro stores. they make a profile for customers "when" they are wathcing they take notes on number of vists, purchases made and routine cycles of supplies "ie' Cos bottles exchange and pro mix bag every 55 days aint good and has leed to a few fellow icmagers incarseratons.............

i seen pics on the news of this guy scott petterson killed his wife an unborn chilled and dumped them in the ocean on a fishing trip then reported her missing.....

THEY PUT CAMERAS IN THE STREET LIGHTS AROUND HIS HOUSE , talk about full survallance all the time .......this went on for months.

Can your local hydro store have cameara in the street light? has anyone on icmag ever got busted for going to the H store......u tell me?

HairyPlumz said:

i seen pics on the news of this guy scott petterson killed his wife an unborn chilled and dumped them in the ocean on a fishing trip then reported her missing.....

THEY PUT CAMERAS IN THE STREET LIGHTS AROUND HIS HOUSE , talk about full survallance all the time .......this went on for months.

Can your local hydro store have cameara in the street light? has anyone on icmag ever got busted for going to the H store......u tell me?

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People actually grow other things indoors. They be wasting mega $$$ chasing people who garden down. Keep your eyes peeled though.

thats all im saying they do watch "sumtimes," and profile people in and out on every detail of there visit' or vistits. the profile once put together on individuals can be used to obtain warrants for you trash, phone calls, bank statments and home.
its happend befor just play safe.


ps. i go to wall mart and buy shop lights, potters, soil, bone meal , blood meal, lime ,fish emolsin,perlite, water hose, a box of zingers and when they ring it all up i ask for like ten packs of zig zags and a few lighters . I never had a problem yet ,

My thoughts... You never know what the local utility is putting in the tap water. They test the heck out of it, and there are frequently big variations in what's coming out of the ground or reservoir, which means there can be big variations in which chemicals they dump into it. Usually fluctuates seasonally, with rainfall, turbidity etc. Things which are almost always in your water are fluoride and CHLORINE. Most strains don't do well with chlorine, but I've heard that if you let it stand overnight or longer the chlorine dissipates (don't know, I've got spring water, but even that ph fluctuates). I've had pals who have had major problems with tap water. Small grows can spend a few bucks on bottled water at the supermarket, catch rainwater, or just let the water stand for a while.
Pick up a cheapo aquarium bubbler at WalMart for under $10, great investment.

This is what I was thinking of doing. For now, I'm going to let the water stand in a non-lit place for about 24 hours. The pH fluctuates between (I estimate) 7 and 7.2-7.5. Unfortunately I really can't be hauling in ten gallons + of spring water per week, simply not practical. Once I pick up the bubblers this weekend I oughtta be all set. They really sell em at wal-mart eh? That's good to know, they'll be cheap.

Peace,
~Skylined

Hey everyone!!

I hope this comes out right since I just did a bowl of my SSH from last grow I hope y'all have a sense of humor to go along with a serious discussion to save this guys grow. OK?

SirGrassaLot: It is me Pedro48 from before in my new nick. I think we've had some discussion before.

I know what you do works for you, but I do also believe you are lucky. And so I'm going to offer this fellow another opinion based on my long years as a homeowner/gardener/houseplant grower/ and recent weed grower .Sheeseesh. That was awful.

Anyway I also disagree with some of my fellow organic growers on that forum when it comes to pH and how to think about it.

Skylined:

1st I'm a old bowhunter and being "skylined" is not a very good thing!! hehehehe. Frigging mule deer here can see you over a mile away as it is. "Skylined" those mulies can see you for miles.

OK

If your seedlings survive whatever they are in now, here is what I recommend you put them in...It is nothing fancy and all you need is probably at WallyWorld.

And YES, the advice on airstones is right on. You really need to aerate your water no matter the source. I keep a 5 gallon bucket going 24/7 with an airstone. I use this water for making everything I put on my plants. I grow organically but the principles of watering are the same. I also use water right out of the bathtub faucet. Use the COLDest setting. Why? The hotter the water , the less dissolved Oxygen it contains....yes you'll aerate it again but use COLD to begin with....do it for me. My tap water's pH runs 7.0-7.3 or so and PPM's are usually about 70-80PPM, most of which is Calcium with lesser amounts of Iron and Magnesium. I ignore those minerals in the water when I make up my soil mixes and nutrients. Yep they are there and MAYBE they would be OK for my plants needs, but I wouldn't and DO NOT bet on it. I treat my water as if it were sterile.

pH being 7.0-7.3 is fine too. Why? Because when I make up my soil mix(soiless actually) I add 2 Tbls/gallon of Dolomite lime. And THAT is the reason I don't worry about pH. I KNOW I have properly prepared my soil by adding lime to buffer it...along with the humates, etc in the organic content of the mix. I just gave one of my SSH plants a feeding of 2Tbls/gallon of EJ Flower. pH was 3-3.5, pretty acid. Poured it right on, done it for several grows now late in flower. That plant is thriving as we speak. For those who put a lot of store in pH "runoff" values, the runoff was 6-7. I'm not a believer in runoff pH telling you much. Bottom line is if you make a good soil, lime it properly, and use a sensible nutrient and watering regime...THEN you can relax a little regarding pH. You can never ignore pH IMO, however if you prepare properly, THEN and only then, can you "ignore" pH.

The reason *I* don't worry about my tapwaters pH is the same reason *U* shouldn't worry about your tapwaters pH. And that reason is:

Every time you use any of that bubbled tapwater you will be adding something to it...or you should be. And most all of those "somethings" will be acidic. If you are adding nutrients, they are nearly always going to bring the pH down. ALL do/have in own my experience. If you're just watering, you can bring the pH down by adding something like Liquid Karma. Or you can use very small amounts of a nutrient. Sometimes I use Earth Juice Grow or Flower to "pH" my water when I'm not actually feeding. You don't need much of either to bring the water's pH below 7.0 And it is absolutely essential that you always ensure that any time you put a water solution on your plants...the pH MUST be less than 7.0 That is not a debatable issue for me. Now as I said, I used EJ at a pH of 3. Why didn't I bring it up to say 6.5? It's not necessary, and I don't like using pH up crap like Potassium Hydroxide( a form of lye) to bring it up.

I would strongly advise you to go over and look at the soilmaking threads on the Organics Forum....even if you are goingt to do a chem fert grow. There is lots of good info over there on soils, pH watering etc. It's easier than floundering around over here getting piecemeal, suspect advice. No need to "reinvent the wheel" so to speak.

I need to take a break. I type with 3 fingers LOL!!

jj48


EDIT:

Geez, I forgot about soil.
Skylined, get some what I call "plain jane" soil mix at WalMart. Plain Jane soil/potting mix is the stuff that does NOT have time release ferts in it. If you see anything like "Feeds for 3 months" don't buy it. It might read something like 50% compost 25% Sphagnum peat moss, 10% coco coir, 15% perlite. Just tell them you want a potting soil with no time release ferts. maybe you'll get someone who actually knows something. We hope so. You want to get some perlite. Perlite, IMO, should make up 1/3 of the final soil mix volume. If you buy a 1.5 cubic foot bag(about 12 gallons) and use the whole thing, you'll need 6 gallons of perlite 12=6=18 6/18 = 33%perlite. If the mix has more than 10% already in it, then you can use a bit less, but I like perlite.

Why so much perlite? Well draining soils are much less hassle to maintain for one. Your plants roots really like light, airey soils too. It is critical that your soil drain well so that air spaces open up ASAP. Roots MUST have that air ASAP. You'll also find that well draining soils have fewer salt build up problems (in a chem grow). Soil that remains too wet for too long tends to acidify more quickly than soils that don't drain well.

And don't forget that dolomite lime. In the above example of 18 gallons total mix volume...you need about 36 Tablespoons, or about 2 cups(most recommend 1cup/ft3 or 2Tbls/gallon when working in small volumes.)

jj48 said:

SirGrassaLot: It is me Pedro48 from before in my new nick. I think we've had some discussion before.

I know what you do works for you, but I do also believe you are lucky. And so I'm going to offer this fellow another opinion based on my long years as a homeowner/gardener/houseplant grower/ and recent weed grower .Sheeseesh. That was awful.

Click to expand...

I didn't just invent this method of growing it was taught to Canadians by Organized crime mainly the Ontario Bikers & Asian Gangs. Pro-Mix BX or HP is perfect for Cannabis out of the bale as is the Sunshine mix 4. All you have to do is remember to feed & water, that's it. Not hard at all to follow. Having to pH is totally unnecessary unless you're growing for the perfect crop. You would also need to be meticulous about every other detail. I want the simplest way to grow.

You can make your mixes & growing schedules as complicated as you like. I'm sure they'll work too. I've laid out the simplest way to grow. This suits my style as I've never grown any other plants than Cannabis.