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heatherlonglee

Active member
Perfect pH
Thursday, April 25, 2013
A Word About pH and Nutrition

Ideal pH: The starting pH range for most PRO-MIX products is between 5.4-5.9. After watering and using fertilizer, the pH of the PRO-MIX is fluid and can change. Ideal pH for most crops is 5.5-6.2. If pH is higher, micronutrients become unavailable to the plant causing yellowing or distortion in new leaves. If the pH of the growing medium is lower, micronutrients are more available and if taken up in excessive quantities can cause leaf edge burn on the lower leaves.

Testing the pH of a crop: pH is best measured using the saturated media extract method (growing medium is removed from the root ball, distilled water is added to saturate the growing medium sample and the pH and salts are tested from the mud after 30 minutes). Some growers use a pour thru method, where a measured volume of distilled water is applied to the growing medium and the leachate (run-thru) is collected, but it is only as accurate as the amount leachate that comes out from the bottom of the container. If too much comes out, the pH and salts will be diluted and will not accurately reflect the levels in the growing medium. If too little comes out, the salts are concentrated and the pH is often unreliable, too. To avoid fluctuations, make sure the procedure is done the same way each time and measured accurately.

Maintaining the pH of PRO-MIX : There is a lot of misconception about the effects of ‘water pH’ on the pH of PRO-MIX. The truth is that the pH of the water has no bearing on the pH of the PRO-MIX. In other words, if the pH of the water is 5.5, that does not mean the pH of the PRO-MIX will be 5.5 overtime. So what influences the pH of the PRO-MIX?

Bicarbonates: Think of the bicarbonates in the water as dissolved limestone. If it is low (<50 ppm HCO3), then the pH of the PRO-MIX will not change much because there is little limestone supplied at very watering. If the bicarbonates are high >180 ppm HCO3, the media is being limed at every. This causes the pH of the PRO-MIX to rise to unacceptable levels (above 6.5), even if the pH of the water is 5.5. Ultimately the goal is to match up the fertilizer with the bicarbonates within the water.
Many companies recommend using water that has passed through a reverse osmosis unit. Often this is an unnecessary step, but it will filter out most of the bicarbonates from the water as well as beneficial calcium and magnesium. If the unit works properly, it will reduce the bicarbonates in the water to undesirable low levels. If you use a R.O. unit, it is best to blend the water R.O. water with some (505) of the source water to achieve a desirable bicarbonate level.

Fertilizer: Fertilizer elements that are absorbed by plant roots have an electrical charge. The plant root zone has to maintain its neutral electrical charge. For plant roots to uptake electrically charged nutrients, the root system must give off and exchange elements of the same charge. Therefore, for the plant’s roots to absorb positively charged ammonium, potassium, calcium or magnesium, the roots must give off hydrogen. Hydrogen is acid and will reduce the pH of the growing medium. If the root systems absorbs nitrate, phosphate and/or sulfate, it will release off negatively charged alkaline hydroxides – which increases the pH of the growing medium.
Of these elements, nitrogen is the only one that can have an acidic (ammonium and urea) or alkaline (nitrate) reaction with the plant roots. The ratio of these nitrogen forms within the fertilizer dictates whether the fertilizer is potentially acidic or alkaline, depending on how it is absorbed and reacts with plant root systems. As a guide, many fertilizer manufacturers will list the fertilizer’s “potential acidity” or “potential basicity” which indicates how much acid or base is added to the growing medium by the plant roots. Most growers will have their water tested and then match the fertilizer to the water quality. This matching will minimize pH fluctuations within the growing medium.

Having said all this, if the water has been processed through a reverse osmosis unit it most likely will have a slight change effect on the pH of the growing medium. However, any fertilizer will have a significant influence on the pH of the PRO-MIX. The fertilizer used should supply all 13 elements (N, P, K, Ca, Mg, SO4, Fe, Mn, B, Cu, Zn, Mo) and the fertilizer’s should provide potential acidity or potential basicity. Without this information, it is difficult to determine where the pH of the growing medium will go long term.

Copy and pasted from
www.pthorticulture.com/en/training-center/perfect-ph/
 
So what should the PH of your water be after you mix nutrients? I usually aim for 6.5 and I'm in soil. Mostly, light warrior, coco and 1/4 subcools super soil.

What is the PH of your water for people in soil?????
Post your PH of your water. Should it be below 6.2 so everything is available???
 

heatherlonglee

Active member
This only applies to PRO-MIX in my understanding. This is why you can feed with a ph buffered nutrient like Maxi-Bloom without the need to ph ever. I've been saying this works not knowing why for years now.

PRO-MIX keeps the ph in range all by itself unless you dump to much fertilizer or bicarbonates into the mix.
 

Rolldaddy

Member
I think the plain simple way to explain what PH level should be used when feeding into promix containers.

To a Answer your question when running promix I fluctuate the ph throughout my run from 6.0-6.5. And changing it about a point each feed
 

Jonnysact

Member
I use pro mix seedling starter.

On my first grow, I was using water ph'ed at around 6.3. Within a few weeks, I was getting severe deficiencies. Rust spots were popping up and eating away my leaves.

I then started treating it like hydro and gave it ph of 5.4 to 5.2. My stems went from purple to green, the leaves became lush and green and deficiencies went away.

So what's the consensus here? so much mixed information it's driving me a little crazy :(
 

Jonnysact

Member
Are you trolling me delta? The thread topic is about pro mix, and since it's a soil less medium that is treated like hydro.... Anywho, back to the question at hand.
 

TheArchitect

Member
Veteran
PH?

Haven't tested it in forever.

Found it to be pointless except for certain foliar sprays and as a tool to monitor reservoir health ie. If it starts spiking one way or another it could be a warning of pathogens.

Even when I ran rdwc I never adjusted pH, it usually found its balance at 6.4.

Never once did I have a problem wrt pH.

Now I don't even have a working meter.

Tap water and cns17 at 2.1-2.4 ec.

If I'm in dwc I use ro water and jacks at 1.2-1.6 ec
 

delta9nxs

No Jive Productions
Veteran
Are you trolling me delta? The thread topic is about pro mix, and since it's a soil less medium that is treated like hydro.... Anywho, back to the question at hand.

no, i wouldn't do that. i didn't realize pro-mix was totally soil less. my mistake, sorry! carry on!
 

Jonnysact

Member
Hehe it's ok. I think there are many frustrated users her, myself included, who don't necessarily have a definitive answer to our question, "what is the ideal PH when growing in Pro Mix?"

So many conflicting opinions online. I was getting deficiencies with my first plant. Started her out with 6.0 and within a few weeks, rust spots on the leaves as well as purple stems. Dropped the PH down to hydro level, around 5.3, which according to a chart showed optimal nutrient availability for hydro, and new stems were growing green, even the purple stems gained some green and rust spots vanished.

Now, week 6 into flowering, I'm seeing deficiencies again. Sugar leaves on my BC Big Bud are gaining purple patches and runoff is quite low. Still in the midst of fixing it.

Now on my second grow, white window, I used the same pro mix seedling starter, and again mixed it half half with perlite, planted 4 new babies in there, watered them with 5.4 PH and although they have been over watered some, are wilting, but the leaves are also curling some leaving me to think that I have PH issues... Hmmm.
 

aridbud

automeister
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Many DIY soiless recipes out there. Easy to use, adding amendments along the way. pH is multifaceted...water, medium.
 

T_B_M

Member
Hehe it's ok. I think there are many frustrated users her, myself included, who don't necessarily have a definitive answer to our question, "what is the ideal PH when growing in Pro Mix?"

So many conflicting opinions online. I was getting deficiencies with my first plant. Started her out with 6.0 and within a few weeks, rust spots on the leaves as well as purple stems. Dropped the PH down to hydro level, around 5.3, which according to a chart showed optimal nutrient availability for hydro, and new stems were growing green, even the purple stems gained some green and rust spots vanished.

Now, week 6 into flowering, I'm seeing deficiencies again. Sugar leaves on my BC Big Bud are gaining purple patches and runoff is quite low. Still in the midst of fixing it.

Now on my second grow, white window, I used the same pro mix seedling starter, and again mixed it half half with perlite, planted 4 new babies in there, watered them with 5.4 PH and although they have been over watered some, are wilting, but the leaves are also curling some leaving me to think that I have PH issues... Hmmm.

I noticed the same thing with my grows in Pro-mix. I do a rotation cycle and have new plants in the rotation every 3 weeks. One run would do great, no signs of deficiency or pH problems. Then the very next set will get either yellow or start getting sad and droopy a couple weeks into flower. After some experimentation I narrowed it down to a possible water supply issue. My water wants to be 7.0 pH no matter what I do to it. When I mix a gallon of my tap water with nutes, the pH is at 6.5-6.8. If I use pH down and get it to 5.9, the very next day it is back up to 6.8. I bought some distiller water and when I mix the same nutes the pH stays around 6.0-6.1. I think my water is the cause of my random lockout issues. I have an RO-DI filter on the way to remove a lot of the bicarbonates and excess crap from my tap water. My tap comes out at 7.0 pH with 330 ppm.

From what I've seen the medium wants to stay at its pH, so starting lower at 5.2 seems logical since the pro-mix will want to stay at its 5.6-5.9 pH.

After running out of botanic are, I changed my nutes to GH Flora series and will be feeding every watering with 20-25% runoff. Runoff is also important with pro-mix. If you see pH drifting up higher than 6.0 you have excess salts and precipitates in the medium.
 
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G.O.T.

Member
some guys swear by not over watering pro mix, IE no runoff ...

i always thought runoff was good, but less water each feed is good too... seems there is many ways to skin the pro mix cat
 

catalyte

Active member
Veteran
watering Pro-Mix daily? pH under 6.0 ??? makes me wonder if im using the same stuff as you guys after reading this thread?

pH 6.0-6.5 is good from my experience and watering only when the container is light.
 
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